follow ft86club on our blog, twitter or facebook.
FT86CLUB
Ft86Club
Speed By Design
Register Garage Community Calendar Today's Posts Search

Go Back   Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community - FT86CLUB > Technical Topics > Engine, Exhaust, Transmission

Engine, Exhaust, Transmission Discuss the FR-S | 86 | BRZ engine, exhaust and drivetrain.

Register and become an FT86Club.com member. You will see fewer ads

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 08-29-2024, 05:49 PM   #1
boredom.is.me
Custom User Title
 
boredom.is.me's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Drives: Asphalt FR-S MT
Location: Buford, GA/Daytona Beach, FL
Posts: 2,793
Thanks: 395
Thanked 1,182 Times in 697 Posts
Mentioned: 49 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Garage
Is there a replacement for the clutch hardline?

I'm in the middle of a swap, and was wondering if there was a solution to the ridiculous factory bent hardline. Is there a reason for it to be so extra? It's not in the way or super important, just one of those little details...
Attached Images
 
__________________
boredom.is.me is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2024, 06:06 PM   #2
Ashikabi
Senior Member
 
Ashikabi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Drives: 2013 FR-S
Location: Northwest Iowa
Posts: 7,359
Thanks: 454
Thanked 4,549 Times in 2,950 Posts
Mentioned: 59 Post(s)
Tagged: 5 Thread(s)
What kinda swap? Non-native motor? Most people use a recessed Wilwood master cylinder. DM me for a kit.

Alternatively you could use an adapter to make an AN hose fit the existing master

Sent from my KB2007 using Tapatalk
Ashikabi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2024, 07:17 PM   #3
Ultramaroon
not playing cards
 
Ultramaroon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Drives: a 13 e8h frs
Location: vantucky, wa
Posts: 32,395
Thanks: 53,053
Thanked 37,228 Times in 19,308 Posts
Mentioned: 1117 Post(s)
Tagged: 9 Thread(s)
I'm pretty sure that's to compensate for firewall flexion. A short tube is more vulnerable to fatigue failure.

edit: My point is kind of buried in that fatigue article. This part gets more into the reason.
__________________

Last edited by Ultramaroon; 08-29-2024 at 07:48 PM.
Ultramaroon is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Ultramaroon For This Useful Post:
DarkPira7e (08-29-2024), NoHaveMSG (08-29-2024), Spuds (09-12-2024)
Old 08-29-2024, 07:33 PM   #4
Spairo
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Drives: 2013 FR-S 6 spd in Halo
Location: San Diego
Posts: 91
Thanks: 10
Thanked 79 Times in 41 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Is there a reason for it to be so extra what?
Spairo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2024, 07:44 PM   #5
Ultramaroon
not playing cards
 
Ultramaroon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Drives: a 13 e8h frs
Location: vantucky, wa
Posts: 32,395
Thanks: 53,053
Thanked 37,228 Times in 19,308 Posts
Mentioned: 1117 Post(s)
Tagged: 9 Thread(s)
If you have to ask...
__________________
Ultramaroon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2024, 09:46 PM   #6
bcj
Geo Tyrebighter Esq
 
bcj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Drives: '13 scion fr-s
Location: pnw
Posts: 4,319
Thanks: 6,729
Thanked 5,262 Times in 2,293 Posts
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Garage
But, It's Biggerer!
A hard line will expand less than any kind of flex tubing.
Kind of have to use them on the brakes because the suspension moves significantly more and would spoon bend them right off.
The engine and trans housing moves too, but not as much. The stock length can absorb a clutch kick or two, but that will fatigue it as well and shorten the usable lifetime.
__________________
--
"I gotta rock." -- Charley Brown
bcj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-30-2024, 04:15 AM   #7
boredom.is.me
Custom User Title
 
boredom.is.me's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Drives: Asphalt FR-S MT
Location: Buford, GA/Daytona Beach, FL
Posts: 2,793
Thanks: 395
Thanked 1,182 Times in 697 Posts
Mentioned: 49 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashikabi View Post
What kinda swap? Non-native motor? Most people use a recessed Wilwood master cylinder. DM me for a kit.

Alternatively you could use an adapter to make an AN hose fit the existing master

Sent from my KB2007 using Tapatalk
I have a K24A in it already. There's nothing wrong with the stock slave. I was just wondering why there short hardline was shaped that way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultramaroon View Post
I'm pretty sure that's to compensate for firewall flexion. A short tube is more vulnerable to fatigue failure.

edit: My point is kind of buried in that fatigue article. This part gets more into the reason.
Simple answer to a simple question.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bcj View Post
But, It's Biggerer!
A hard line will expand less than any kind of flex tubing.
Kind of have to use them on the brakes because the suspension moves significantly more and would spoon bend them right off.
The engine and trans housing moves too, but not as much. The stock length can absorb a clutch kick or two, but that will fatigue it as well and shorten the usable lifetime.
That's precisely why many switch to stainless braided lines. Also keep in mind that the second half of clutch is also rubber.


