AVO Turbo Kit Install

[Dammod]

Originally Posted by sav

Very cool and it sounds awesome!

Post a video where the filming car isnot simply cruising please, should be interesting to see the difference.

The filming car was trying to keep up as mentioned, but it's only a Jetta TDI - New shape. Meant to ask the owner if we could do a cruising one to get a better sense of speed/acceleration from the 86 - will ask him next time I'm logging.

[Dammod]

Soooo, thanks to an update to the low boost tune - the car is making substantially more power which means raising the boost any higher then 0.5 bar is causing some "nice" clutch slippage
The client was informed and aware that we were pushing the envelope of the stock clutch and we it would inevitably need an upgrade at some point - we found that "point" pretty quickly.

Exedy Stage 1-2 Clutch Kit here we come!

Updates to follow once that's landed and installed.

[riri86]

Originally Posted by Dammod

Soooo, thanks to an update to the low boost tune - the car is making substantially more power which means raising the boost any higher then 0.5 bar is causing some "nice" clutch slippage
The client was informed and aware that we were pushing the envelope of the stock clutch and we it would inevitably need an upgrade at some point - we found that "point" pretty quickly.

Exedy Stage 1-2 Clutch Kit here we come!

Updates to follow once that's landed and installed.

This is going to be an epic build... Sorry if I derail the thread

Wanted to know what safety mechanisms this car has for detonation. I'm still new to the whole 86 game and I'm not to clued up with the ECU operations.
I see that you guys supply the phormula knock sensor to hear for knocking. But does the 86 ECU pull back timing when it hears detonation?

I know the ECU can pick up when you have better fuel, I have tried octane booster and about after 5km of mixing I could feel the difference.

[Dammod]

Originally Posted by riri86

This is going to be an epic build... Sorry if I derail the thread

Wanted to know what safety mechanisms this car has for detonation. I'm still new to the whole 86 game and I'm not to clued up with the ECU operations.
I see that you guys supply the phormula knock sensor to hear for knocking. But does the 86 ECU pull back timing when it hears detonation?

I know the ECU can pick up when you have better fuel, I have tried octane booster and about after 5km of mixing I could feel the difference.

Yep! Exciting stuff. Stock clutch is 100% at 0.4 bar but anything higher needs an upgrade. All depends on your goals at the end of the day. Even at 0.4 bar the car is COMPLETELY transformed.

Not at all, you welcome to ask questions.

In layman terms:
The stock engine has knock sensors which pick up a certain frequency let off by detonation. When the knock sensors pick this up, the ECU retards timing. The 86/BRZ ECU in particular does a really good job of this and picks things up quickly. Much better then the Subaru's of past.

The ECU is constantly "testing waters" in the sense that although it pulls timing initially on "bad" fuel, it keeps wanting to add it back (this process can be sped up). So although the stock ECU pulls timing to protect the engine when you are using "inferior" fuel, in the long term this still isn't the best solution due to the process of wanting to "test the waters" and having it knock again as I mentioned. In the long term you want a proper tune which does not detonate on your chosen fuel type. A proper tune will ensure optimal, consistent/safe power.

Its great to use OB, the ECU will "test the waters", find that its not knocking and your IAM will increase, HOWEVER, once you use 95 only again, the motor will need to experience detonation or the frequencies leading to it for the IAM to drop.
Adding OB to a car that has been PROPERLY tuned should have little to zero increase in performance.

[riri86]

Originally Posted by Dammod

Yep! Exciting stuff. Stock clutch is 100% at 0.4 bar but anything higher needs an upgrade. All depends on your goals at the end of the day. Even at 0.4 bar the car is COMPLETELY transformed.

Not at all, you welcome to ask questions.

In layman terms:
The stock engine has knock sensors which pick up a certain frequency let off by detonation. When the knock sensors pick this up, the ECU retards timing. The 86/BRZ ECU in particular does a really good job of this and picks things up quickly. Much better then the Subaru's of past.

The ECU is constantly "testing waters" in the sense that although it pulls timing initially on "bad" fuel, it keeps wanting to add it back (this process can be sped up). So although the stock ECU pulls timing to protect the engine when you are using "inferior" fuel, in the long term this still isn't the best solution due to the process of wanting to "test the waters" and having it knock again as I mentioned. In the long term you want a proper tune which does not detonate on your chosen fuel type. A proper tune will ensure optimal, consistent/safe power.

