Kraftwerks Rotrex Supercharger Discussion

[Sonolin]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

Superchargers are rated in flow. While the supercharger may be able to flow 435 hp worth of air, it doesn't mean the engine can make that much power.

For example, the C30-94 at the same boost level (and supercharger RPM) makes close to 400hp on the S2000, while it makes closer to 300 on the FR-S/BRZ.

This applies to all C30-94 kits.

Hi Mike,

I'm a little confused about this S/C not having any headroom...

I'm looking at the compressor map I attached to this post, and from what I understand 9psi = ~1.6 pressure ratio at sea level. Looking at the compressor map, it seems this is right in the middle of the efficiency area so there should be more boost to be safely had under the 100k S/C redline.

I probably don't understand this stuff very well, but I just want to get an idea of boost headroom as I know with the the other S/C offerings there's a bit of room to push the S/C with more boost.

EDIT: I understand this would nullify the warranty I'm just curious how much HP we can get without overspinning this blower past the 100k redline

[Unicorn]

Dear Sonolin,

Pressure ratio isn't perfect like that. It'd be more like PR 1.8. Either way, your assumption is correct, there would be head room, however how much depends on the VE of the engine. You may be lucky and a smaller pulley may take you 'up the canal', so to speak. You may be unlucky and as the VE drops off, it forces you out of the high efficiency areas. This compounds the issues with forced induction on a high compression engine. This could be your limit.

Best regards,
Unicorn

[Sonolin]

Originally Posted by Unicorn

Dear Sonolin,

Pressure ratio isn't perfect like that. It'd be more like PR 1.8. Either way, your assumption is correct, there would be head room, however how much depends on the VE of the engine. You may be lucky and a smaller pulley may take you 'up the canal', so to speak. You may be unlucky and as the VE drops off, it forces you out of the high efficiency areas. This compounds the issues with forced induction on a high compression engine. This could be your limit.

Best regards,
Unicorn

Interesting, thank you I guess I'll have to wait and see.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by Sonolin

Hi Mike,

I'm a little confused about this S/C not having any headroom...

I'm looking at the compressor map I attached to this post, and from what I understand 9psi = ~1.6 pressure ratio at sea level. Looking at the compressor map, it seems this is right in the middle of the efficiency area so there should be more boost to be safely had under the 100k S/C redline.

I probably don't understand this stuff very well, but I just want to get an idea of boost headroom as I know with the the other S/C offerings there's a bit of room to push the S/C with more boost.

EDIT: I understand this would nullify the warranty I'm just curious how much HP we can get without overspinning this blower past the 100k redline

The limitation is from the speed the supercharger is spinning. While I don't have the exact numbers, I'm pretty sure we're already fairly close to the 100k limit.

[Calum]

I thought it was close to 70k rpm. ??

Sent from my GT-S7560M using Tapatalk

[FreshFRS]

Originally Posted by Calum

I thought it was close to 70k rpm. ??

Sent from my GT-S7560M using Tapatalk

i did the math a little while ago and at 13psi the C30-94 was spinning at 89krpms, at 9psi the charger should be spinning at 72ish krpm. it's a few pages back in the thread.

@CSG Mike,

i think the difference in power between the cars stems from a slightly higher redline, coupled with much more aggressive cams in the upper rev range ( ie. VTEC) and greater Volumetric Efficiency. the slightly lower compression also could increase the amount of timing before knock becomes a concern (not sure if DI cancels out that advantage completely). not to mention some guys on S2ki are running raised redlines to add power. also, good headers and full exhausts, can add 25whp in the S2k's case with proper tuning.

i think that there is no question this kit has headroom, it comes down to how well the car is tuned, cams (264/272)could make a big difference in the mid to top end as well. while the cam phasing could keep them respectable down low.

[rickspecd]

Hi Everyone,

Were a sponsor on the forum and also one of the biggest stocking Kraftwerks Dealers in the area. We are offering a partial sponsorship on one of these kits for any local Philadelphia, PA BRZ / FRS Owner to get a kit for us to promote locally.

If you have any questions, you can ask us and we will do our best to help you get situated.

[rickspecd]

The powerband on these kits is very good. We have done a ton of hondas with them including one we just finished an hour or go. They all make great power and are perfect for the Street / Daily driver setup.


Quality isn't matched!

[vgi]

Originally Posted by importdps

The powerband on these kits is very good. We have done a ton of hondas with them including one we just finished an hour or go. They all make great power and are perfect for the Street / Daily driver setup.


Quality isn't matched!

Do you guys do the tuning? Anything else besides EcuTek?

[gmsii]

Originally Posted by vgi

Do you guys do the tuning? Anything else besides EcuTek?

KW will offer tuned solutions and maps using the Ecutek as our tuning platform

[retrosmiths]

Originally Posted by gmsii

**IMPORTANT NOTE!:
the cost of the tuned options will be available next week...because the tuned/tuning options will be sold in addition to the base kit (at a discount), it makes sense to place your order for the base kit now and then add on the tuning options at the time of fulfillment (shipping)

I'm planning to get UEL headers + complete ECUTEK before I get my KW, so does this mean the tuned option will include the ECUTEK stuff (license, cable and tune) already? Should I wait for my KW before getting UEL headers then?

Also planning to install this myself. Would I be able to drive my car to a local tuner after install to get my tune?

[grostoine]

I plan to take the tune and go to a local tuner tooo...

[digital_assassin]

Originally Posted by retrosmiths

I'm planning to get UEL headers + complete ECUTEK before I get my KW, so does this mean the tuned option will include the ECUTEK stuff (license, cable and tune) already? Should I wait for my KW before getting UEL headers then?

Also planning to install this myself. Would I be able to drive my car to a local tuner after install to get my tune?

If you are wanting to tune locally I would ask your tuner how they would like to move forward. I've had bad luck with canned tunes so local ECUTEK tuner performing a tune on the dyno is the only way to go IMO and I'm fortunate to have a really good tuner. Other people have had better success than me so YMMV.

I am installing the kit myself and asked the same question if I can drive it the 3 hour trip to his shop before tuning. His response was just accelerate slowly and keep the RPM's under 3K and it will be fine. 3 hours under 3K with a new supercharger under the hood will be tough so I'm going to trailer it.

[gmsii]

Originally Posted by digital_assassin

I am installing the kit myself and asked the same question if I can drive it the 3 hour trip to his shop before tuning. His response was just accelerate slowly and keep the RPM's under 3K and it will be fine. 3 hours under 3K with a new supercharger under the hood will be tough so I'm going to trailer it.

here is what you do.....disconnect the compressor outlet silicone hose
and the car will be NA... drive it as long and hard as you want and you will be fine