Boosted BRZ/FR-S vs 997 Carrera S

[kiichiro]

Originally Posted by jsimon7777

Buying a twin to make it as fast as a Porsche is silly. Buying a twin to have a fun car to flog is smart. Buying a Porsche to flog is expensive. Buying a twin to make a custom car is expensive.

your wisdom is blindingly correct
do expound more, oh great wise one

[gdrider77]

I love the porsches, and when i was looking at my twin, it was something i was seriously considering. In the end, I decided a brand new 86 to be modded and worked on was a better option, than a used 911. The costs to modify and work on a porsche vs the 86 is what was the deciding factor for me. I really enjoy how easy and cheap it is to work on my 86.

I am a car guy and grew up working on and modifying cars most my life, as does my dad. He is a big lotus guy and has a few of those, so always a bit of bias towards the lotus brand, but i have always leaned more towards domestic/import.

I have owned a couple garaged weekend sports cars, a mustang gt, mildly modded, and most recently a C6 vette, bone stock bought new, i drove it a total of 1800 miles then sold it. That thing was pretty fast stock, but boring, and felt very scary at speeds over 100mph. Although i loved the v8 sound.

I have never enjoyed a car more than my 86. Its a great enthusiast car.

To be fair, mine is not a DD and i have put close to $20k into it, but for me its also about the time spent doing the work myself. I enjoy sitting in my garage working on my vehicles. Sure i could have spent the (roughly) $50k that i spent on my 86 on a used porsche for equal performance, but i would have missed out on all the fun i had building my car. I spent more on my c6 vette than my 86, but i can tell you, i enjoy my 86 way more than i ever did the vette. And i like to think it handles and performs better than the vette did, although i do miss the targa top.....

I am kind of getting bored with my 86 now, and have contemplated looking at something new. My current plan is to finish track prepping the 86, track a few years, beat it up, then once its destroyed, move on. Porsche will probably be my next sports car, but not for 3-5 years im thinking. Really just depends on how much life i get out of the 86. Who knows.

[Turbowned]

Originally Posted by Teseo

OP think if he have a Porsche will not mod it.Let me say something, you will mod it

No doubt I will do a few small things, however many of the things I've modified on my BRZ I wouldn't have to do on the Porsche because it already has, such as leather trim and Alcantara headliner, Brembo brakes, etc. I would be happy with the factory wheels and exhaust for a lot longer than I would with the ones on the BRZ which I changed after only a month, too.

My situation is a little different as I would be replacing both my BRZ and my RS6 which has a very high cost of upkeep. Modifications for that car are no less expensive. Also, modifying two cars is certainly more expensive than modifying one, and I want to do work to the RS6 as well, lol. The only reason my RS6 is still stock is because I haven't been able to afford anything beyond regular upkeep.

Originally Posted by bfrank1972

Unless you're blowing motors right and left, trust me it is. They go through tires faster, tires will likely be more expensive, brakes are a lot more expensive, heck it takes 9 quarts of oil for an oil change

I just put $1,000 worth of tires on the BRZ. I'm putting $2,200 worth of brakes on it next (STi Brembos, DBA rotors, Goodridge SS lines, Hawk pads). With a Perrin oil cooler ($650 add-on to BRZ that would already be on the Porsche), the oil capacity in the BRZ is 7 quarts and recommended interval is 6,000 miles. The Porsche recommended interval is 15,000 miles (though I would likely do it every 7,500 if it gets tracked). Consumables would be marginally more expensive.

Originally Posted by boaterok

Having had a 01 Super Cup and a RS America to road race it all boils down to who would you rather hang out with a bunch of great people with BRZ/FR-S OR I better bite my tongue it is Christmas

Hehe, I see what you're getting at. The BRZ/FR-S community is a great one, indeed. Only thing that bugs me are the people who absolutely rice them out (they're usually not members on this forum). The likelihood of seeing a riced out 911 is significantly lower, however I can imagine the average Porsche driver isn't nearly as fun to hang out with

[bfrank1972]

Originally Posted by Turbowned

I just put $1,000 worth of tires on the BRZ. I'm putting $2,200 worth of brakes on it next (STi Brembos, DBA rotors, Goodridge SS lines, Hawk pads). With a Perrin oil cooler ($650 add-on to BRZ that would already be on the Porsche), the oil capacity in the BRZ is 7 quarts and recommended interval is 6,000 miles. The Porsche recommended interval is 15,000 miles (though I would likely do it every 7,500 if it gets tracked). Consumables would be marginally more expensive.