Its great to use OB, the ECU will "test the waters", find that its not knocking and your IAM will increase, HOWEVER, once you use 95 only again, the motor will need to experience detonation or the frequencies leading to it for the IAM to drop.
Adding OB to a car that has been PROPERLY tuned should have little to zero increase in performance.

Sigh its sad that we don't have good fuel here in SA at our pumps. In the long run i'm guessing this car will be Tuned for Eth.

to Pheonix performance on this build.

[rocket12]

how did you get it shipped?

[Dammod]

Originally Posted by rocket12

how did you get it shipped?

We are the AVO suppliers for SA, it was air freighted.

[sav]

Update please? Would be interesting to hear/see how it's going a couple months later since it should have had enough time to get all the niggles sorted out.

[Dammod]

Originally Posted by sav

Update please? Would be interesting to hear/see how it's going a couple months later since it should have had enough time to get all the niggles sorted out.

Funny enough, not a single issue to speak of...scouring the thread started by AVO owners on this forum before the install really helped make sure all the potential issues were covered and worked around.

No other updates since the last: The car came back for a retune, we adjusted the actuator arm to drop actuator down to 0.4 bar since it would now have a high and low boost setting, boost controller and wideband were installed the tune was fine tuned. As we started upping the boost, past 0.5-0.6 bar the clutch started giving up, so it was dropped to 0.4 again until a better clutch is installed. For the short amount of time the clutch managed to hold, that 0.6bar felt mad!!
Must be making some pretty decent torque at 0.5bar+ for it to start slipping already so that's a good sign I guess.

The owner bought a Exedy stage 2 clutch in the states - at customs at the moment, so waiting anxiously for him to get that installed.
Cant wait to feel it at 0.8-0.9bar

[86 South Africa]

Do you have some kw/hp and torque numbers for 0.4bar and 0.5/0.6 bar boost levels?

Would be interesting to see the changes and give an idea of where the stock clutch becomes the problem.

[Dammod]

Originally Posted by 86 South Africa

Do you have some kw/hp and torque numbers for 0.4bar and 0.5/0.6 bar boost levels?

Would be interesting to see the changes and give an idea of where the stock clutch becomes the problem.

I don't have power figures from when the clutch started to slip since it was being road tuned - it will be taken to the dyno once high boost is done to get a power reading for low and then high boost.

The stock clutch can hold between 250-300nm depending on how hard and fast it comes on to boost, so that gives you an idea of where we were at before we had to call it quits until a better clutch was installed.

[Fish Eagle]

My car's got 317Nm, and I've done 28 track days without any problems at all, so it's certainly capable of handling upwards of 300Nm.

But I don't drag race, and I don't drop the clutch.

[Dammod]

Originally Posted by Fish Eagle

My car's got 317Nm, and I've done 28 track days without any problems at all, so it's certainly capable of handling upwards of 300Nm.

But I don't drag race, and I don't drop the clutch.

As mentioned - it depends on how hard and fast it comes on boost. Due to the design of the SC in your car, it gradually builds power as the revs climb which is a lot "easier" on the clutch.
So the AVO kit might hit 300nm at 4krpm and hold till redline, whereas the RGM SC will gradually climb and hit 300nm closer to redline.

Also, RGM power figures from their dyno are far higher the average output we have seen of RGM cars on other dyno's so that's something to keep in mind so tough to "compare" their figures.

The upgraded RGM kit with WMI supposedly does 260kw (their dyno) on stock clutch which if you scour the forums, would be a world record for the stock clutch without slippage.
Nothing wrong with differences between dyno's but it just needs to be kept in mind when comparing.

[86 South Africa]

Of course the diff set ups will make their power differently...
I've been in the rgm car, so I know what it feels like (awesome)

Also been in a sprintex car (just as awesome).
But never a tc car.

Biggest diff is obviously that low down kit of the tc.

My opinion (based on above) means I'm still keen on the harrop or edelbrock sc. But thanks to the exchange rate it's on ice for a little longer!