Twins future question

[Gforce]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

That's not unique to this car though, S2000, RX-7, Cayman, Celica, every 2-stroke bike worth mentioning, etc.

It's just odd that so many people who bought this thing and supposedly understood what they were paying tens of thousands of dollars for bitch about it incessantly, and they just ignore the fact that it makes an insane amount of torque below 3.5k rpm for an NA 2.0L 4 banger which is the only reason why it's noticeable imo. Nobody would talk about a dip if it just sucked across the board under 5k rpm.

In fact the torque curves for the BRZ are remarkably similar to those for the Boxster/Cayman flat six. Subaru hired Porsche to assist in the development of the variable cam timing system which is the cause of the dip. In reality, it isn't a dip , just the result of how the two separate torque curves overlap at the cam timing change point.

Truly continuously variable valve timing is the holy grail of internal combustion engine design. Fiat may be closest to achieving this.

[accel]

Originally Posted by HKz

lol! were you expecting a touge machine with a 4 cyl accord?

No, but still - that was the first car I autocrossed. The dip annoyed me most in dayly driving, like entering the freeway.

[Gforce]

Originally Posted by Da Brz

Insane amounts? I'm not trying to be mean, but what are you comparing it to?

The only other 4cyl I've ever had was my 2012 Mazda 3 and it had about the same amount at 3,500 according to the google search I just did. Of course, google's burned me before, lol.

He's right. Your point depends on the fact that all modern engines use some sort of variable cam timing which results in higher bmep than earlier engine designs with fixed cams could achieve. In reality, these newer engines don't have a torque dip. They have two torque peaks. Of course any forced induction just blows that dip away.

There's still further development possible in this area. Cam timing is very complicated.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Gforce

He's right. Your point depends on the fact that all modern engines use some sort of variable cam timing which results in higher bmep than earlier engine designs with fixed cams could achieve. In reality, these newer engines don't have a torque dip. They have two torque peaks. Of course any forced induction just blows that dip away.

There's still further development possible in this area. Cam timing is very complicated.

Unless you turbo and then simply replace the dip with lag.

[HKz]

Originally Posted by accel

No, but still - that was the first car I autocrossed. The dip annoyed me most in dayly driving, like entering the freeway.

did it moneyshift tho??

[Somerandom18]

Some turbos spool as soon as 3k.

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[accel]

Originally Posted by HKz

did it moneyshift tho??

Jealousy?

[extrashaky]

Originally Posted by Gforce

Fiat may be closest to achieving this.

But somehow they'll succeed in making it suck in production.

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by Gforce

Subaru hired Porsche to assist in the development of the variable cam timing system which is the cause of the dip.

Where did you hear that Subaru hired Porsche people?

[HKz]

Originally Posted by accel

Jealousy?

very every time I shift my 86 now I'm expecting money to rain all over me

[bkharmony]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

I disagree on all points. The info is vaguely attributed to the person they are allegedly quoting and is totally unconformable at best and possibly total fiction at worst. If Tada did indeed say or even "hint" that the Mark II has not been signed off then he would be hauled up in front of his superiors and flogged. Even he is not at liberty to tell the "press" such things I am sure.

The clickbait part comes in that they even mentioned the convertible at all since it has been very clearly taken off the table 2 years ago. Although I guess they had to do something to spice up a first drive article written in March of 2017 when the car has already been on the lots for six months.

We will see if there is a convertible when/if the next gen comes out and one of us will be vindicated and the other owe an apology.

I'll agree to disagree with you on everything but the clickbait part. Clickbait is defined by a misleading clickable headline. This article did not have that. It's not clickbait.

Also, I never said there would be a convertible. Please don't put words in my mouth.

[mav1178]

Funny how you guys are arguing over dip on a variable valve engine.

Back in my days, the factory Nissan KA24DE not only had a torque dip, it had a torque cliff after about 5000RPMs... so all things considered, I'd take the FA20 stock any day of the week.



Torque dip is the result of many things, one thing most people keep forgetting is that almost all the "dips" are in the average range for cruising under normal conditions. It's done so you can get the best fuel economy, and it's also where most of the government emissions/economy test cycles fall into.

-alex

[accel]

Originally Posted by HKz

very every time I shift my 86 now I'm expecting money to rain all over me

Drive to Vegas and try slot machines with stick shifts.

[darthpnoy1984]

Originally Posted by mav1178

Funny how you guys are arguing over dip on a variable valve engine.

Back in my days, the factory Nissan KA24DE not only had a torque dip, it had a torque cliff after about 5000RPMs... so all things considered, I'd take the FA20 stock any day of the week.



Torque dip is the result of many things, one thing most people keep forgetting is that almost all the "dips" are in the average range for cruising under normal conditions. It's done so you can get the best fuel economy, and it's also where most of the government emissions/economy test cycles fall into.

-alex

And we got robbed of the turbocharge engine as well and now were seeing cars with turbochargers as a rage lmafo Japan had it over twenty years ago.


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