FR-S and Genesis

[Luis_GT]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

I mean that I don't want a touchscreen in my car, it was one of the reasons I bought a Scion over a Subaru, regardless of quality of touchscreen.

Any particular reason why?

[Annahra]

Originally Posted by Foobar

They just come out with a sore neck or a bruised forehead unless they've got a short torso. It has legroom, I'll give it that. No headroom back there though, the seats are too high.

We've taken a few road trips with my or my boyfriend's Genesis. It's good to go for a 12 hour trip with three people as long as the person in the back is 5'4" or less! The BRZ we lasted about 15 minutes with three people.

[MokSpeed]

Originally Posted by Annahra

We've taken a few road trips with my or my boyfriend's Genesis. It's good to go for a 12 hour trip with three people as long as the person in the back is 5'4" or less! The BRZ we lasted about 15 minutes with three people.

I basically treat the backseats of the twins as backpack holders for the driver and front passenger on road trips. Large luggage in the trunk and anything you need access to in the backseats.

[Special_K]

One of the guys I work with has the Genesis Coupe, and we park next to each other pretty much everyday. Since we both know how different our cars are, but also how often people lump them together; we've made it into a joke that anytime one of us gets any sort of modification we'll bust in and challenge the other to a race for pinks.

In our case, the age thing holds true. He's an older gent that loves sporty cars but also his comfort, whereas I'm the young buck that doesn't mind crickets and the like.

And when it's all said and done, we each love our own whips and have respect for the other.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by Luis_GT

Any particular reason why?

In short: they're more hassle than they are worth.

The operation of using a touchscreen requires you to have precise spatial awareness of a button which has zero feedback, the only way to accomplish this is to either practice more often than a teenager masturbates or to look at the touchscreen. Looking at the touchscreen takes your eyes off the road, the muscle memory developed isn't impossible but it isn't easy either, even after having my first iphone for three years I had difficulty using it without looking and texting would result in many errors. So bullet point number one: to use it effectively you generally have to take your eyes off the road.
Counterpoint: a traditional headunit with buttons has feedback, you can feel your way to the proper button (next is 2 buttons over, 1, 2, push) without taking your eyes off the road.

Bullet point number two: features. I honestly can't think of anything a touchscreen can do that a traditional headunit with buttons can't, add in a display screen to cover visual navigation and some pretty graphics and user interfaces (a la BMW/Mini and a couple others I don't pay attention to) and there is literally no need for a touchscreen. For what I need the base '13 headunit is perfect, physical buttons to navigate the radio, settings and bluetooth connect to my phone. I stream music from my phone, use the physical buttons to skip tracks, pause, volume control. I can answer phone calls, I've never missed the answer button because it's the big rectangular one to the left. I can use my phone's google maps for up to date navigation with traffic read over my speakers, it's even got a nice fade in and out for the music so it isn't jarring, if I need the visual I can just look to my cupholder/center console which is no more distracting than a screen on the dashboard.

Bullet point number three: user interface. I haven't used a Toyobaru fancy headunit but I'm sure there are foibles unique to it just like any other head unit (BMW/Mini menus are like a maze of wtf does this do and why is that there?). My main gripe here is that the units so far don't seem to be designed by people trained and well versed in mass production graphical user interfaces, they resemble engineering software or other utilitarian equipment that generally requires training for efficient use. This will get better as Apple and Google enter the playing field (lol Microsoft Sync) but so far I haven't seen anything too great. Final point here is that computers get dated fast, how many years until your unit is the equivalent of a horizontal speedometer or digital dash? Nifty for some, garish for others. This is the display from a 2011 Acura TSX, a car that cost around $30k new just 3 years ago:



Reminds me of using mapquest a few decades ago...

I'm sure I'm skipping some annoyance but here's the nail in the coffin, assume you're into it all, you have no problem with what I've stated above, and you say 'yeah, slap it on!'.

That's at least $1,000. That's a grand for a unit that will never get an update, is locked into the software it uses and is next to impossible to use for anything other than what the engineer decided it would do however many years ago. Want an update so the nav doesn't flip out when you cross a bridge that didn't exist? That'll be $100 to $200 please, what's that, google maps is constantly updating for free? Even apple maps and bing update for free? Oh and you get updated user interfaces too? Nah, $100+ for this, this is quality stuff here.

Brand new flagship phones and tablets are <$700 and will outperform an onboard infotainment system in every metric from day one, factor in that the onboard system will almost never get updated, while the phone/tablet will receive firmware updates for roughly 2 years from the OEM, more if you do it yourself, and most apps will continue to update past that (at least for Android) how does it make sense with modern technology?

I'm sure it will get better but for my money today and the near future, keep it simple stupid, a nice basic interface with physical buttons that connects to the device of my choosing which will carry the heavy lifting is perfect. A built in dock or a unit that can easily be removed and upgraded with a guaranteed interface lifespan of many years will be as close as they can get, even then it will run out (oh we built an iphone interface into our car finally, what's that you guys changed to thunderbolt... fuck... what do you mean android holds majority market share?). Best idea I can come up with is either bluetooth or wifi a dumb screen that mirrors a phone similar to chromecast but even then I'm sure the oem's will fuck it up because they want to be different, just like Samsung and HTC do with Android.

