Squeaky clutch pedal. Where to lube?

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Not wrong at all depending upon the source of the squeak. MY squeak was the shaft of the master and putting some light grease on the shaft and working it down into the seal did indeed eliminate it. It has also worked for at least 3 other people I walked through it.

That's funny. I was in the middle of being horrified at discovering my error at the same time as your post.


Humbly corrected.

[Compelica]

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon

Found it.


https://www.ft86club.com/forums/show...17#post2854717

Thank you! Working towards those 10 posts

One thing I'd like to chip in on identifying the location of the noise - apart from the obvious listening of the squeak, you should be able to confirm the source of the squeak as the component would vibrate when the squeak occurs. The more you feel, you're likely closer to it. Helped me solve other issues too this way.

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by Compelica

Thank you! Working towards those 10 posts

lol

[cat94]

Originally Posted by Compelica

Thank you! Working towards those 10 posts

One thing I'd like to chip in on identifying the location of the noise - apart from the obvious listening of the squeak, you should be able to confirm the source of the squeak as the component would vibrate when the squeak occurs. The more you feel, you're likely closer to it. Helped me solve other issues too this way.

I used a mechanics stethoscope, and the noise in the footwell parts was much louder than the noise from the clutch fork area.

I ended up removing the slave cylinder and lubricating the clutch fork pivot anyway (since we're all stuck inside). This helped remove some creakiness at the last centimeter of travel when the clutch was depressed.

My clutch feels amazing now. This has been bothering me for months. I thought about it every time I drove the car.

Thanks for your help everyone

[Compelica]

So after some investigating (and finger feeling) it turns out that the clutch fork pivot was causing the squeaks. At this point it wasn't squeaks anymore but metal-to-metal contact throughout the clutch travel, so something had to be done.

First off, I bought a cartridge tube of Philips 66 Multiplex Red #2. You'll only need less than 1% of it. Got it at 22 MYR - about 5 USD at today's rates.

Next was to remove the two 14mm mount bolts holding the slave cylinder to the clutch housing. These two bolts are stuck tight and snapped off my 3/8" to 1/4" adapter off clean. It was basically a job for another day when I unknowingly found another 14mm socket that would go on my 3/8" socket bar. Job goes on!

After the two bolts were out, the slave cylinder was moved away. Pulled off the boot, sprayed WD40 onto a rag and did a wipedown on the rod and fork (I did another pass with another clean rag to wipe off the excess).





Time for the real work. The middle pivot inside the clutch housing is shaped like an omega symbol (Ω) where your finger would be coming from the top. With two fingertip gobs of grease I fingered (?) it into the two sides, pushing in as much grease as I could. The excess was then worked around the ball of the middle pivot. With most lubricants, a little goes a long way.

FYI, you only need less than a quarter of this:




Another fingertip gob to the point where the slave rod meets the fork and you're done. Reinsert back the boot, tighten back the bolts to 37Nm (based on the slave cylinder swap guide here).

One mistake I made was that I stepped on the clutch after the slave cylinder was dismounted, which extended the rod and would prevent you from remounting the cylinder. I had to use a hand to press the rod against the top pivot, and then insert and finger tighten the bolt with another. Not a major setback but an unneeded one.

Pump the clutch pedal to work the grease in, and drive around for the grease to liquefy and settle in - and you're squeak free for the life of the car, hopefully

Special thanks to @humfrz and @Ultramaroon for the instructions, tips and tricks.

[humfrz]

Originally Posted by Compelica

So after some investigating (and finger feeling) it turns out that the clutch fork pivot was causing the squeaks.

Glad you got your clutch de-squeaked -

Good informative post -

[Ultramaroon]

Very nice! Unfortunately, the squeak will return. I'm not happy with the design of the spherical joint. It could be argued that it's just good enough for warranty but I'm not a fan.


The ball is flat on its face. Gun to my head, I would guess that it's to limit the contact surface for tolerance and to control wear. The problem is that, over time, the contact ring of the socket wears down, leaving a raised shelf in the center. The ball begins to catch on that shelf and let go as the clutch is operated through the catch. That's where the creak comes from on release. As it continues to wear, re-lubing helps less each time.


Here is a picture of one I took out of service at less than 20 Kmi. It was before I really understood what was happening so the shelf isn't yet apparent.


Last summer I reworked the fork that I am still using by grinding away the shelf enough to leave in its place a slight cavity. Then I used valve grinding compound to lap the mating surfaces. It has been nice so far. We'll see.


A more expensive solution would be to use a bronze insert in place of the formed socket. That's the kind of detail that makes a Porsche what it is.

[Compelica]

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon

Very nice! Unfortunately, the squeak will return. I'm not happy with the design of the spherical joint. It could be argued that it's just good enough for warranty but I'm not a fan.


The ball is flat on its face. Gun to my head, I would guess that it's to limit the contact surface for tolerance and to control wear. The problem is that, over time, the contact ring of the socket wears down, leaving a raised shelf in the center. The ball begins to catch on that shelf and let go as the clutch is operated through the catch. That's where the creak comes from on release. As it continues to wear, re-lubing helps less each time.


Here is a picture of one I took out of service at less than 20 Kmi. It was before I really understood what was happening so the shelf isn't yet apparent.


Last summer I reworked the fork that I am still using by grinding away the shelf enough to leave in its place a slight cavity. Then I used valve grinding compound to lap the mating surfaces. It has been nice so far. We'll see.


