Kraftwerks Rotrex Supercharger Discussion

[ATL BRZ]

Originally Posted by Adeets

So what's this chargers max psi out on stock charger?

Check out the specs:

http://www.aaperf.com/docs/Rotrex_Te...Range_V4.0.pdf

The C30-94 used in this kit has a max mass flow rate of .37 KG/S (about 641 CFM) for up to 400hp with 96% drive efficiency.

[ft_sjo]

Originally Posted by Adeets

So what's this chargers max psi out on stock charger?

That depends on the flow rate. Maximum pressure ratio is 2.52, however that's not achievable at max flow, which would be more along the 1.9 PR region.

[ATL BRZ]

@gmsii

Are we seeing the Robispec giant radiator/oil cooler combo installed on this car?



The core thickness and the way the oil cooler lines drop down I'm pretty sure it is the Robispec.

[OrbitalEllipses]

Originally Posted by Adeets

I could swear I saw skatery with a 360whp e85 pull at elevation. Pretty sure that was with a vortech...

It was a super corrected at elevation dyno run. I haven't seen our local Vortech guys on the juice hit over 300hp and we're pretty much at sea level here.

[Adeets]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

It was a super corrected at elevation dyno run. I haven't seen our local Vortech guys on the juice hit over 300hp and we're pretty much at sea level here.

I'm at 274 with 92 octane, if there not seeing over 300 on e85 on stock pully I'd find a new tuner.

[Satanasso]

it seems to make a great output

any pics on how the rotrex is geared to the crank pulley?
it' not so clear what is behind the mount-plate...

[Adeets]

Originally Posted by ATL BRZ

Check out the specs:

http://www.aaperf.com/docs/Rotrex_Te...Range_V4.0.pdf

The C30-94 used in this kit has a max mass flow rate of .37 KG/S (about 641 CFM) for up to 400hp with 96% drive efficiency.

And what's the stock pully rotating the rotrex at? Because that's 9psi apparently, we can atleast have a guesstimate for max psi with that.

[Adeets]

As it stands I'm not seeing the hype, looks like a vortech with a smaller impeller but higher revs. And there numbers on 91 (235 according to that dyno refrence on the other thread) seems pretty much the same output. Am I missing something?

[nelsmar]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

It was a super corrected at elevation dyno run. I haven't seen our local Vortech guys on the juice hit over 300hp and we're pretty much at sea level here.

I made over 300WHP on my vortech. And this was only on the 3.125 pulley...

[Dezoris]

Originally Posted by gmsii

the rotrex has its own self contained oiling and cooling system...ideal operating temp is approximately 180, but can go up to 210 i believe....if oil temps get too high during track use, the rotrex oil cooler can simply be upgraded to a larger unit to bring those temps down.

as for track use durability, it should be noted that sport car motion record holding time FF time attack cars use rotrex without sc overheating problems...also hondata record holding landpspeed car does not have overheating problems...you can also see plenty off other cars and race cars that use rotrex chargers on the kraftwerks website or facebook page

Thanks for the reply.

Ok so all of these kits ship with the res/sc oil cooler I am assuming?

From my perspective you guys are trying to manage heat of the SC unit right out of the box so obvious questions are:

• Do you provide a way to monitor oil temps for SC? Have you logged this data on track?

I understand you have the data from other platforms. I like to see FRS/BRZ specific platform testing. From my experience this car has high under hood temperatures. The bottom of the engine bay is pretty much sealed up and the hood allows for almost no ventilation. You throw a monster IC up front, bigger radiator/Oil cooler and now an SC Oil cooler all that heat and no ventilation is going to be even higher than most S/C kits. That's why I am asking for data from track testing.

• What are your oil change intervals and what type of oil are you using in the SC?

Thanks

[Silverpike]

Originally Posted by Adeets

As it stands I'm not seeing the hype, looks like a vortech with a smaller impeller but higher revs. And there numbers on 91 (235 according to that dyno refrence on the other thread) seems pretty much the same output. Am I missing something?

Yes. Do some googling about how the Rotrex works; the improvement is in the drive mechanism.

If your goal is peak HP, buy a Vortech instead of a Rotrex solution.

[uspspro]

Originally Posted by Adeets

And what's the stock pully rotating the rotrex at? Because that's 9psi apparently, we can atleast have a guesstimate for max psi with that.

On my built 1zz (forged rods/pistons, DIY port/polish, cams) I was running the C30-94 close to its published max rated RPM at my engine's 7500 redline. My max boost was about 16-17 psi.

Since the FA20 is bigger and maybe flows a little more, I would venture to say the max safe boost would be probably a couple of psi less... maybe 15psi?

Enough for E85 guys, and more than enough for anyone on pump.

It's a bit curious though, that the Kraftwerks dyno tapers off close to redline. They don't appear to be running any kind of restrictor. The head or exhaust must be running out of flow.

PS-- The 2zz guys were getting about 325 rwhp (stock internals) on pump gas. They were running less boost, more RPM, and less mid-range torque compared to my setup

[Adeets]

Originally Posted by Silverpike

Yes. Do some googling about how the Rotrex works; the improvement is in the drive mechanism.

If your goal is peak HP, buy a Vortech instead of a Rotrex solution.

Yes what?
I already know that it's a different gearing, but both units achieve the same deal, as we've learned in other threads both units use impeller size X impeller speed to compute its air output, so if u have a boost graph of a vortech with 9psi at redline and a rotrex at 9psi at redline the graph will be the same, vortech is internally oiled with a larger impeller, rotrex has its own oil cooling loop to offset the high gearing heat, with the vortech that is an option.

They are so close to being the same damn thing the only thing to set them apart is when the rotrex is at max impeller speed what is its output going to be?

To go above 13psi on the vortech and stay in warranty the blower has to be inessence refurbished, and that allows the base blower then to achieve 16psi in warranty. And if you want above 16psi then a it requires buying a new supercharger.

So once again what's the benefit of running a rotrex over a vortech? What are their upgrade paths, and at each upgrade point, where does that take you psi wise?

[Adeets]

Originally Posted by uspspro

On my built 1zz (forged rods/pistons, DIY port/polish, cams) I was running the C30-94 close to its published max rated RPM at my engine's 7500 redline. My max boost was about 16-17 psi.

Since the FA20 is bigger and maybe flows a little more, I would venture to say the max safe boost would be probably a couple of psi less... maybe 15psi?

Enough for E85 guys, and more than enough for anyone on pump.

It's a bit curious though, that the Kraftwerks dyno tapers off close to redline. They don't appear to be running any kind of restrictor. The head or exhaust must be running out of flow.

PS-- The 2zz guys were getting about 325 rwhp (stock internals) on pump gas. They were running less boost, more RPM, and less mid-range torque compared to my setup

Lets stick to the FA20 setup, since flow changes alot engine to engine, not to mention HP figures are practically worthless when comparing two different platforms, what's the compression ratio on the 2zz? Because we know from experience at this point your hard pressed to even see 300 HP on a SC without E85 on the FA20.