Winter Tracking Tires ?

[RFB]

Originally Posted by 7thgear

the reality is that you should be asking this in a tarmac rally forum, not the wheel and tire section of an FRS forum.


maybe find a Finnish forum and ask them what they scoot around on in their areas.


in fact, a quick google search for wrc winter tarmac tires brought me around to this little gem. So go nuts.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....nter+Sottozero

Went through all that when we set up and ran the Jeep Cup off road rallies before it went international. Maybe there's more out there now.
Lookin good, Thanx !



CERBERUS

[7thgear]

Originally Posted by RFB

It seems you have a habit of intraweb sparring for the sake of sparring, (a troll, gotta have the last word), so for the good of all if you wish to continue I suggest you do it through PM's from now on otherwise you are a waste of bandwidth.

the only habbit I have is letting people know what's up


it is only natural they take offense, since none enjoy being put on the spot, but I pray for the rare times when the message gets through


you believe this forum to be a wealthy encyclopedia, you couldn't be further from the truth. This is a young forum based around a new car. The vast majority of whom never have, and never will, come even remotely close to competition.

Most discuss the more immediate aspects of car ownership and meet for coffee and leaf tea...

Those few who do, rarely take the scientific approach and simply share personal experiences, which often can be poked full of holes if given enough scrutiny... which tends to get people upset.


so I revert back to my initial claim on the first page


you've come to a beer hall looking for a vintage chardonnay, enjoy.


EDIT: and I won't take to PMs to end what another has started.

[RFB]

Originally Posted by 7thgear

the only habbit I have is letting people know what's up





you believe this forum to be a wealthy encyclopedia, you couldn't be further from the truth. This is a young forum based around a new car. The vast majority of whom never have, and never will, come even remotely close to competition.


so I revert back to my initial claim on the first page


you've come to a beer hall looking for a vintage chardonnay, enjoy.

I am amazed at your abilty to know what I believe.
However, you are incorrect.
I do not believe nor have I ever stated what you say I said.
What I believe is quite different than your prejudical view.


As this is the main worldwide site for our cars, it has been a cornucopia of information on everything about our cars, and calling it a beer hall in your context is an insult to the operators and users of the site (it may have been true at the beginning but not now).

This forum CAN be and HAS been an encyclopedia (getting wealthier all the time), but yes you are absolutely correct in the phenomenon of newbies, idiots and trolls offering inexperienced or stupid opinions on a new car platform in which experienced opinions are sparse (until the experience happens).

We do have to do a LOT of gleaning to separate the valid info from the bullcrap, but isn't that the nature of all intraweb forums ?

I have heard that the main man is a bit of a crank, but I am grateful for his
efforts at running this valuable forum and wish him and ft86club.com and its contributors success in all future endeavours.

And yes, I am even also grateful for your contributions (after gleaning LOL).
By the way - you'd be surprised by what I've found in beer halls (besides beer LOL).




CEREBRI

[Dezoris]

RE960AS Potenza can be run on track and on snow.
Truth is you can run any winter tire on track, but there are penalties on wear rate and grip. Depends on what you value.

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by RFB

Can't go fast on steelies.

And yep, not much useful info here, but I was hoping someone in the great white frozen north has had some experience in trying to corner fast when it's below R spec temps.

Why does the type of wheel matter in the slightest if you can go fast or not?

As for helpful info... you've been given some, but chose to ignore it because it wasn't the answer you wanted.

I bet if you play with tire pressures the summer tires will heat up properly and work very well in colder temps. I had zero issues with my ZII's at ~10* C in the rain, or my RS3's at ~5*C in the wet. Both times I started with lower pressures to help them heat up.

Also, first page of google results for "track tire for cold weather" brought this up:

http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-revi...s-track-tested

If they were able to run many laps with no measurable wear, what are you doing to winter tires that is shredding them to pieces?

The best compromise for COLD lapping is probably going to be a shaved performance winter tire. Shaved will give less squirm, but you'll still have the compound meant for cold weather.

[7thgear]

excellent link, Will

[Pat]

I'm LMAO over here. The article states, "... at the end of a hard session of high-speed lapping, the Wintersports didn’t exhibit any measurable or visible wear at all."

Then they show this picture:


Yeah...no visible wear at all. Everyone's snow tires look like that.