A more expensive solution would be to use a bronze insert in place of the formed socket. That's the kind of detail that makes a Porsche what it is.

I see, this makes sense and is consistent with mine where the noise is louder during the pedal release. It was at a point where you could feel the pivot grabbing as you modulate the release of the pedal - sounds like it's going to be a thing we MT owners have to live with.

Thinking about it - it's the lubricant that also prevents wear from happening in the first place.. Not an engineer however - so there's probably a bad design and lubricant choice made?

Also out of curiosity, does the Verus forged clutch fork solve this problem? I was looking at a install vid and I saw that they also replaced the ball - could be an alternative solution, maybe...

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by Compelica

...lubricant choice made?

Also out of curiosity, does the Verus forged clutch fork solve this problem? I was looking at a install vid and I saw that they also replaced the ball - could be an alternative solution, maybe...

I've started experimenting with different lubes as well. We'll see when I pull it apart again this summer. Feels fine, though.


I have heard nothing but praise for the Verus fork. All his offerings are top notch.

[alan.chalkley]

My suzuki 4wd had a squeaky clutch pedal a year ago.
The quick fix was lithium spray grease all over it and up under the dash , wipe up excess with an old rag.
It's been silent for a whole year now , so if it does come back , repeat spray grease.

[spcmafia]

Reviving this thread after it just happened to me.

Basically every reported noise, in tandem, happened to me.


Noise when fully depressing the clutch, if I could describe it, it sounded like hydraulics actuating in high pressure mixed with grinding noise and goose honk. This are the steps that I took to pinpoint source of squeak.


1. Replace Clutch Fluid

2. Grease the Slave Cylinder pivot point.
3. Grease the Clutch fork (Remove slave cylinder without touching hydraulic lines, remove boot, feel for the pivot point and grease).


After the noise was somewhat reduced, one stayed, sounded like a bad door hinge or dry rubber being dragged across steel.



Here is the culprit





What you see above is the Master Cylinder Assembly which sits above the Gas Pedal. That rod contains a rubber seal I believe that can get dry, along with the rod, rub those together, and bam, goose honk noise. Either use a spray type of lubricant, or really get in there with Toyota recommended (NICHIMOLY N-13).I went with Mobil-1 red grease.

[Ohio Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by spcmafia

What you see above is the Master Cylinder Assembly which sits above the Gas Pedal. That rod contains a rubber seal I believe that can get dry, along with the rod, rub those together, and bam, goose honk noise. Either use a spray type of lubricant, or really get in there with Toyota recommended (NICHIMOLY N-13).I went with Mobil-1 red grease.

Same here. I was actually a bit surprised no one mentioned it in any of the threads about the squeaky clutch, but it seemed a pretty obvious place to lube. I sprayed some lube there together with greasing the clutch fork pivot.

[spcmafia]

Originally Posted by spcmafia

Reviving this thread after it just happened to me.

Basically every reported noise, in tandem, happened to me.


Noise when fully depressing the clutch, if I could describe it, it sounded like hydraulics actuating in high pressure mixed with grinding noise and goose honk. This are the steps that I took to pinpoint source of squeak.


1. Replace Clutch Fluid

2. Grease the Slave Cylinder pivot point.
3. Grease the Clutch fork (Remove slave cylinder without touching hydraulic lines, remove boot, feel for the pivot point and grease).


After the noise was somewhat reduced, one stayed, sounded like a bad door hinge or dry rubber being dragged across steel.



Here is the culprit





What you see above is the Master Cylinder Assembly which sits above the Gas Pedal. That rod contains a rubber seal I believe that can get dry, along with the rod, rub those together, and bam, goose honk noise. Either use a spray type of lubricant, or really get in there with Toyota recommended (NICHIMOLY N-13).I went with Mobil-1 red grease.

Update on this. Seems like I didn’t do a good bleed the first time and had some air in the system. It could also be that while I was waiting for the engine bay to cool down before I greased the clutch fork, I removed the slave cylinder. While this was happening I went inside the vehicle and started pressing the clutch to pin point if the noise was coming from somewhere else. During this, it is possible that the piston in the slave cylinder got some air, or it could be from the initial bleed.

Anyways, I went Harbor Freight and got this


$25 later and I was back home doing another bleed.

Here is what I found out.
1. Get your area ready. Lay some towels or rag underneath the bleed valve.
2. Put your vacuum system together. Instructions are pretty easy to follow.
3. Open bleed valve the most that you can.
4. Cover the bleed valve with the rubber cap that comes with the vacuum hose.
5. Pump vacuum hose to around 20inHg. No more than that.
6. With the rubber cap on the bleeder valve, and vacuum in place, grab the rubber cap and turn it, grabbing the bleeder valve at the same time to fully open the valve.
7. Cap on the master cylinder should be open for you to keep adding fluid.
8. If you lose vacuum, give it more. Your reservoir bottle should be filling up. Keep going until no more bubbles are present and straight fluid is moving thru your hoses.
9. Close bleeder valve.
10. Release vacuum pressure.



All this liquid came out with bubbles and dark. The master cylinder is now crystal clear and clutch pressure is optimal.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Ultramaroon]

Air is definitely an issue but the dark stuff is just normal wear of the seal on the piston. Looks bad but is harmless.