Engine Longevity?

[Packofcrows]

Originally Posted by carma143

There is a metal band made up of Ned Flanders http://musicfeeds.com.au/news/meet-t...illy/#/slide/1

seems quite interesting...great name by the way.

What about jeremías obadiah jebediah zacarías springfield?

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by N1rve

I wouldn't call a car an investment, I'd say it's a toy But that's just me.

Depends on how you define investment, if it's a thing you expect to make money on the hell no is a car an investment. If it's a tool you expect to use daily and bring pleasure and quality of life to you than this car can be a great investment.

Well I guess you could still call the latter a toy but not many people commute in a toy.

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

Depends on how you define investment, if it's a thing you expect to make money on the hell no is a car an investment. If it's a tool you expect to use daily and bring pleasure and quality of life to you than this car can be a great investment.

Well I guess you could still call the latter a toy but not many people commute in a toy.

I think even then it's referred to as a capital expenditure because it's a depreciating asset.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon

I think even then it's referred to as a capital expenditure because it's a depreciating asset.

How do you have any money left for a car with all those $5 words?

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

How do you have any money left for a car with all those $5 words?

I passed on a 911 and bought the frs.

[Ultramaroon]

imma make it rain, bitches

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Flip a coin I guess.
Like I said I have no bias.
If you asked this 10 years ago there would have been a definitive Toyota answer but now that line is gone.

[NOHOME]

Originally Posted by Cedars

No way a toyotas engine will go kaput at 65000 kms. You will get at least 300k out of it. I've seen toyotas with 500,000 kms on them and they run fine. Maintenance is the key, mainly changing oil on time.

Never looked under the hood on this car have you?

I WISH there were a Toyota engine under the hood. A nice straight 4 or V6 Toyota engine under the hood would be nice.

The reliability of the direct injection is going to play a bit part in how long-lived this engine design turns out to be. It is so new that they still have not managed to figure out what causes the crickets! So they are still learning.

The engine needs to be wound out to get any recreational acceleration. Should be interesting to see how this plays a role. My normal shift points are over 5500 rpm and cruise is 3-3500 rpm. Hitting the rev limiter is not an unheard of event.

Another "internet issue" floating around is that a failure of the injector seals seems to be a death sentence for this engine. "If you smell fuel it's too late". If that should turn out to be an issue as the cars age, then it will taint the perception for the entire engine design.

Another thing to keep in mind is that the engine is quite complex from the start. It has way too many cams spread all over the place. Why does a 4 cylinder engine need four cams, two heads and twice the cam-gear as a normal engine? Engineers have a word for such over-complicated desgns they call them a "Kludge". Spark Plugs are a nightmare to replace. I can see a lot of them getting stuck in the heads with a repair cost exceeding the value of a 8 year old car. Also as the cars get older, people will be skipping on maintenance, and that is when complexity takes its toll: Not that the engine is a "bad design", more like it won't survive second and third owners.

In the meantime, I will just keep driving mine. I only need it to last about 150,000 km over ten years. So far, so good.

[Fishbed77]

It cracks me up that people question the longevity of these engines at all. There are a ridiculous number of early-80s Subarus still running along merrily on their original flat-fours, and the FA20, despite being more complex, is still a better design in almost every respect.

Every single post I've read involving a blown engine in the Twins is in reference to an engine that has been heavily boosted or raced hard. Assuming proper maintenance (which is easy and inexpensive on these cars) there is a next-to-zero chance that you will kill a stock one by daily driving it.

[Tt3Sheppard]

Originally Posted by NOHOME

Never looked under the hood on this car have you?

I WISH there were a Toyota engine under the hood. A nice straight 4 or V6 Toyota engine under the hood would be nice.

The reliability of the direct injection is going to play a bit part in how long-lived this engine design turns out to be. It is so new that they still have not managed to figure out what causes the crickets! So they are still learning.

