Is LSD going to help standing start wheel spin? - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community

owenxguo · 04-07-2016, 01:12 AM

Having issue with very bad wheel spin during standing start, I am running stock LSD now, and would wondering if a clutch type LSD would help?

My car is running PTuning turbo and Hankook slicks, my competitors are Hyundai Genesis and 335i, we all running same tires, and race organizer doesn't allow tire warm up during out lap (which is very stupid). I thought it might be tire too cold, but other cars seems start fine. I am very confident with throttle control over other drivers, but car just doesn't feel any traction at rear while start. I was wondering if LSD would help with this and any other recommendations on driving technic?

ka-t_240 · 04-07-2016, 01:24 AM

What is your suspension mods? Are you getting wheel hop with that spin?

Do you have Diff/Subframe bushings in yet?

CSG Mike · 04-07-2016, 01:27 AM

Depends, are you spinning one or both wheels?

Why not just have Ptuning program you a launch control? It's well within the capabilities of EcuTek.

owenxguo · 04-07-2016, 03:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ka-t_240

What is your suspension mods? Are you getting wheel hop with that spin?

Do you have Diff/Subframe bushings in yet?

Full RacerX arms, Eibach R2 coilover and yes diff and subframe bushings.

owenxguo · 04-07-2016, 03:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

Depends, are you spinning one or both wheels?

Why not just have Ptuning program you a launch control? It's well within the capabilities of EcuTek.

For what I can feel both wheels

I am stilling trying different RPMs to launch, so far nothing really works well. Launch control won't really help at this point, I am guessing either the LSD or tires aren't fully warmed up. I'll see if I can get a tire warmer next race to try.

softgrip · 04-07-2016, 05:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by owenxguo

Is LSD going to help standing start wheel spin?

It helped with my astral traveling.

SeanRTR · 04-07-2016, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by owenxguo

race organizer doesn't allow tire warm up during out lap (which is very stupid).

I would just work with this...how do they enforce this? When I ran into this issue in Karting, it was mainly because they didn't want Karts zigging and zagging Nascar style on cold tires to avoid an incident...we were kids, so I guess it made sense, but I always got around this by just driving like an asshole on the warm up lap. Why can't you give the car in front of you a gap, and launch the car on to the track to get heat in the rears? Give car in front of you a run on the straight during warm up and brake hard and late to warm up tires that way. Apply the gas a bit early on exit and get the tail end a bit loose. This may or may not work...but no LSD in the world is going to make up for cold R comps that just don't want to hook up. I'd start with driving 'harder' on the on-lap.

CSG Mike · 04-07-2016, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by owenxguo

For what I can feel both wheels

I am stilling trying different RPMs to launch, so far nothing really works well. Launch control won't really help at this point, I am guessing either the LSD or tires aren't fully warmed up. I'll see if I can get a tire warmer next race to try.

Why not? It would address the exact issue you have, by modulating your engine output for you, to optimize low traction acceleration.

Look at a datalog to verify that you are indeed spinning both wheels. If you are, a LSD will not help.

wbradley · 04-07-2016, 02:43 PM

Wide rear tires, sticky compound, maybe slightly different rear suspension calibration, those seem to be the remedy. Maybe weight on the rear axle.

I think an LSD helps with traction when cornering, particularly powering in a corner.

xwd · 04-07-2016, 02:53 PM

It's easy to spin the rear tires, even stickier street tires, at stock power levels.

Like Mike said, a fancier traction control system is probably your best solution. The system could be electronically controlled via Ecutek, Motec, etc., or be your right foot. If you start messing with suspension to launch better, your likely trading something off where it matters more like corners.

LSD isn't really going to help you launch better.

Sleepless · 04-07-2016, 03:25 PM

Sand bags in the trunk

owenxguo · 04-07-2016, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

Why not? It would address the exact issue you have, by modulating your engine output for you, to optimize low traction acceleration.

Look at a datalog to verify that you are indeed spinning both wheels. If you are, a LSD will not help.

