From Boxster to FR-S

[zdr93523]

"Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery" - Charles Caleb Colton

[zdr93523]

Originally Posted by DeeezNuuuts83

But you're taking it out of context. They used it during development as a benchmark, as far as driving experience/involvement. You've been insinuating that Toyota was pretty much trying to copy it, inside and out.

No, I'm not insinuating anything... I'm saying that they did copy parts of it. Evidence says they did. Human eyes with 20/20 vision say they did. THIS IS NOT A BAD THING. Even in the articles that I referenced, they note that the cars are eerily similar in design. The knee pad area on the sides of the center stack is an absolute copy of the Cayman's. I park my Cayman and BRZ next to each other and I can attest to the similarities. I look at and/or drive both of them daily. Do you?

To Toyota and Subaru's credit, the 86 has about 8 or 9/10ths of the Cayman's handling ability. I would assume it is very close to a base Cayman in overall performance. Also, the interior is MUCH improved over most Subarus and some Toyotas in the price range.

Again, the imitation/copy/used as a reference/whatever you want to call it is not a bad thing. I'm not bashing Toyota/Subaru. You guys are missing the point. How did my contribution to the discussion turn into Bash-fest 2014??? To the bashers: Do you talk like this when you meet people in person? I highly doubt it.

Whoever called me a Porsche elitist clearly didn't read my previous post and list of cars that I have owned/maintained/built/raced.

[355rockit]

I did a spirited back country drive with a friend who has a 911 Carrera. After the drive he said that he was not slowed down at all by my FR-S and I was able to keep up with him when he led the drive back. He was very impressed by the performance. Some of the straights I was left behind a bit, but caught up on the twisties. Mine has TRD intake and FT86SF catted UEL header (no tune)

[zdr93523]

Originally Posted by 355rockit

I did a spirited back country drive with a friend who has a 911 Carrera. After the drive he said that he was not slowed down at all by my FR-S and I was able to keep up with him when he led the drive back. He was very impressed by the performance. Some of the straights I was left behind a bit, but caught up on the twisties. Mine has TRD intake and FT86SF catted UEL header (no tune)

That's a great example of how impressive the 86 is.

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[Sideways&Smiling]

Originally Posted by zdr93523

Except Toyota is the one who claimed that they used the Cayman for 86 development... Not me. That is the difference. I'm stating facts so quit bashing me. Maybe you're just a little jealous? Angry about something? Need some counseling? In none of my posts have I ever said anything negative about the 86. What is your deal?

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Wasn't it only the steering/handling feel they were using as a benchmark?

[extrashaky]

Originally Posted by zdr93523

Except Toyota is the one who claimed that they used the Cayman for 86 development... Not me.

I have yet to see anything from Toyota stating that they used the Cayman for the development of anything other than the handling and road feel of the car. And even then they only used it as a performance benchmark. Benchmarking is not "copying."

Originally Posted by zdr93523

No, I'm not insinuating anything... I'm saying that they did copy parts of it. Evidence says they did. Human eyes with 20/20 vision say they did.

I have perfect vision, and I'm looking at those pictures and seeing no similarities beyond what one would expect from form following function. I think you're seeing what you want to see and in the process imagining "copying" where none exists.

Originally Posted by zdr93523

Again, the imitation/copy/used as a reference/whatever you want to call it is not a bad thing.

And yet it still reads like a left-handed compliment.

[DeeezNuuuts83]

Originally Posted by extrashaky

I have yet to see anything from Toyota stating that they used the Cayman for the development of anything other than the handling and road feel of the car. And even then they only used it as a performance benchmark. Benchmarking is not "copying."

Exactly. Nissan used the 911 Turbo (997) as their benchmark for the GT-R. Chevy used an Evo (CT9A) as their benchmark for the Cobalt SS Turbo. Ford used an M3 (E92) as their benchmark for the Mustang Boss 302. They obviously didn't copy those cars, despite using them as their yardsticks for performance.

[zdr93523]

Originally Posted by extrashaky

I have yet to see anything from Toyota stating that they used the Cayman for the development of anything other than the handling and road feel of the car. And even then they only used it as a performance benchmark. Benchmarking is not "copying."



I have perfect vision, and I'm looking at those pictures and seeing no similarities beyond what one would expect from form following function. I think you're seeing what you want to see and in the process imagining "copying" where none exists.



And yet it still reads like a left-handed compliment.

You might want to fire your optometrist.

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[zdr93523]

Originally Posted by DeeezNuuuts83

Exactly. Nissan used the 911 Turbo (997) as their benchmark for the GT-R. Chevy used an Evo (CT9A) as their benchmark for the Cobalt SS Turbo. Ford used an M3 (E92) as their benchmark for the Mustang Boss 302. They obviously didn't copy those cars, despite using them as their yardsticks for performance.

You are 100% correct. However, the 86 has many design influences from the Cayman as well as the meeting performance goals set by the benchmark.

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[zdr93523]

See items circled. If you can't notice the similarities... There's no helping you.

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[zdr93523]

Originally Posted by extrashaky

I have yet to see anything from Toyota stating that they used the Cayman for the development of anything other than the handling and road feel of the car. And even then they only used it as a performance benchmark. Benchmarking is not "copying."



I have perfect vision, and I'm looking at those pictures and seeing no similarities beyond what one would expect from form following function. I think you're seeing what you want to see and in the process imagining "copying" where none exists.



And yet it still reads like a left-handed compliment.

Why would I insult my own car?

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[zdr93523]

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[extrashaky]

So in addition to the imaginary copying, you also see these imaginary circles in your car while you're driving?

[GT/86]

Same with the FR-S a lot of People Die but So far no one famous.

Originally Posted by pascalbrax

Lots of famous people died in a Porsche.

They're fast and good looking (sometimes) cars that give you a false sense of security and control.