Better as a Scion?

[Abflug]

so if it´s going to be a SCION and they want to introduce it´s brand with the FT-86 to the euro market (what I do not expect) I would rahter 3S-GTE up my 20 year old MR2 than buying a SCION or a Z (there are enough alternative choices for the Z e. g. BMW Z4 M Coupe) and even if there is still the SUBARU option!

[Dragonitti]

Originally Posted by Dimman

Rationally, Scion branding serves a small Scion enthusiast market. Toyota branding has a chance to bring back Toyota enthusiasts that have moved over to other brands or hung on to old Toyota performance products, like myself. Especially ones that are actively turned off by the Scion enthusiast community. Also like myself. If the FT/R-86/S fails to impress (God forbid) I will be probably looking towards a 370Z, pending the payment difference.

With one car though? I would think they would have to follow up with several cars in the same category before they started to Reel in new people or the old.

And the Subaru Option....You think it's going to be the same price as the Scion/Toyota version? I highly doubt that.

[Dragonitti]

No matter what brand it comes out under, I have only two fears.

1) They will redesign and actually mess it up.

2) They will incorporate to many electronic stability systems with no way of turning them off....thus killing my ideas of taking it to the drift track a few times a season.


I'm a little less worried about #2 as they were touting it as a drift car when they first started the buzz. But with the way the Auto Industry is turning into (Electric Green Cars, and cars that are uninspiring and just get you from A to B), anything can happen.

On the new tC2 they added traction control to the tC. You can disengage it via the button, but it will enable itself on it's own once you hit 30+mph. They also put in what my 350z had in that you can't press the brake while still on the accelerator, thus eliminating any chance of Brake Boosting, or left foot braking.

[djohnson]

Don't forget, there is almost always a way to turn off the often annoying electronics. Fuse boxes are your friend

[Dragonitti]

Originally Posted by djohnson

Don't forget, there is almost always a way to turn off the often annoying electronics. Fuse boxes are your friend

The new 2011 tC comes with traction control now. You push the button to disable it....it re-enables when you get to 30mph...

They also implemented electronics that prevent you from braking and accelerating at the same time. This eliminates left foot braking as well as brake boosting.

It's to early to tell what will have to be done to bypass this stuff, but just simply hitting the button doesn't work.

My 350z had the "brake/gas" electronic thing as well, thus preventing you from being able to do a burnout (even if you disabled the Traction control). Only way around it on the Z was to remove the rear brake light fuse. Or buy this gadget this dude on the forums made to bypass it, and still be able to have brake lights.

[Allch Chcar]

Not familiar with the function of the fuse box are we, Dragonitti?

I'll just explain it for everyone then. Removing a fuse cuts the power off for everything in the circuit. Headlights have a seperate fuse, the engine ECU has a fuse, etc. So long as the Traction control is on a separate circuit from anything important it could be shut down by this method but if it's on the same circuit as anything important then no go.

Someone want to verify/explain this better?

[Dragonitti]

Originally Posted by Allch Chcar

Not familiar with the function of the fuse box are we, Dragonitti?

I'll just explain it for everyone then. Removing a fuse cuts the power off for everything in the circuit. Headlights have a seperate fuse, the engine ECU has a fuse, etc. So long as the Traction control is on a separate circuit from anything important it could be shut down by this method but if it's on the same circuit as anything important then no go.

Someone want to verify/explain this better?

I will quote myself since I think you missed part of my post.

Originally Posted by Dragonitti

Only way around it on the Z was to remove the rear brake light fuse. Or buy this gadget this dude on the forums made to bypass it, and still be able to have brake lights.

Doing so disabled the use of brake lights period. Now try running at night with no brake lights, or on the race track with no brake lights.

[nate89]

Originally Posted by Dragonitti

The new 2011 tC comes with traction control now. You push the button to disable it....it re-enables when you get to 30mph...

They also implemented electronics that prevent you from braking and accelerating at the same time. This eliminates left foot braking as well as brake boosting.

It's to early to tell what will have to be done to bypass this stuff, but just simply hitting the button doesn't work.

Simply hitting the button will only disable it for speeds under 25-30mph. But pushing and holding will completely disable both VSC and trac Controll at all speeds. There is also a way to disable only the trac control and keep vsc, but it requires a "cheat code" done with the brake pedal, ebrake, and key.

[Dragonitti]

Originally Posted by nate89

Simply hitting the button will only disable it for speeds under 25-30mph. But pushing and holding will completely disable both VSC and trac Controll at all speeds. There is also a way to disable only the trac control and keep vsc, but it requires a "cheat code" done with the brake pedal, ebrake, and key.

Yeah we just found that out.

[djohnson]

Not that I'm recommending it at all, but most anyone who has a decent understanding of splicing and who knows exactly which wires go where in the circuit could splice a bypass around the target circuit and add in a separate fuse and switch to the dash. Likely would be a Saturday afternoon/weekend project. Obviously voiding warranties and the like in the process. But still doable without too much effort. Just a last resort for those who REALLY want to disable the safety features if the other cheats/tricks don't work.

[Dragonitti]

^^I prefer for them to just not put that crap in there to begin with...LOL. But I don't see that happening.

[Siriusly.Andrew]

Originally Posted by Dragonitti

I prefer for them to just not put that crap in there to begin with. But I don't see that happening.

Agreed. ABS and Traction Control ruined winter for me. ABS kills people this time of year, and TC just takes the fun out of everything.

[Dark]

It's not like everyone will drive the hell out of a car, so expecting disable buttons on safety features is more likely.

[Allch Chcar]

Originally Posted by Dragonitti

...Doing so disabled the use of brake lights period. Now try running at night with no brake lights, or on the race track with no brake lights.

What you that say you said.

Originally Posted by Dragonitti

Only way around it on the Z was to remove the rear brake light fuse.

And what you actually said.

Now do you see why I was confused?

<-I am easily confused.

And brake lights are unnecessary distractions on a race car IMHO.