Maybe the FT-86 doesnt need massive power........

[PAImportTuner]

Originally Posted by tranzformer

I noticed you originally had it at 9:45 then changed it to 9:05+.

The Golf Mk V GTI did 8:53. I would expect something similar to that.

Yeah it was a ninja edit. I was getting too harsh lol.

[82mm 4g63]

If a 250hp, 3600lb, AWD R32 turd can clock in at 8:36 than the FR-S can do it in 8:35. Especially if the FR-S weighs in at 2700 with 200hp. Trying to be optimistic

[Aki]

My guess would be around 8:40, but I couldn't care less what the time is.

[TriggerTRD]

Originally Posted by blur

Apparently the 2011 GTR ran a 7:24. I dont see the LFA's time as impressive now, lol.

It was done on street tyres and wasnt a full effort. They are hoping for a 7:15 time when they go for a proper run

Impressive when its done I'm sure

The GT2 RS is a stripped out racecar and did that time on slicks - as compared to the LF-A (street tyres) and the Corvette is just an animal so all credit to the Vette for its time (also was done on slicks btw)

[tranzformer]

Originally Posted by TriggerTRD

The GT2 RS is a stripped out racecar and did that time on slicks - as compared to the LF-A (street tyres) and the Corvette is just an animal so all credit to the Vette for its time (also was done on slicks btw)

I wouldn't call the GT2 RS stripped out. You are thinking of the GT3 RSR .



Btw the GT2 RS was done on OEM michelin pilot super sport cup tires. I wouldn't consider that in the same sentence as a Hoosier RS6.

Also since you are making all the comparisons why not mention the fact you get more performance with the GT2 RS for 1/2 price compared to the LFA?

[Kage]

^ Gah damn that's a sexy as interior. I hope we have something half as nice in the 86

[Maxim]

Originally Posted by PAImportTuner

9:05+

C5 Corvette, S2k, Boxster S, 350Z and Lotus Exige run 8:40s

Originally Posted by tranzformer

^ I know you have issues with the car, but seriously slower than a GTI?

Agreed completely. I think it will hit around the 9 minute mark.

It absolutely will be slower around the ring than a GTI. I have a GTI....the torque advantage alone MORE than makes up for the ~300 extra pounds of weight, and with summer tires the GTI pulls over .9g. The FT-86 won't produce higher grip, and it won't accelerate as well due to the lack of torque, especially at low speeds.

Don't even get me started on mods....I've put $1500 into my car and it puts 240hp to the wheels. $1500 in mods on a 2.0L non-turbo might net you 15-20hp....not 65-70.

The old adage "horsepower sells cars, torque wins races" is true. The reduction in necessary shifts as well as the huge advantage accelerating out of low speed corners means significantly faster lap times. Look at the Car and Driver lightning lap results for production cars: The 2011 Mustang GT with the track-package brembo brakes and re-calibrated suspension pulled essentially the same lap time as the nearly 300lb heavier base Camaro SS. Why? The SS has a 6.2L V8 that produces insane torque, improving acceleration out of every single corner, while the DOHC 5.0 in the mustang has similar power numbers but less torque, delivered at higher RPM.

200hp is FINE in a car like this, especially if it's 2700lbs. But if it wants to be competitive it should have an equal torque rating, or it should produce a higher HP number. Yes, I know the car is about the handling and the feel....but for 95% of owners, it's going to be driven on the street, where it is illegal and irresponsible to take advantage of the at-the-limit handling advantages. If Toyota wants the car to succeed with buyers it needs to offer a car that excels at real world performance.

I would be happier with an FT-86 that produced 200hp and 200lb/ft than one that produced 240hp and 150lb/ft.

[Maxim]

Originally Posted by TriggerTRD

It was done on street tyres and wasnt a full effort. They are hoping for a 7:15 time when they go for a proper run

Impressive when its done I'm sure

The GT2 RS is a stripped out racecar and did that time on slicks - as compared to the LF-A (street tyres) and the Corvette is just an animal so all credit to the Vette for its time (also was done on slicks btw)

No, the vette's time was not done on slicks. It was done on the fully street legal R compound tires that are offered from the factory. They absolutely are not slicks.

[Maxim]

Originally Posted by 82mm 4g63

If a 250hp, 3600lb, AWD R32 turd can clock in at 8:36 than the FR-S can do it in 8:35. Especially if the FR-S weighs in at 2700 with 200hp. Trying to be optimistic

The Ring is a high-speed course. The advantage of that extra 50hp is HUGE on a track like that. The FR-S will simply not be able to match it because of that.

[TriggerTRD]

@ Maxim,

Check out the link to the lap times on my first post.
According to wikipedia:

The Vette:-
General Motors conducted test,[9] base specification car with optional super-slick track DOT competition tires (Michelin Pilot Sport Cup Zero Pressure)[10] and non-stock safety equipment, video confirmed.

The RS:-
Manufacturer claim. OEM Michelin Pilot Sport Cup super-slick competition DOT tires used.

[Maxim]

Originally Posted by TriggerTRD

@ Maxim,

Check out the link to the lap times on my first post.
According to wikipedia:

The Vette:-
General Motors conducted test,[9] base specification car with optional super-slick track DOT competition tires (Michelin Pilot Sport Cup Zero Pressure)[10] and non-stock safety equipment, video confirmed.

The RS:-
Manufacturer claim. OEM Michelin Pilot Sport Cup super-slick competition DOT tires used.

Yeah, one problem: You said According to Wikipedia. I could simply go on there and edit it to whatever I wanted.

A simple search of popular automotive sources (I generally use autoblog) as well as Chevrolet's own website shows that the 7:22 run the latest Z06 pulled off was done with the Z06 Carbon package (specifically the Z07 suspension/tire package), which includes the optional suspension upgrade and street legal R compound tires by michelin (Michelin Pilot Sport PS2). (same type of tire as Porsche uses on the RS vehicles). The safety equipment ADDS weight as well.

The tires are fully street legal, non-slicks, and offered from the factory. I think you should look up the definition of slicks, as the GT2 RS also did not run on slicks. R compound street tires are just street tires with extremely aggressive tread compositions, and they're still nowhere near the performance of an actual track slick.

You should probably also rethink your usage of Wikipedia as a source of information....it's edited by people who don't understand the difference between these kinds of things and it's full of errors.

[Maxim]

Man, reading this thread and a couple of the other ones, I might be a bit pessimistic about this car's chances on the marketplace given the competition, but there's a whole hell of a lot of people here who are going to be extremely disappointed when this car comes out and ends up being non-competitive on any objective measure with it's primary competition....

It's going to put up performance numbers on par with the 8th Gen Civic Si. It's not going to perform like a type-R, and it's not going to run with a 370z or Cayman on the 'Ring....

[CyberFormula]

I thought i read in another thread

that the Subaru's boxer engine produced equal hp/tq numbers...and its Naturally aspirated.

[TriggerTRD]

Maxim,

Take a chill pill buddy.
I didnt post this thread to start a flame war for the LF-A vs GT2 vs Vette, the reason I posted it was because if Toyota/Lexus can make a car that pushes less power than its competitors and is slower in a straight line than some, yet run a much faster lap, then surely some of the tech must have filtered down to this Concept.

All out horsepower and torque doesnt define a cars performance, its power delivery and balance, aerodynamics and mass also play a huge factor. If the FT86 is well balanced and handles as if on rails, it will be able to take in more speed through the corners and accelerate quick out also thus not requiring huge HP to overcome all out speed.

I apologise for not doing more research in regards to wikipedia, etc.