Full throttle Electric Supercharger Build Thread

[shif7i7down]

Originally Posted by mid_life_crisis

Foot to the floor has a slight delay totally stock because of drive by wire. I bet it's just more noticeable with the extra kick of a supercharger.

That might very well be the case, i was only asking to see if it's a normal thing or did i do something wrong and if not then was someone able to reduce or eliminate the delay.
Just for the record i wasnt trying to bash the product or complain about the delay

[Tenthousanddays]

Originally Posted by gtfapollo

I read both of the other threads and some of the other FI threads in that category for the last few hours.

Can't wait for @Robftss Phantom ESC

I think there's several of us who are interested in making the best of the Phantom system over in that thread - and others who are looking to do something a bit different.

There's also some things going on in that thread that wouldn't be of interest to Rob, since it leads to a more complicated set up, with more power requirements. For instance, I've been talking to a vendor who builds solid slot electric motors, coupled with a turbo scroll which can put out close to 9PSI. The downfall is you need 7kw of continuous power to run it at 9PSI. Aka, close to 300 amps of continuous draw power = tons of batteries.

I'm still really into the Phantom setup - awesome price point for decent gains. I'd like to see another few PSI before jumping into it. I'd like to see a bigger motor with a bigger scroll - but that means more batteries. Just the limitations of this system.

[shif7i7down]

I got a question. We should be able to use 36v To speed up the brushless motor by roughly 40% without overheating as long ad we keep it 18AH. But will the controller be able to handle the 36v ?
Have Rob experimented with this yet?

[DAEMANO]

Originally Posted by Tenthousanddays

I think there's several of us who are interested in making the best of the Phantom system over in that thread - and others who are looking to do something a bit different.

There's also some things going on in that thread that wouldn't be of interest to Rob, since it leads to a more complicated set up, with more power requirements. For instance, I've been talking to a vendor who builds solid slot electric motors, coupled with a turbo scroll which can put out close to 9PSI. The downfall is you need 7kw of continuous power to run it at 9PSI. Aka, close to 300 amps of continuous draw power = tons of batteries.

I'm still really into the Phantom setup - awesome price point for decent gains. I'd like to see another few PSI before jumping into it. I'd like to see a bigger motor with a bigger scroll - but that means more batteries. Just the limitations of this system.

I applaud those looking to improve or even develop this concept. At the same time it's interesting to see people looking to re-create and/or improve the design of Rob's Phantom ESC slowly come to understand his design decisions and the depth of the R&D put into his release kit. Rob's been in development and testing for what 7,8,9 (?) years now, maybe longer and it shows in the reliabilty, streetability and viability of his offering. Any new peeps and or ideas are very much welcome however.

[Tenthousanddays]

Originally Posted by DAEMANO

I applaud those looking to improve or even develop this concept. At the same time it's interesting to see people looking to re-create and/or improve the design of Rob's Phantom ESC slowly come to understand his design decisions and the depth of the R&D put into his release kit. Rob's been in development and testing for what 7,8,9 (?) years now, maybe longer and it shows in the reliabilty, streetability and viability of his offering. Any new peeps and or ideas are very much welcome however.

Exactly, it's a very "simple" setup, that can be replicated in many different vehicles without having to change much. The battery system doesn't take up much space, and the install is basically a bolt on. It would be extremely hard to come up with a competing drop in product like his.

As electric motor and battery technology advances, I'm sure some advancements could be made to his already great system to allow for a few extra CFM's.

[fenton]

Originally Posted by DAEMANO

I applaud those looking to improve or even develop this concept. At the same time it's interesting to see people looking to re-create and/or improve the design of Rob's Phantom ESC slowly come to understand his design decisions and the depth of the R&D put into his release kit. Rob's been in development and testing for what 7,8,9 (?) years now, maybe longer and it shows in the reliabilty, streetability and viability of his offering. Any new peeps and or ideas are very much welcome however.

Yes I agree. The thing is boost down low is easy to get when the little 2.0 engine is not that efficient. It's up top that is hard.

In talking with Rob I think he said 20kw for 6 psi at redline.

Right now the system uses about 3.5kw and makes 5psi down low. My setup with 1.5 conversion and tq300 is about 4.5kw. The cooling requirements above 5kw change as well same with the amperage requirements of the controller. Everything keeps getting bigger and hotter the more watts you push through the system.

[Tenthousanddays]

Originally Posted by fenton

In talking with Rob I think he said 20kw for 6 psi at redline.

Holy crap... that's 555A @ 36V. There's a company that makes a 48V brushless with a gearbox incorporated to it. Even still, to make 6PSI up top you'll still need close to 400 amps.

[Gary in NJ]

Originally Posted by Tenthousanddays

Holy crap... that's 555A @ 36V. There's a company that makes a 48V brushless with a gearbox incorporated to it. Even still, to make 6PSI up top you'll still need close to 400 amps.

It sucks when physics gets in the way of a great plan.

[fenton]

Originally Posted by Gary in NJ

It sucks when physics gets in the way of a great plan.

Apparently 6kw is a nice number.....

[AN]

Originally Posted by fenton

Apparently 6kw is a nice number.....

I think 6psi - up top is a lot to ask from a compact battery/motor/controller combo as of today. We all know it will change .

However, one thing Rob has proven is that 5psi at the bottom and tapering to 0.5 Psi uptop can be awesome. I think it is reasonable for folks to look into where this system can be improved. e.g. use Li-Fe-Sulfate batteries which are 1/4 the size and weight of Pb-Acid and still affordable .... they can provide a lot of current, have a lot lower internal resistance ..... i.e. custom made for this solution. Similarly , 6kW ~ 7kW hobby motors are available for less than $200. Another easy target to upgrade ...

What Rob has done / shown is simply amazing. But since he had to put something together that is super cheap, easily replica-table / reproducible, flexible enough to be adaptable on other cars ... we can see why he had to make a lot of design decisions that he made.

[Tenthousanddays]

Originally Posted by Gary in NJ

It sucks when physics gets in the way of a great plan.

Where in NJ are you at Gary? I'd love to look at your P-FTS.

Originally Posted by fenton

Apparently 6kw is a nice number.....

6kW @ 36v only requires 166A (continuous), which is totally feasible with the right batteries.

[fenton]

Originally Posted by Tenthousanddays

Where in NJ are you at Gary? I'd love to look at your P-FTS.



6kW @ 36v only requires 166A (continuous), which is totally feasible with the right batteries.

Rob had done 36v before and it does perform well but there were many things he didn't like about it. Mainly that if people need things up with a 36v system it is easy to do your heart.

Right now his plans are to stay with 24v and push the system from there to my knowledge.

[neutron256]

Originally Posted by Tenthousanddays

Holy crap... that's 555A @ 36V. There's a company that makes a 48V brushless with a gearbox incorporated to it. Even still, to make 6PSI up top you'll still need close to 400 amps.

Is that gearbox a step-up, or step-down? Usually they are step down which is of no help. On big problem is that just adding more power isn't going to do the trick. You need a faster motor as well, or a larger compressor that will flow more air at the same speed.

[TM]

I was driving home on the back roads to enjoy the sound of my new UEL headers and decided to see how it feels with the ESC unarmed. I forgot how slow this car is in its stock form! Even with headers. The car does not pull!