This is just one of those things that I've never seen anyone talk about.
__________________
boredom.is.me is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2024, 07:57 PM   #8
blsfrs
Senior Member
 
blsfrs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Drives: 2013 frs base
Location: central Virginia
Posts: 1,440
Thanks: 2,684
Thanked 1,442 Times in 685 Posts
Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
There a few write ups about SS braided lines vs oem rubber brake lines. The general opinion was that the rubber lines were more durable than the SS ones and the was no "loss" of pressure due to flex.
blsfrs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2024, 01:28 PM   #9
bcj
Geo Tyrebighter Esq
 
bcj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Drives: '13 scion fr-s
Location: pnw
Posts: 4,319
Thanks: 6,729
Thanked 5,262 Times in 2,293 Posts
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Garage
SS braided lines *are* rubber lines. No difference in properties other than abrasion resistance on the outside.
Steel lines are steel from the outside to inside, but they will expand with increased pressure too.
The difference is in the proportion of expansion, Steel / Rubber.
__________________
--
"I gotta rock." -- Charley Brown
bcj is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to bcj For This Useful Post:
blsfrs (09-04-2024)
Old 09-02-2024, 01:57 PM   #10
Ohio Enthusiast
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Drives: 2018 BRZ
Location: Dayton, OH
Posts: 1,044
Thanks: 1,476
Thanked 875 Times in 506 Posts
Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by bcj View Post
SS braided lines *are* rubber lines.
I always understood that stainless steel braided lines have a Teflon inner hose that is less stretchy than regular rubber hoses, and that the stainless steel braid is needed as Teflon is not as resistant to damage as rubber.

I would also imagine that this wouldn't matter for clutch as the pressures are much lower than in brake lines.
Ohio Enthusiast is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Ohio Enthusiast For This Useful Post:
NoHaveMSG (09-07-2024)
Old 09-02-2024, 02:02 PM   #11
Ashikabi
Senior Member
 
Ashikabi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Drives: 2013 FR-S
Location: Northwest Iowa
Posts: 7,359
Thanks: 454
Thanked 4,549 Times in 2,950 Posts
Mentioned: 59 Post(s)
Tagged: 5 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohio Enthusiast View Post
I always understood that stainless steel braided lines have a Teflon inner hose that is less stretchy than regular rubber hoses, and that the stainless steel braid is needed as Teflon is not as resistant to damage as rubber.



I would also imagine that this wouldn't matter for clutch as the pressures are much lower than in brake lines.
I believe the resistance to expansion in PTFE hoses is because of the stainless braid itself. Since the braid will pull against itself

Sent from my KB2007 using Tapatalk
Ashikabi is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Ashikabi For This Useful Post:
Ultramaroon (09-02-2024)
Old 09-02-2024, 11:42 PM   #12
Ultramaroon
not playing cards
 
Ultramaroon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Drives: a 13 e8h frs
Location: vantucky, wa
Posts: 32,395
Thanks: 53,053
Thanked 37,228 Times in 19,308 Posts
Mentioned: 1117 Post(s)
Tagged: 9 Thread(s)
^^this^^


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohio Enthusiast View Post
I would also imagine that this wouldn't matter for clutch as the pressures are much lower than in brake lines.
I cringe a little every time I read about stainless braid for a clutch. Fully agree.
__________________
Ultramaroon is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Ultramaroon For This Useful Post:
NoHaveMSG (09-07-2024)
Old 09-03-2024, 08:51 PM   #13
Grady
Senior Member
 
Grady's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Drives: BRZ Yellow, 2019 Ranger, 2011 Evora
Location: Dallas
Posts: 1,705
Thanks: 354
Thanked 1,489 Times in 781 Posts
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Garage
It all depends on the hose makeup not how it looks. All your high pressure hoses are going to have a stainless braid. It may be covered in rubber or exposed. It can be a type of rubber or a teflon inner. Look at the specification of the hose and make sure it is compatible with brake fluid.

Edit:
The hard line is like that because the engine and transmission moves. As stated above if it was a short line the constant flex would work harden the line and it would break.
Grady is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
DIY Clutch Replacement Supermassive DIY (Do-It-Yourself) Guides 217 08-27-2023 01:35 PM
Clutch replacement cnorman BRZ First-Gen (2012+) — General Topics 7 02-15-2022 03:24 AM
OEM-like clutch replacement B-R-Z Engine, Exhaust, Transmission 31 02-22-2020 05:27 PM
Clutch replacement pinetree Engine, Exhaust, Transmission 21 05-03-2017 09:48 AM
Clutch replacement Thatguyjeremy Engine, Exhaust, Transmission 0 02-28-2015 05:22 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:23 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2026, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.3.0 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2026 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

Garage vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.