I will talk to my tuner and see if they can help, I thought those launch control with stock ecu is just to limit the rpm before car moves.

owenxguo · 04-07-2016, 07:28 PM

Good point, time to be an asshole too

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeanRTR

I would just work with this...how do they enforce this? When I ran into this issue in Karting, it was mainly because they didn't want Karts zigging and zagging Nascar style on cold tires to avoid an incident...we were kids, so I guess it made sense, but I always got around this by just driving like an asshole on the warm up lap. Why can't you give the car in front of you a gap, and launch the car on to the track to get heat in the rears? Give car in front of you a run on the straight during warm up and brake hard and late to warm up tires that way. Apply the gas a bit early on exit and get the tail end a bit loose. This may or may not work...but no LSD in the world is going to make up for cold R comps that just don't want to hook up. I'd start with driving 'harder' on the on-lap.

Northwest86 · 04-07-2016, 08:14 PM

Use the brakes a ton to get heat into the tyre if allowed. On our cars we use our spare boost controller maps to limit boost in some gears for different tracks. So in this case we'd just turn the first gear boost down to wastegate pressure basically and then have second be normal.

04-07-2016, 01:12 AM	#1
owenxguo Member Join Date: Mar 2014 Drives: MY13 BRZ Location: Bay Area Posts: 31 Thanks: 0 Thanked 11 Times in 5 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Is LSD going to help standing start wheel spin? Having issue with very bad wheel spin during standing start, I am running stock LSD now, and would wondering if a clutch type LSD would help? My car is running PTuning turbo and Hankook slicks, my competitors are Hyundai Genesis and 335i, we all running same tires, and race organizer doesn't allow tire warm up during out lap (which is very stupid). I thought it might be tire too cold, but other cars seems start fine. I am very confident with throttle control over other drivers, but car just doesn't feel any traction at rear while start. I was wondering if LSD would help with this and any other recommendations on driving technic?

04-07-2016, 03:25 PM	#11
Sleepless Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Drives: 2014 BRZ Location: Redmond, WA Posts: 639 Thanks: 299 Thanked 392 Times in 229 Posts Mentioned: 8 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Sand bags in the trunk __________________ Pete 14 Track BRZ (Build Thread) cmslaptimer.com

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04-07-2016, 01:24 AM	#2
ka-t_240 Senior Member Join Date: May 2014 Drives: BRZ Location: Fargo, ND Posts: 973 Thanks: 124 Thanked 328 Times in 237 Posts Mentioned: 1 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	What is your suspension mods? Are you getting wheel hop with that spin? Do you have Diff/Subframe bushings in yet?

04-07-2016, 01:27 AM	#3
CSG Mike Join Date: Jul 2012 Drives: S2000 CR Location: Orange County Posts: 14,562 Thanks: 8,942 Thanked 14,211 Times in 6,854 Posts Mentioned: 970 Post(s) Tagged: 14 Thread(s)	Depends, are you spinning one or both wheels? Why not just have Ptuning program you a launch control? It's well within the capabilities of EcuTek.

04-07-2016, 02:53 PM	#10
xwd Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Drives: 2013 DGM Subaru BRZ (Subie #9) Location: ATL, US Posts: 2,667 Thanks: 123 Thanked 861 Times in 552 Posts Mentioned: 32 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	It's easy to spin the rear tires, even stickier street tires, at stock power levels. Like Mike said, a fancier traction control system is probably your best solution. The system could be electronically controlled via Ecutek, Motec, etc., or be your right foot. If you start messing with suspension to launch better, your likely trading something off where it matters more like corners. LSD isn't really going to help you launch better.

04-07-2016, 08:14 PM	#14
Northwest86 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2015 Drives: Velocity Orange 86 GT Location: Australia Posts: 196 Thanks: 0 Thanked 71 Times in 55 Posts Mentioned: 1 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Use the brakes a ton to get heat into the tyre if allowed. On our cars we use our spare boost controller maps to limit boost in some gears for different tracks. So in this case we'd just turn the first gear boost down to wastegate pressure basically and then have second be normal.

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