[Luis_GT]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

In short: they're more hassle than they are worth.

The operation of using a touchscreen requires you to have precise spatial awareness of a button which has zero feedback, the only way to accomplish this is to either practice more often than a teenager masturbates or to look at the touchscreen. Looking at the touchscreen takes your eyes off the road, the muscle memory developed isn't impossible but it isn't easy either, even after having my first iphone for three years I had difficulty using it without looking and texting would result in many errors. So bullet point number one: to use it effectively you generally have to take your eyes off the road.
Counterpoint: a traditional headunit with buttons has feedback, you can feel your way to the proper button (next is 2 buttons over, 1, 2, push) without taking your eyes off the road.

Bullet point number two: features. I honestly can't think of anything a touchscreen can do that a traditional headunit with buttons can't, add in a display screen to cover visual navigation and some pretty graphics and user interfaces (a la BMW/Mini and a couple others I don't pay attention to) and there is literally no need for a touchscreen. For what I need the base '13 headunit is perfect, physical buttons to navigate the radio, settings and bluetooth connect to my phone. I stream music from my phone, use the physical buttons to skip tracks, pause, volume control. I can answer phone calls, I've never missed the answer button because it's the big rectangular one to the left. I can use my phone's google maps for up to date navigation with traffic read over my speakers, it's even got a nice fade in and out for the music so it isn't jarring, if I need the visual I can just look to my cupholder/center console which is no more distracting than a screen on the dashboard.

Bullet point number three: user interface. I haven't used a Toyobaru fancy headunit but I'm sure there are foibles unique to it just like any other head unit (BMW/Mini menus are like a maze of wtf does this do and why is that there?). My main gripe here is that the units so far don't seem to be designed by people trained and well versed in mass production graphical user interfaces, they resemble engineering software or other utilitarian equipment that generally requires training for efficient use. This will get better as Apple and Google enter the playing field (lol Microsoft Sync) but so far I haven't seen anything too great. Final point here is that computers get dated fast, how many years until your unit is the equivalent of a horizontal speedometer or digital dash? Nifty for some, garish for others. This is the display from a 2011 Acura TSX, a car that cost around $30k new just 3 years ago:

[IMG]http://i.i.cbsi.com/cnwk.1d/i/tim/2010/12/14/34444895_SS15.jpg[IMG]

Reminds me of using mapquest a few decades ago...

I'm sure I'm skipping some annoyance but here's the nail in the coffin, assume you're into it all, you have no problem with what I've stated above, and you say 'yeah, slap it on!'.

That's at least $1,000. That's a grand for a unit that will never get an update, is locked into the software it uses and is next to impossible to use for anything other than what the engineer decided it would do however many years ago. Want an update so the nav doesn't flip out when you cross a bridge that didn't exist? That'll be $100 to $200 please, what's that, google maps is constantly updating for free? Even apple maps and bing update for free? Oh and you get updated user interfaces too? Nah, $100+ for this, this is quality stuff here.

Brand new flagship phones and tablets are <$700 and will outperform an onboard infotainment system in every metric from day one, factor in that the onboard system will almost never get updated, while the phone/tablet will receive firmware updates for roughly 2 years from the OEM, more if you do it yourself, and most apps will continue to update past that (at least for Android) how does it make sense with modern technology?

I'm sure it will get better but for my money today and the near future, keep it simple stupid, a nice basic interface with physical buttons that connects to the device of my choosing which will carry the heavy lifting is perfect. A built in dock or a unit that can easily be removed and upgraded with a guaranteed interface lifespan of many years will be as close as they can get, even then it will run out (oh we built an iphone interface into our car finally, what's that you guys changed to thunderbolt... fuck... what do you mean android holds majority market share?). Best idea I can come up with is either bluetooth or wifi a dumb screen that mirrors a phone similar to chromecast but even then I'm sure the oem's will fuck it up because they want to be different, just like Samsung and HTC do with Android.

Well, to me, pioneer nailed the touch screen in the 2014 FR-S. Phisical volume knob, tune knob, skip buttons, menu button, and telephone button. Only times you need to touch the screen is to either adjust audio settings, pair a phone (which can only be done while stopped) play and pause, and to switch to radio after pressing the audio button, and it's aethetically pleasing.

It's great cause it allows me to control everything on my iphones music app, so I can choose radio, albums, playlists or artists.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by Luis_GT

Well, to me, pioneer nailed the touch screen in the 2014 FR-S. Phisical volume knob, tune knob, skip buttons, menu button, and telephone button. Only times you need to touch the screen is to either adjust audio settings, pair a phone (which can only be done while stopped) play and pause, and to switch to radio after pressing the audio button, and it's aethetically pleasing.

It's great cause it allows me to control everything on my iphones music app, so I can choose radio, albums, playlists or artists.

You're happy, I'm happy.



Edit: I didn't even touch on buttons that are difficult to read and the difficulty of hitting a small button when the car is jostling you around, sheesh I'm getting lazy.

[OrangeJuleas]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

You're happy, I'm happy.



Edit: I didn't even touch on buttons that are difficult to read and the difficulty of hitting a small button when the car is jostling you around, sheesh I'm getting lazy.

It's technology for technology's sake. You have to have it - even if it makes what you're actually using the car for (which is driving) more complicated.