Can't always shift into 1st?

[Lakitu]

Originally Posted by HKz

you're a noob, you need more clutch & rev matching practice.. Rev matching into 1st is admittedly tricky considering how much work the synchros have to do but it is not necessary. If you are still rolling over 5 MPH just go into 2nd..if you are struggling with downshifting into 2nd, then ya need a mentor.

Ah. Thanks. I think.

[flashburn]

Originally Posted by HKz

As for OP it is tough to diagnose these hard shifting problems over text and a video probably wouldn't really help either..best to get a buddy who is experienced with MTs and have him feel it. Dealership could help if ya don't know anyone..

Thanks... yeah I might just wait it out and see if it gets worse. It's too random at this point and may not happen even after attempting it for a while.

Really annoying, since I also had to deal with my slave cylinder dying on me at 50K, and I feel like I drive stick pretty well, always rev-matching, not shifting into 1st unless almost stopped, etc. When I replaced the clutch at the same time the pads looked basically brand new still.

[ls1ac]

If you are stopped for a while and have held the peddle down the gears in the trans will have stopped spinning and will often not line up. Let the pedal out while the shifter is between gears to spin them back up then the syncros will work and let you move the shifter into first. The lighter the trans the sooner they will stop spinning. Find someone with an old non-synco trans for first and this will become very obvious.


PS some times just moving the shifter to an other gear will move them just enough to get into first.

[RJasonKlein]

Originally Posted by ls1ac

If you are stopped for a while and have held the peddle down the gears in the trans will have stopped spinning and will often not line up. Let the pedal out while the shifter is between gears to spin them back up then the syncros will work and let you move the shifter into first. The lighter the trans the sooner they will stop spinning. Find someone with an old non-synco trans for first and this will become very obvious.


PS some times just moving the shifter to an other gear will move them just enough to get into first.

To the original poster, the advice above is spot on and definitely something you should understand and try when the gearbox doesn’t want to go into first gear.

[Stang70Fastback]

Originally Posted by Lakitu

I've noticed that if the RPMs are above a certain limit, it will not let you shift into 2nd or 1st. I always just thought of it as a safety mechanism. Its like it locks you out. "Access Denied...until you slow the fuck down". So I never downshift below 3rd when coming to a stop before a light, but I do only when I'm already going at a steady crawling pace around stores.

This is untrue.

I can downshift into 1st at 20+ MPH without issue. You just need to rev-match. People just tend to underestimate how much you need to blip the throttle for 1st gear. It's a short gear, so it requires a lot of revs. If you rev-match properly, it'll go into 1st any speed

[ChronoSage1]

This has to be common. Happens to me too and I have a 2017 86 model. It occurs when the oil isn't warmed up enough but like stated above the fork might not be aligned. I tend to at a stop play with it in neutral to make sure fork is not stuck halfway in gear. Its true it's point less to downshift to 1st second gear should be possible though just takes practice.

[flashburn]

Originally Posted by ls1ac

If you are stopped for a while and have held the peddle down the gears in the trans will have stopped spinning and will often not line up. Let the pedal out while the shifter is between gears to spin them back up then the syncros will work and let you move the shifter into first. The lighter the trans the sooner they will stop spinning. Find someone with an old non-synco trans for first and this will become very obvious.


PS some times just moving the shifter to an other gear will move them just enough to get into first.

So when this happens, I'm stopped, I clutch in/out to shift into neutral, and then after a little bit (say 5-30 seconds) clutch in and try to shift to first. So I don't have the clutch in the entire time. It sounds like you are saying this might happen if the clutch pedal is not released?

I've driven this car for 62K miles and it's only started doing this about 2K or less miles ago. I just don't believe it's "normal".

[ls1ac]

Changing the fluid will change the spin down rate, wear on the syncros will change the engagement force, wear on the gear edge will change the bevel of the gear ends and change the miss alignment that is allowing the gears to realign and engage.


Try experimenting a little.


If you have good sensitivity and a quiet exhaust you can hear the gears spin, or use a stethoscope. We use them all the time to track down suspect noises.


If you would like a little better understanding of gear engagement there are some good articles about synco and dog transmissions.

[dhuang]

I had this exact same issue with my ACT SB7-HDSS. Initially can't get it into first, soon after it became difficult to get into any gear. I would have to hold the clutch pedal down for 10 seconds before I could get it into gear.

I adjusted the pedal, bled the master, and even replaced the slave to no effect. I ended up blaming the ACT clutch... Had no problem with the stock clutch for 60k+ miles (with the exception of the TOB).

[8RZ]

In my other cars I would shift to 2nd and then to 1st and it was slide right in; I think this lines up the gates a little.

[Cheeky]

Originally Posted by Stang70Fastback

This is untrue.

I can downshift into 1st at 20+ MPH without issue. You just need to rev-match. People just tend to underestimate how much you need to blip the throttle for 1st gear. It's a short gear, so it requires a lot of revs. If you rev-match properly, it'll go into 1st any speed

I would not say it's untrue, because I know exactly what Lakitu is talking about. It isn't about rev match, it's about physically unable to shift into 1st 2nd gears with the shifter, and if you force it, it has this dirty crunch feel to it. I don't think it is a safety mechanism though, just something wrong with our cars...

[Stang70Fastback]

Originally Posted by Cheeky

I would not say it's untrue, because I know exactly what Lakitu is talking about. It isn't about rev match, it's about physically unable to shift into 1st 2nd gears with the shifter, and if you force it, it has this dirty crunch feel to it. I don't think it is a safety mechanism though, just something wrong with our cars...

Well, the part about it being a safety mechanism isn't true. The car certainly isn't intentionally designed to prevent you from shifting to 1st at higher speeds. Whether or not there is a synchro issue is another matter, but if everything is operating properly, shifting into 1st at 20 MPH shouldn't be a problem.

Here's a video I made as a result of another discussion - I think on this very forum, about this issue. That debate was a bit more irksome, so pardon my frustrated tone in the video, lol.

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcxhxA5RtGw"]Rolling Downshift to 1st in a BRZ - YouTube[/ame]

[Cheeky]

Originally Posted by Stang70Fastback

Well, the part about it being a safety mechanism isn't true. The car certainly isn't intentionally designed to prevent you from shifting to 1st at higher speeds. Whether or not there is a synchro issue is another matter, but if everything is operating properly, shifting into 1st at 20 MPH shouldn't be a problem.

Here's a video I made as a result of another discussion - I think on this very forum, about this issue. That debate was a bit more irksome, so pardon my frustrated tone in the video, lol.

Totally agree with you (and the vid), if everything is proper then there should be no problem . I usually don't have any downshift problem on any gear, but intermittently experience the "access denied" on the shifting to 1st/2nd.

[Lakitu]

Originally Posted by Stang70Fastback

This is untrue.

I can downshift into 1st at 20+ MPH without issue. You just need to rev-match. People just tend to underestimate how much you need to blip the throttle for 1st gear. It's a short gear, so it requires a lot of revs. If you rev-match properly, it'll go into 1st any speed

Thank you for being more descriptive with your reply rather than replying with a needless derogatory statement. Really helps others learn.
Thanks again bro.