Downshifting problem from 5th to 4th

[n0thing]

Vehicle has 21000km. For the past few weeks, I started noticing that the "gate" is blocked when I downshift from 5th to 4th. With vehicle warmed up, this is most common at 3krpm from 5th (traveling about 90km/h), worse at higher rpm, sometimes in lower rpm too. At first I thought my shifter was caught between 4th and 6th, but that's not the case. I can duplicate the symptom even when moving the shifter slowly from 5th to 4th. In fact, when 4th is blocked, I left it in neutral (traveling about 80km/h), clutch out, then clutch back in, rev match and I still can't get it into 4th. Back to neutral (traveling about 60-70km/h), clutch out, then clutch in, rev match and again still cannot get into 4th. So basically, the problem exist even with double clutching? I'll have to shift back into 5th and attempt to downshift to 4th again, or I coast in neutral to stop or downshift to 3rd. The only way I can shift into 4th during all this, is to forcefully pull down the shifter real hard pass the gate.

This is all done with proper revmatching. I used to be able to effortlessly downshift from 5th to 4th, with minimal finger flick down pressure. This is no longer the case, as I am now grabbing and pulling with a pistol grip, not knowing if the gate will be blocked or not. I was using Motul 300 for a year with no issue then this started happening. Switched to Pentosin MTF2 and problem remains. Upshifting/downshifting between 3rd/4th and 5th/6th is fine. Upshifting between 4th/5th seems fine, but it does grind occasionally.

I believe this is a 4th/5th synchro issue, and will bring it to the dealership. I can't think of another solution but to have the transmission replaced. Has anybody dealt with this problem before?

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZyGxnoM6JLE"]Downshifting problem from 5th to 4th - YouTube[/ame]

[humfrz]

Yep ....looks like you need a new transmission at least part of it.


humrfz

[Ultramaroon]

Do you always shift that aggressively? That's pretty hardcore.

[n0thing]

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon

Do you always shift that aggressively? That's pretty hardcore.

Not at all. Video was made just to demonstrate the symptom. But let say I'm on the highway and I see traffic, decided to slow down by downshifting from 5th to 4th, I may (and have) get stuck in neutral.

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by n0thing

Not at all. Video was made just to demonstrate the symptom. But let say I'm on the highway and I see traffic, decided to slow down by downshifting from 5th to 4th, I may (and have) get stuck in neutral.

Gotcha. Warranty. Like @humfrz said, time to get the trans replaced.

[n0thing]

Quick update, technician confirmed the symptom and suspects synchro problem. A new transmission is on ordered. I was told ETA of few weeks, do transmissions come straight from Japan?

[brianhj]

Originally Posted by n0thing

Quick update, technician confirmed the symptom and suspects synchro problem. A new transmission is on ordered. I was told ETA of few weeks, do transmissions come straight from Japan?

Tada keeps them in his apartment and ships them directly to you

[FRSBRZGT86FAN]

Originally Posted by brianhj

Tada keeps them in his apartment and ships them directly to you

Originally Posted by n0thing

Quick update, technician confirmed the symptom and suspects synchro problem. A new transmission is on ordered. I was told ETA of few weeks, do transmissions come straight from Japan?

On a serious note, the RA62 in the manual version of our cars is made by Aisin AI. I suspect, as Aisin stated in a press release, that because production had to be halted due to the 7.0 magnitude earthquake Japan recently suffered, that this delay is to be expected. Also it may just be that a local parts warehouse simply can't source it from in the country so the best option is to order it straight from Subaru/Toyota/Aisin as this is a warranty repair anyway that also is to be expected:

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/toyota-hond...uction-1555302

"Toyota said it is suspending operations in stages at most of its vehicle assembly plants across the country for around a week starting from 18 April due to difficulties in sourcing parts from some of its suppliers, including affiliate Aisin Seiki."

[n0thing]

An update to the thread. So the transmission was replaced under warranty in Apr/16. Shifting has been fine and back to normal, until recently. I've already experienced about 3 mis-shifts in the past week.

It's always from 5-4, especially at higher rpm, as if the gate is totally shut (with clutch in and rev-match). Am I the only one to experience this? I'm no Keiichi Tsuchiya, but have no problem to rev-match or heel toe with any other gears. Note that this 2nd transmission still has the stock fluid, and tried Motul and Pentosin on the previous transmission.

[humfrz]

Originally Posted by n0thing

An update to the thread. So the transmission was replaced under warranty in Apr/16. Shifting has been fine and back to normal, until recently. I've already experienced about 3 mis-shifts in the past week.

It's always from 5-4, especially at higher rpm, as if the gate is totally shut (with clutch in and rev-match). Am I the only one to experience this? I'm no Keiichi Tsuchiya, but have no problem to rev-match or heel toe with any other gears. Note that this 2nd transmission still has the stock fluid, and tried Motul and Pentosin on the previous transmission.

Well now, n0thing, that's too bad you're mis-shifting.

I'm suspecting that it's pilot error .......but, I have no idea of what you're doing wrong.

Don't yell at me ...... but it sounds like you're trying to go from 5th to 2nd ..... thinking it's 4th .......

(who said that!)

[n0thing]

Originally Posted by humfrz

Well now, n0thing, that's too bad you're mis-shifting.

I'm suspecting that it's pilot error .......but, I have no idea of what you're doing wrong.

Don't yell at me ...... but it sounds like you're trying to go from 5th to 2nd ..... thinking it's 4th .......

(who said that!)

Perhaps mis-shift was the wrong word, more like unable to shift into gear. I normally just flick my wrist down lightly, instead of a hammer pull, so no I've never went 5-2. And plus, the dealership replicated the problem right away during their road test.

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by n0thing

Perhaps mis-shift was the wrong word, more like unable to shift into gear. I normally just flick my wrist down lightly, instead of a hammer pull, so no I've never went 5-2. And plus, the dealership replicated the problem right away during their road test.

What did the dealer say? Will they replace it again?

[n0thing]

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon

What did the dealer say? Will they replace it again?

O I meant last year. Again after they replaced the transmission it's been fine, so it's not my driving. I'll have to wait until it becomes worse/more consistent before I visit them (which I have a feeling it will ), because I know if they can't replicate it, nothing can be done.

[humfrz]

Originally Posted by n0thing

An update to the thread. So the transmission was replaced under warranty in Apr/16. Shifting has been fine and back to normal, until recently. I've already experienced about 3 mis-shifts in the past week.

It's always from 5-4, especially at higher rpm, as if the gate is totally shut (with clutch in and rev-match). Am I the only one to experience this? I'm no Keiichi Tsuchiya, but have no problem to rev-match or heel toe with any other gears. Note that this 2nd transmission still has the stock fluid, and tried Motul and Pentosin on the previous transmission.

Well now, just maybe, if the rpm is really high and you are in 5th and you try to put it in 4th, and it won't go, the transmission is telling you that IF you did get it into 4th (at that high rpm) ....... bad things may happen to the engine ......

And there are things spinning around in the transmission that don't like to be "forced" ....... maybe ol @Ultramaroon would like to comment.


humfrz