Then do it man! I don't think you'll regret it, unless you think you'll miss the tinkering aspect of modding. Mods will be more expensive on the 997 - but the stock 997S overall is just much more car than most modified street BRZs. Now you have me thinking....

[Turbowned]

Originally Posted by murselyfe

$13k without forced induction or brakes or coils?!

Originally Posted by campy

Please respond to this OP. I am very curious about how someone spends that much money on cosmetic mods.

Prodrive Japan wheels were $3,600
Bridgestone RE11's were $1,000
JPM Coachworks full custom interior was over $3,000
Perrin header-back catted/resonated exhaust $1,500
Tomei EL header with Swain Tech ceramic coat $1,000
TOM'S taillights $490
Carsmo spoiler $360
BPS short throw with shift knob $290
Whiteline shift bushing $35
Perrin oil cooler $650
Koyo radiator and Venair hoses $440
HKS air inlet duct $200
Greddy magdrain plug $30
clear sidemarkers $110
frameless rearview $110
Cusco accel pedal and drift knob $80
Eibach sportline springs $250
2013 STi Brembo calipers (to-be-installed) $1,200
OEM trunk mat $50
replica rear diffuser $100
EUDM floor mats $110

There's more stuff I'm forgetting but you get the idea. Add $3000+ for Ohlins coilovers, another couple grand for supporting suspension mods, thousand for rotors and pads F/R ($1600 if going with 2pc), and forced induction kit of choice and we're up to over $45,000. There's a lot of nicely depreciated cars that could be bought in that price range if you've got a good independent euro mechanic (which I do).

Or maybe wait 2-3 years, part the car out and sell it as stock, and buy something in the $65k range. Get some more enjoyment out of the RS6, too. There's no way I'd keep the RS6 and 911 at the same time; too much depreciated German metal for one garage! The 997.2's ought to be more affordable by then, as well as 07-08 Aston DB9's

[murselyfe]

Originally Posted by Turbowned

Prodrive Japan wheels were $3,600
Bridgestone RE11's were $1,000
JPM Coachworks full custom interior was over $3,000
Perrin header-back catted/resonated exhaust $1,500
Tomei EL header with Swain Tech ceramic coat $1,000
TOM'S taillights $490
Carsmo spoiler $360
BPS short throw with shift knob $290
Whiteline shift bushing $35
Perrin oil cooler $650
Koyo radiator and Venair hoses $440
HKS air inlet duct $200
Greddy magdrain plug $30
clear sidemarkers $110
frameless rearview $110
Cusco accel pedal and drift knob $80
Eibach sportline springs $250
2013 STi Brembo calipers (to-be-installed) $1,200
OEM trunk mat $50
replica rear diffuser $100
EUDM floor mats $110

There's more stuff I'm forgetting but you get the idea. Add $3000+ for Ohlins coilovers, another couple grand for supporting suspension mods, thousand for rotors and pads F/R ($1600 if going with 2pc), and forced induction kit of choice and we're up to over $45,000. There's a lot of nicely depreciated cars that could be bought in that price range if you've got a good independent euro mechanic (which I do).

Or maybe wait 2-3 years, part the car out and sell it as stock, and buy something in the $65k range. Get some more enjoyment out of the RS6, too. There's no way I'd keep the RS6 and 911 at the same time; too much depreciated German metal for one garage! The 997.2's ought to be more affordable by then, as well as 07-08 Aston DB9's

Holy cow.

Did you pay MSRP for most of your items? I don't dare add up what I've spent so far...