[7thgear]

I've driven snow tires at the track in the spring


I was mindful of what I was doing obviously, but still giving it... of course they'll wear, but they won't be shredded by any standards


likewise, I tend to put my winters on early and ride them well into the spring, I usually get 3-4 seasons out of a set no problems, and I only replace them out of fear of them being heat cycled out.. never because of wear.




honestly, I encourage everyone to take their car out on the track on snows at least once, just to see whats up.

[RFB]

Originally Posted by wparsons

Why does the type of wheel matter in the slightest if you can go fast or not?

As for helpful info... you've been given some, but chose to ignore it because it wasn't the answer you wanted.

I bet if you play with tire pressures the summer tires will heat up properly and work very well in colder temps. I had zero issues with my ZII's at ~10* C in the rain, or my RS3's at ~5*C in the wet. Both times I started with lower pressures to help them heat up.

Also, first page of google results for "track tire for cold weather" brought this up:

http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-revi...s-track-tested

If they were able to run many laps with no measurable wear, what are you doing to winter tires that is shredding them to pieces?

The best compromise for COLD lapping is probably going to be a shaved performance winter tire. Shaved will give less squirm, but you'll still have the compound meant for cold weather.

"Why does the type of wheel matter in the slightest if you can go fast or not ?" - Are you serious ?

And your evidence that I ignored info ? Repeating my request in a more specific clarifying manner to get more specific info is not ignoring information.

As for your link, since I could not find the temperature the test was conducted at, I am assuming that it was at the temps designed for the tire - freezing and ergo it would not melt. It did make a valid point though.

My original question was not posed to enter into debate as to how many angels can dance on the head of a pin, but for a practical need.

In my area we have a lot of spring and fall weather between snow tire and R-Spec temps (freezing to 10C). I seek a tire that will be stickier than R-Specs above freezing.
I am tracking next week and the temps will be 3 to 8 Degrees C.

At winter temps there are smooth winter tires that are sticky but by then the snow puts my car in hibernation.

Simple question, complicated by forum trolling, snotiness, self esteem issues, ego's etc. - standard forum discourse nowadays it seems.



But still worth asking !



CERBERUS

[wparsons]

Where in Canada are you? I would bet that a typical fast street tire (not R compound) will have more grip if pressures are set correctly for the temperatures than an all season or winter tire will in 0-10*C.

Like I said, I had zero issues with RS3 v2's in 5* and rain or ZII's in ~10* and rain. Sure there's less grip than a 30* dry day, but they're definitely better than the stock tires, all seasons, snows, etc.

[RFB]

Originally Posted by wparsons

Where in Canada are you? I would bet that a typical fast street tire (not R compound) will have more grip if pressures are set correctly for the temperatures than an all season or winter tire will in 0-10*C.

Like I said, I had zero issues with RS3 v2's in 5* and rain or ZII's in ~10* and rain. Sure there's less grip than a 30* dry day, but they're definitely better than the stock tires, all seasons, snows, etc.

Any experiences with a fast street tire ? Any suggestions ?



CERBERUS

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by RFB

Any experiences with a fast street tire ? Any suggestions ?

Seriously? I gave my thoughts on ZII's and RS3's twice already. Both are great street tires, and not R compounds.

[7thgear]

Originally Posted by wparsons

Seriously? I gave my thoughts on ZII's and RS3's twice already. Both are great street tires, and not R compounds.

He's basically waiting for someone that drives on non factory all-seasons or similar class tire... ie the stuff you can find on the walls of a Canadian Tire or Wallmart auto service section.... who also happen to take automotive competition seriously....to post comments....and getting really antsy because somehow (gasp) more people aren't leading the way in this niche endeavor, all the while labeling everyone a troll who points out the rather flawed foundation of his assumptions as to what it is that he wants.

But.. that's not at all what he's actually thinking, because heaven forbid that a person's words could be interpreted in anything but the thoughts not actually written down.

He's dismissing the high performance tires, because obviously they'll just freeze over


and he's dismissing the snow tires, because obviously they'll melt


so I say leave him be in his quest to find this magical, low temperature tire that's a snow tire but not a snow tire with deceptively high performance qualities

gnomesane?


at this point it's rather comical

[RFB]

Originally Posted by wparsons

Seriously? I gave my thoughts on ZII's and RS3's twice already. Both are great street tires, and not R compounds.

Yes you are absolutely correct that Direzza's are technically street tires and listed as so but with R compound characteristics, but they are also a great track tire, I luv em !

Unfortunately ineffective for me between freezing and 50 degree's F.