1st G-force test of my 2017 BRZ.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Gforce

This chassis is pathetically incompetent in winter. The fact that you think otherwise confirms you do not know how to drive, in winter or summer. Everybody who knows anything about driving knows that this chassis is incompetent even in the wet, let alone actual snow.

.

Originally Posted by Gforce

For the street ultra high performance all season tires are perfect for the BRZ.

Apparently not since you are the very first person that I have ever seen make this statement.
Guess that is what happens when you totally screw up your suspension.

[nikitopo]

Come on guys, I think it is pretty obvious that winter tires are superior to all season tires for snow. Here if you don't have a tire with the M+S symbol and police stop you or you have an accident, then you might have trouble.





All season tires is just a compromise for the Winter. My Forester came with all season tires, because it is cheaper than to swap tires every year or pay to store them during Summer. Some people do not have their own garage, so they have to pay for storing them.

[2013dgmbrzdood]

Originally Posted by Gforce

Get winters and keep the DWS. They get better and better to use as summer tires as they wear. For the street ultra high performance all season tires are perfect for the BRZ.

The fact ypu recommend the dws as a summer tire proves you know zip.

I'm also very curious what information you have backing up the chassis is bad in adverse weather. I think in the contray it is you who doesn't know how to drive.
I bet you have stock shocks that are crap don't you, thats why you think the chassis is bad.

Btw I dunno if you like arguing or what but incase you are a real nutcase everyone sees your a complete and utter moron when it comes to cars. Do you really even have a license? No way you are over 18. I call bs.

[Gforce]

Originally Posted by nikitopo

Come on guys, I think it is pretty obvious that winter tires are superior to all season tires for snow. Here if you don't have a tire with the M+S symbol and police stop you or you have an accident, then you might have trouble.





All season tires is just a compromise for the Winter. My Forester came with all season tires, because it is cheaper than to swap tires every year or pay to store them during Summer. Some people do not have their own garage, so they have to pay for storing them.

The new Crossclimate bears that other important symbol: the mountain/snowflake indicating industry approved winter tire capability. M+S just means Mud and Snow which is the all season designation.

[ame]https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LNR-uzGWQJ4[/ame]

So, no, it is no longer obvious that winter tires are superior to "all season" tires, it depends which all season tires you are talking about, and, more importantly, what winter conditions you need to be able to deal with.

[Gforce]

Originally Posted by 2013dgmbrzdood

The fact ypu recommend the dws as a summer tire proves you know zip.

I'm also very curious what information you have backing up the chassis is bad in adverse weather. I think in the contray it is you who doesn't know how to drive.
I bet you have stock shocks that are crap don't you, thats why you think the chassis is bad.

Btw I dunno if you like arguing or what but incase you are a real nutcase everyone sees your a complete and utter moron when it comes to cars. Do you really even have a license? No way you are over 18. I call bs.

Anyone who knows anything about driving has complained about this chassis in the wet. It is comically incompetent in stock form on even wet roads. It is easy to find opinions to that effect. No change in tires or shocks can fix that problem. As a direct result, the ability of this chassis to handle severe winter conditions is, to put it as kindly as possible, hilarious. In reality, the BRZ just can't handle severe winter conditions regardless of the abilities of the snow tires.

This is why you can drift this car right off the showroom floor. Serious drivers everywhere know this is a fault. The car is slow as a result.

[Gforce]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Apparently not since you are the very first person that I have ever seen make this statement.
Guess that is what happens when you totally screw up your suspension.

Apparently none of you has kept up with the latest developments in tire technology. That's possibly why you keep handing out decades old advice as if you'd just discovered the wheel.

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by Gforce

So, no, it is no longer obvious that winter tires are superior to "all season" tires, it depends which all season tires you are talking about, and, more importantly, what winter conditions you need to be able to deal with.

I mentioned all season tires in general. A single tire cannot define a whole category. Crossclimate is better, but there is no way to be on par with a real snow tire. Where is the brake test in snow conditions?

Originally Posted by Gforce

Anyone who knows anything about driving has complained about this chassis in the wet.

What are you talking about? Do you have any idea what a RWD car means and how it should be driven on the wet?

Originally Posted by Gforce

Apparently none of you has kept up with the latest developments in tire technology. That's possibly why you keep handing out decades old advice as if you'd just discovered the wheel.

Apparently you don't have a life and want to prove something in a forum. This is my last word to you and I 'll just ignore you in the future. It really doesn't worth it and everyone else tells you the same.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Gforce

Anyone who knows anything about driving has complained about this chassis in the wet. It is comically incompetent in stock form on even wet roads. It is easy to find opinions to that effect. No change in tires or shocks can fix that problem. As a direct result, the ability of this chassis to handle severe winter conditions is, to put it as kindly as possible, hilarious. In reality, the BRZ just can't handle severe winter conditions regardless of the abilities of the snow tires.

This is why you can drift this car right off the showroom floor. Serious drivers everywhere know this is a fault. The car is slow as a result.

I gotta ask although I will no doubt get yet another bullshit answer. How often do you drive in the winter? What tires do you actually use? How does being a "good" driver cause problems in snow or rain? Shouldn't a "good" driver know how to drive in these without issues?