[bfrank1972]

Originally Posted by Turbowned

Prodrive Japan wheels were $3,600
Bridgestone RE11's were $1,000
JPM Coachworks full custom interior was over $3,000
Perrin header-back catted/resonated exhaust $1,500
Tomei EL header with Swain Tech ceramic coat $1,000
TOM'S taillights $490
Carsmo spoiler $360
BPS short throw with shift knob $290
Whiteline shift bushing $35
Perrin oil cooler $650
Koyo radiator and Venair hoses $440
HKS air inlet duct $200
Greddy magdrain plug $30
clear sidemarkers $110
frameless rearview $110
Cusco accel pedal and drift knob $80
Eibach sportline springs $250
2013 STi Brembo calipers (to-be-installed) $1,200
OEM trunk mat $50
replica rear diffuser $100
EUDM floor mats $110

There's more stuff I'm forgetting but you get the idea. Add $3000+ for Ohlins coilovers, another couple grand for supporting suspension mods, thousand for rotors and pads F/R ($1600 if going with 2pc), and forced induction kit of choice and we're up to over $45,000. There's a lot of nicely depreciated cars that could be bought in that price range if you've got a good independent euro mechanic (which I do).

Or maybe wait 2-3 years, part the car out and sell it as stock, and buy something in the $65k range. Get some more enjoyment out of the RS6, too. There's no way I'd keep the RS6 and 911 at the same time; too much depreciated German metal for one garage! The 997.2's ought to be more affordable by then, as well as 07-08 Aston DB9's

Another suggestion, how about a 996 GT3? They aren't quite as pretty as the 997's but they are tremendous cars, and actually more reliable to boot- good ones are in the same range as 997.2's (though I realize the bottom line is inflating here). Running costs should be similar.

[Turbowned]

I can't do a 996 unless it's a Turbo, but even then I still think I'd rather a 997.

[Racecomp Engineering]

I'm sick at the moment and glad I ran across this and will reply shortly.

Shory History: have owned and raced and driven the P brand for the last 30 years. ( I'm 47 ).

I will weigh in tomorrow when I feel better.

Myles

[Pekingduck]

As long as you have the wallet for it. I find if I bought a porsche I wouldn't be able to afford to modify it the way I wanted to. The upkeep and the cost of aftermarket what keep me away from the higher end cars.

[Ganthrithor]

Originally Posted by Turbowned

Certainly not a bad thing, but this had me thinking: why didn't I just buy a faster car to begin with? Like a used 911?

'Cause it doesn't have dat trunk?

Honestly, if you're gonna drive it on the street and can afford either one, having a trunk that can fit actual things inside is pretty much the only reason to buy a BRZ over a used 911 that I can think of. I'd set aside some modding money for either one (factory cars need suspension tweaks to drive right), but given a similar list of tweaks for each the 911 will always drive better. If nothing else there's no way to work around the fact that the 911 has weight in the right places and a shorter wheelbase.

I haven't driven a 997 in years (I autoxed one forever ago), but I remember it being a fun car that you could trail-brake into fun slides. And of course they sound great.

The 86 is a great car but if you have the cash for a 911 and don't need the practicality of the BRZ, buy a 911.

[jvincent]

Originally Posted by Ganthrithor

Honestly, if you're gonna drive it on the street and can afford either one, having a trunk that can fit actual things inside is pretty much the only reason to buy a BRZ over a used 911 that I can think of.

Trunks are important.

One of the "must haves" when I was choosing my car was the ability to fit at least two sets of golf clubs in the car.

With the rear seats down in the FRS, I can do that. It allows me to take the FRS on golfing road trips with a lucky passenger.

[Turbowned]

Actually it's funny you mention that; at the time I was car shopping I did prioritize the BRZ having a usable trunk as opposed to the Miata and the S2000. Now that I have a midsize sedan as a daily driver I don't really care what the sports car has for space or practicality.

[EAGLE5]

Remember, if you drive a Porsche, you're a cock. That's why they call it the Cockster.

FR-S is significantly shorter yet has a longer wheelbase. Far lighter. Better fuel economy. The 996 interior is shit. 997 is nice, though. Porsche seats are uncomfortable, at least for me. To my knowledge, no movie stars have died in an FR-S.

Really, though, it's about cost of running and maintaining a Porsche versus the joy you get for that money. The FR-S, like the Abarth, like a Fiesta ST, is a screaming bargain.