The engine needs to be wound out to get any recreational acceleration. Should be interesting to see how this plays a role. My normal shift points are over 5500 rpm and cruise is 3-3500 rpm. Hitting the rev limiter is not an unheard of event.

Another "internet issue" floating around is that a failure of the injector seals seems to be a death sentence for this engine. "If you smell fuel it's too late". If that should turn out to be an issue as the cars age, then it will taint the perception for the entire engine design.

Another thing to keep in mind is that the engine is quite complex from the start. It has way too many cams spread all over the place. Why does a 4 cylinder engine need four cams, two heads and twice the cam-gear as a normal engine? Engineers have a word for such over-complicated desgns they call them a "Kludge". Spark Plugs are a nightmare to replace. I can see a lot of them getting stuck in the heads with a repair cost exceeding the value of a 8 year old car. Also as the cars get older, people will be skipping on maintenance, and that is when complexity takes its toll: Not that the engine is a "bad design", more like it won't survive second and third owners.

In the meantime, I will just keep driving mine. I only need it to last about 150,000 km over ten years. So far, so good.

I sure hope spark plugs getting stuck in the heads is not an issue for this car!!

I do believe there are a few members with at least 100k on the original engine. I myself am currently at 65k with no engine issues that I'm aware of.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by NOHOME

The reliability of the direct injection is going to play a bit part in how long-lived this engine design turns out to be. It is so new that they still have not managed to figure out what causes the crickets! So they are still learning.

Toyota has been experimenting with direct injection for over 20 years, the initial D4 system was sold in the Japanese market in 1998. The system on the 86, D4-S was first introduced in 2005 on the Lexus 2GR-FSE motor, this system has been in production and on the road for over 10 years now.

I bet those pumps chirp too, if they're any different from the ones installed in an 86. They typically bury the HPFP in sound insulation, but that's weight, and this is a cheap sports car.

1998 Source:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gasoli...#Later_systems


2005 Source:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_GR_engine#2GR-FSE

Originally Posted by Fishbed77

Every single post I've read involving a blown engine in the Twins is in reference to an engine that has been heavily boosted or raced hard. Assuming proper maintenance (which is easy and inexpensive on these cars) there is a next-to-zero chance that you will kill a stock one by daily driving it.

That's not true. (note; some of these engines may have been screwed up by dealership oil fills and owners not taking the responsibility for checking oil levels, I place blame on 'yota for that one).

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=60047
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...9&postcount=20
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...9&postcount=23
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...0&postcount=49
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...0&postcount=53

And 13x in this thread, didn't go through to verify if they were 100% factory fault or not:
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15577

And I got bored of searching after that.

We may disagree on the definition of "raced hard", imo this engine should be able to take a beating. When a company advertises it's car for track use, hires professional drivers for promotion and sponsors race teams to use the car I expect the stock powertrain configuration to hold up to autocross and HPDE use within reason.

[Fishbed77]

That's not true. (note; some of these engines may have been screwed up by dealership oil fills and owners not taking the responsibility for checking oil levels, I place blame on 'yota for that one).

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=60047
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...9&postcount=20
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...9&postcount=23
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...0&postcount=49
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...0&postcount=53

That's assuming all these posters were being 100% honest.

If there's anything I've learned over the years, it's not to take anything you read on the internet at face value.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by Fishbed77

That's assuming all these posters were being 100% honest.

If there's anything I've learned over the years, it's not to take anything you read on the internet at face value.

That's assuming out of the nearly 20x I posted NONE are being honest, do I need to find more?

[Toyarzee]

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon

I think even then it's referred to as a capital expenditure because it's a depreciating asset.

Originally Posted by strat61caster

How do you have any money left for a car with all those $5 words?

It's actually considered a capital ASSET, which does still mean it's depreciable personal property. If it's used for business purposes, it may even stretch to equate as section 1231 property so the Service can recapture that depreciation expense taken in excess of its resale price basis in the course of business on your Sch. C...

Edit: and thx to you guys and friends for turning another stupid thread into entertainment. I never play games or anything on my phone at work, just browse this forum