Originally Posted by Gforce

Apparently none of you has kept up with the latest developments in tire technology. That's possibly why you keep handing out decades old advice as if you'd just discovered the wheel.

You still have never answered me why they still make snows then. Have snows stopped developing while AS have gone through this magical change? You are dishing out decades old opinions on snow tires since most work perfectly well on dry or wet pavement now. No, they are not a summer tire since they get as soft as pillows in warm weather but in cold, snow and ice they outperform AS tires to several degrees.


I have most certainly kept up with the technology which is why I chose the Pilot Sport AS3 Plus as my new tires. They are quieter, perform well in wet conditions and extend the season that I don't have to run snows by a couple of months since they are well reviewed in lower (but still above freezing) temperatures and LIGHT snow. I would be a fool to think they replace proper MODERN winter tires in heavy snow, ice or sub zero temperatures though.

[2013dgmbrzdood]

Originally Posted by Gforce

Anyone who knows anything about driving has complained about this chassis in the wet. It is comically incompetent in stock form on even wet roads. It is easy to find opinions to that effect. No change in tires or shocks can fix that problem. As a direct result, the ability of this chassis to handle severe winter conditions is, to put it as kindly as possible, hilarious. In reality, the BRZ just can't handle severe winter conditions regardless of the abilities of the snow tires.

This is why you can drift this car right off the showroom floor. Serious drivers everywhere know this is a fault. The car is slow as a result.

The car drifts off the showroom floor because the stock tires have low overall grip. When pushed over the line on poor tires a car thats easily controllable vs. tank slapping fishtails = good chassis. Go drive a mustang.

Saying "anybody who knows anything about driving has complained about the chassis"

- not only is this a really immature response, it's complete shit. Please provide us with some examples beaides your own opinion.


Reality is the brz and frs was in many cases were the first car people have owned, let alone first performance car with rwd. It is still alarming you talk about anyone who knows about driving yet you are the one who thinks the chassis is bad, presimably due to your lack of car control. If you can't handle the brz I recommend going fwd camry for you.

You are right michelin will never build another snow tire again just m+s all season, NOooooooooooot. Your problem again is you think michelin making break throughs with using more "poor weather longer lasting compound" while achieving the same times as say an old ps2 well thats has zip translation into snow tires vs all season, its not the same thing or blanket technology.

What you seem to be too arrogant to mention with all your tire bullshit is temperature. Temp is the biggest limiting factor. The difference between a ten below zero and a 25 degree day is enormous, that alone is enough reason for both cateogories to exists. Mud and snow doesnt = ice. Then imagine when it warms up to 65f.

Btw the dws is a horrible tire for dry, anyone using them as such might as well buy a used civic instead. Good way to ruin the car, sloppy.

[WRBrzRX]

Originally Posted by Gforce

Anyone who knows anything about driving has complained about this chassis in the wet. It is comically incompetent in stock form on even wet roads. It is easy to find opinions to that effect. No change in tires or shocks can fix that problem. As a direct result, the ability of this chassis to handle severe winter conditions is, to put it as kindly as possible, hilarious. In reality, the BRZ just can't handle severe winter conditions regardless of the abilities of the snow tires.

This is why you can drift this car right off the showroom floor. Serious drivers everywhere know this is a fault. The car is slow as a result.

you really couldnt be any more ignorant

stock suspension is just fine and quite enjoyable in the snow with snow tires on, the tires are the vast majority of the equation

we're super sorry you can't drive and have fucked your suspension and tires out of balance but at some point you've got to accept everyone else telling you we race this chassis in any condition you can imagine, it's YOU, not the car, not us

the Vermont guys do an ice series every single year, Dirtfish's twins go out in any weather, GMBH entire spec series rally does the same.. this is getting really stupid

AGAIN

[WRBrzRX]

Originally Posted by Gforce

This is why you can drift this car right off the showroom floor.

Stop talking about chassis. Again this is largely tire. Primacy HPs are a skinny eco tire and are hard as fuck. This is a known thing.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by WRBrzRX

Stop talking about chassis. Again this is largely tire. Primacy HPs are a skinny eco tire and are hard as fuck. This is a known thing.

And they were specifically chosen by the design team for those very features. Toyota says so outright.

[Somerandom18]

Originally Posted by 2013dgmbrzdood

Btw the dws is a horrible tire for dry, anyone using them as such might as well buy a used civic instead. Good way to ruin the car, sloppy.

They're fine in dry until they overheat. Which happens very quickly when it's hot out. Had an unexpected drift day last week when mine started losing grip for seemingly no reason. Too hot.

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[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Somerandom18

They're fine in dry until they overheat. Which happens very quickly when it's hot out. Had an unexpected drift day last week when mine started losing grip for seemingly no reason. Too hot.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

Yep. That is the compromise for an As tire. A little too soft for the heat and a little too hard for the cold. Would be a fine tire for a daily driver but would not take the heat of the track for long (like you said). This is where a summer tire would shine and why so many people have dedicated daily and track tires where they just swap depending on what they are doing.