Moto-East Vortech BRZ preliminary results, 263 WHP!

[King Tut]

Originally Posted by Dezoris

Too much emphasis is placed on these dyno plots.

I agree. I think people are failing to notice that somehow a stock BRZ makes 175 hp on this dyno which is the highest I have ever seen even on a Dynojet. That is only a 12.5% drivetrain loss.

[Adeets]

There's alot of the words "dyno plot" being used when I think the words "dyno numbers" or dyno HP" is ment.

[NorseLegend]

Originally Posted by Sportsguy83

Keep in mind the car has Borla Headers and Catback. Still AWESOME numbers, but its not a stock car +SC.

True, but I was planning headers/exhaust for when I get mine anyhow :P

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by NorseLegend

True, but I was planning headers/exhaust for when I get mine anyhow :P

Very good! I'm sure it will be a blast!

[Dezoris]

All that you see on this forum recently is: "Hey look at me I can make XXXXX HP"
Then you see like mentioned a baseline dyno showing a 175HP, really?

I'd say read between the lines however those lines are becoming increasingly blurred with a mess of all this info from vendors.

[Foobar]

Originally Posted by Dezoris

All that you see on this forum recently is: "Hey look at me I can make XXXXX HP"
Then you see like mentioned a baseline dyno showing a 175HP, really?

I'd say read between the lines however those lines are becoming increasingly blurred with a mess of all this info from vendors.

Well futher complicating the issue is the car used to get the 175HP baseline wasn't even the same car that received the upgrade. I'd have much rather seen the car before upgrade and after SC but I realize that's not always feasible. At this point I'm more interested in the curves than the numbers. If that peak keeps climbing to redline, instead of doing some weird stuff at 6.5K, then this looks promising.

[SnapOv3st3r]

Well, you shouldn't be concerned with the actual value of the baseline and the after value of the S/C. But rather the amount of whp gained from the mod. That's what dyno's are for.

[Foobar]

Originally Posted by SnapOv3st3r

Well, you shouldn't be concerned with the actual value of the baseline and the after value of the S/C. But rather the amount of whp gained from the mod. That's what dyno's are for.

That's sounds like a contradiction to me, what am I missing here? Or are you basically saying we should have seen the car before S/C as the baseline and not some stock car fresh off the lot?

[jamesm]

175whp is pretty optimistic for a stock 86.

[buditjoenawan]

I can't be the only one here who ignores peak hp numbers and look at the torque curve. Having said that, did a stock car put down 141lb-ft of torque? That's only 10lb-ft less than it is rated at the crank. That is one strong car, especially on 92 octane. Or should we scale the whole thing back by a set percentage?

budi

[SnapOv3st3r]

Originally Posted by Foobar

That's sounds like a contradiction to me, what am I missing here? Or are you basically saying we should have seen the car before S/C as the baseline and not some stock car fresh off the lot?

One dyno may show 160whp for example and then a F/I system gets added and it then dyno's 250whp.

Another car on a different dyno showing 175whp for example and then F/I system is added and it gets 265whp.


In both instances, the F/I system added 90whp. The 90whp addition is what I was getting at as being the more important factor. If it's on par with other systems then it should be a good setup for the value if the value is similar to other systems also.


I know the 175 was said to come from a different car, which is weird to include it, rather than not including a basline, but they thought better viewing to include it. I take dyno numbers with a grain of salt.

[sw20kosh]

Originally Posted by Foobar

That's sounds like a contradiction to me, what am I missing here? Or are you basically saying we should have seen the car before S/C as the baseline and not some stock car fresh off the lot?

He is saying pay attention to the delta not the absolute numbers. A % delta is the % boost in TQ or HP this thing gives at any given RPM.

You can visually do this by comparing the two curves or you can mathematically calculate it.

For example, a stock 86 makes 135 whp on a Dyno Dynamics. Instead of looking at what a turbo would make on that Dyno in terms of absolute #'s (which would obviously be very low compared to a Dynojet), you would look at the delta % from stock (135) and extrapolate.

Going back to this dyno and this graph and for simplicity sake I will look at peak whp. I am seeing a 50% increase in peak power (88 whp/175 whp) at 8 psi. Then you can ask yourself if this feels worth the $, although I would advocate test driving a kit before you put down some cash.

[Foobar]

Originally Posted by sw20kosh

He is saying pay attention to the delta not the absolute numbers. A % delta is the % boost in TQ or HP this thing gives at any given RPM.

You can visually do this by comparing the two curves or you can mathematically calculate it.

For example, a stock 86 makes 135 whp on a Dyno Dynamics. Instead of looking at what a turbo would make on that Dyno in terms of absolute #'s (which would obviously be very low compared to a Dynojet), you would look at the delta % from stock (135) and extrapolate.

Going back to this dyno and this graph and for simplicity sake I will look at peak whp. I am seeing a 50% increase in peak power (88 whp/175 whp) at 8 psi. Then you can ask yourself if this feels worth the $, although I would advocate test driving a kit before you put down some cash.

Right I understand now - but it still sounded like a contradiction, since he urged us not to pay attention to the actual numbers before/after but to focus on the delta, when in my perspective, the delta is the difference between the actual numbers so you do have to pay attention to them. It's a semantic thing I guess, we're all in agreement though.

That said, the top end of the power curve of this Pumpgas Vortech tune looks like it has a bit more oomph to it than some of the others we've seen posted that sort of level off at 6.5K. So from a comparison standpoint, it still stands that Mike may be on to something here, especially if he can eliminate that 6.5 hiccup and have a linear increase all the way through that band.

[OrbitalEllipses]

Originally Posted by Foobar

Right I understand now - but it still sounded like a contradiction, since he urged us not to pay attention to the actual numbers before/after but to focus on the delta, when in my perspective, the dlta is the difference between the actual numbers so you do have to pay attention to them. It's a semantic thing I guess, we're all in agreement though.

Delta %. I made mention of this in...what, the 3rd post?

▲%HP.