Best Braking Upgrade Progression for Daily Driving

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by LRNAD90

Does it add a lot of weight? Essex claims their 299mm AP Sprint kit removes 20 lbs from the front end of the car over stock brakes (Assuming that is 10 pounds per side)..

"Saves 20 unsprung lbs. from nose of vs. OEM brakes"

Even the larger 325mm kit claims a 10 lbs total weight saving..

For daily driving, I agree there is probably no discernable benefit in braking performance with big brake kits, though its never a bad thing to lose unsprung weight..

OEMs typically ADD more weight with brake upgrades.

Less rotor mass = less sink = larger temp swings.

Always balance the brake system "upgrade" with needs and use case.

[timurrrr]

Originally Posted by CincyJohn

So then how come the aftermarket calipers don’t look like the stock? Seems pretty unbelievable that they would add that weight and sacrifice performance just to look good for “some” people.

The aftermarket calipers that don't look like stock are typically also made out aluminum.

[RToyo86]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

While in theory the DS2500 and CP fill the same role, the CP is quieter, less dust, and a substantially higher temperature tolerance, and provided similarly appropriate usage for each pad, more than enough longer life to justify the extra cost.

Seems reasonable given they're optimized for this platform. Just hard pill to swallow with Canadian conversation which would put it closer to $1200.

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by LRNAD90

Does it add a lot of weight? Essex claims their 299mm AP Sprint kit removes 20 lbs from the front end of the car over stock brakes (Assuming that is 10 pounds per side)..

"Saves 20 unsprung lbs. from nose of vs. OEM brakes"

Even the larger 325mm kit claims a 10 lbs total weight saving..

For daily driving, I agree there is probably no discernable benefit in braking performance with big brake kits, though its never a bad thing to lose unsprung weight..

A lot of that weight savings is in the two piece rotor with aluminum hat.

[removedonut]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

The CSG CP is exactly that pad you're been looking for. Less dust than stock. No noise. More stopping power than stock. MASSIVELY elevated capacity for heat over stock.

Funny, I have these bookmarked in my car parts folder for when I kill the stock pads lol. Heard great things about them, hopefully the performance lives up to the pricetag.

[dragoontwo]

Originally Posted by Pat

Yeah, that's a LOT of money for pads, to be sure. I'm told with the AP 9660 (?) calipers they'll last a lonnng time. I guess I'll find out.

I hope you're not talking about the cp pads with those. Unless something changed, CSG doesn't do that compound for those.

[Pat]

Originally Posted by dragoontwo

I hope you're not talking about the cp pads with those. Unless something changed, CSG doesn't do that compound for those.

Thank you. I thought I had a set of them in my basement. But according to this website they are not available, as you said. I looked up the part number on the box that I DO have (DR35.18.SP1) and it is just isn't there. Maybe @CSGmike can shed some light on this for us.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by dragoontwo

I hope you're not talking about the cp pads with those. Unless something changed, CSG doesn't do that compound for those.

There are MANY pads (unlisted fitments, unlisted compounds), that may be available by request or referral only.

That said, I personally wouldn't run a street pad with a race caliper, but it may uniquely fit Pat's scenario.

[dragoontwo]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

There are MANY pads (unlisted fitments, unlisted compounds), that may be available by request or referral only.

That said, I personally wouldn't run a street pad with a race caliper, but it may uniquely fit Pat's scenario.

When you told me this when I asked about CP for Essex calipers.

That's a racing caliper, and shouldn't ever be running a street pad.

[Pat]

Mike and I have had many discussions about my "compromise" car. I make known sacrifices in some areas to better fit my priorities in others. My choice is an uncommon one. My car gets used in a much wider variety of scenarios than the vast majority of BRZs.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by dragoontwo

When you told me this when I asked about CP for Essex calipers.

That's a racing caliper, and shouldn't ever be running a street pad.

I still stand by that.

[OkieSnuffBox]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

That said, I personally wouldn't run a street pad with a race caliper, but it may uniquely fit Pat's scenario.

Any particular reason why? I'm just curious.

[Pat]

There are a few factors. I only want to have one car. But I want to use it to ski most weeks during the 1/3rd of the year. I often ski above 12,000 feet, so it's cold where I go. I drive the car on 2,000 mile road trips annually. I get in 20-30 track days annually. The car will wear snow tires and 200TW tires. The car won't see dramatic power increases due to forced induction.
All of this adds up to a very diverse use case. Any time one sets up a car for this there will be compromises. A specialty tool will always have the potential to outperform a more generic tool.
So why use AP 9660s with CPs on my car? The heat capacity and cooling capability of the 9660 caliper with 355 mm rotors will keep the pads within their intended operating heat range.
I was surprised to hear this, too. But JRitt thinks DS2500s would also get the job done. So while I'm skeptical about using a single pad compound for winter mountain driving and tracking with 200 TW tires, there are people that know much more about brakes than I do that seem to think this is a viable option given my priorities.
Time will tell.

[timurrrr]

Originally Posted by Pat

There are a few factors. I only want to have one car. But I want to use it to ski most weeks during the 1/3rd of the year. I often ski above 12,000 feet, so it's cold where I go. I drive the car on 2,000 mile road trips annually. I get in 20-30 track days annually. The car will wear snow tires and 200TW tires.

As you're already changing tires/wheels twice a year, you could as well swap pads?