Quiet FI

[King Tut]

Originally Posted by Drift-Office

KT :

Here's my opener ~ FACT

25 AVO kits sold, installed and tuned here at my facility between late 2013 - end 2014. ZERO manifold leaking issues that you prescribe.

4 additional AVO kits sold thru AVO themselves to out of state customers, as recent as of last week and 2 more AVO kits sold thru myself overseas to people who were self installers and or shops who have NEVER done an FA20 turbo kit before, and all were locally tuned by myself without issue or "leaks" whatsoever.

All this based on my own first-hand experience. Do you see 16 of my customers complaining of manifold leaks? Here, FB, elsewhere?

Your turn. What was your first-hand experience with the AVO and where were the other 125 complaints that you speak of?

Bob @ Drift-Office, LLC

You know my experience is only with FT86Club posters. My statement of many is based on the number of AVO owners that I have seen post on this site having gasket sealing issues. If it was one or two or three, I might not bring it up, but it is more and many with multiple issues of the same thing occurring.

[Drift-Office]

Originally Posted by King Tut

You know my experience is only with FT86Club posters. My statement of many is based on the number of AVO owners that I have seen post on this site having gasket sealing issues. If it was one or two or three, I might not bring it up, but it is more and many with multiple issues of the same thing occurring.

Thank you - that was the affirmation I was looking for. "Multiple Issues if the same thing" on the interwebs makes it a majority.

I'll keep that in mind for the future.

While I will concede to people are having problems with their installs, but the consensus remains that those complaints that you perceive are mostly from self installers, largely first timers on a FA / EJ setup doing it at a hobbyist level, without a lift and a 150 piece Craftsman tool set.

Would you not agree to that?

I'll just leave this here for thought.

Sorry to have this OP, my apologies.

Regards,


Bob @ Drift-Office, LLC

[King Tut]

I feel like I am getting close to the banning point for talking about a paying vendor's product, so I won't continue this thread jack any longer either. The OP is free to do his own research in the two big AVO threads in this forum and come to his own conclusion.

[raven1231]

Still sucks if the kit can't be installed by anyone other than a specialized tuning shop. Many people on this forum would prefer to do it themselves. I remember seeing a good amount of complaints on here as well when I was looking at the AVO kit. Not saying it's bad, just that I do remember several having issues.

[AVOturboworld]

There are some owners of the kit that had issues with the flanges, whether it was self induced or via our error on some of the early manifolds. Some owners were also quite new to the Subaru Boxer manifold world, and tried to correct a perceived fault that wasn't there and then created a fault. Some of those kits then got sold on, and their second owner inherited an issue.

But the biggest reason there is a number of complaints is because we sold so many of the kits. We've been selling it for two years now, to an enormous amount of customers worldwide. So even if we have far less issues than, say, kit XYZ out there, it'll look like more issues if kit XYZ only sold to 20 people.

We've updated the flanges and a lot of other details over time, for any issues that popped up, or if there was going to be any potential issues. We will always be committed to improving our kits as best possible.

[raven1231]

Originally Posted by AVOturboworld

There are some owners of the kit that had issues with the flanges, whether it was self induced or via our error on some of the early manifolds. Some owners were also quite new to the Subaru Boxer manifold world, and tried to correct a perceived fault that wasn't there and then created a fault. Some of those kits then got sold on, and their second owner inherited an issue.

But the biggest reason there is a number of complaints is because we sold so many of the kits. We've been selling it for two years now, to an enormous amount of customers worldwide. So even if we have far less issues than, say, kit XYZ out there, it'll look like more issues if kit XYZ only sold to 20 people.

We've updated the flanges and a lot of other details over time, for any issues that popped up, or if there was going to be any potential issues. We will always be committed to improving our kits as best possible.

That is great to hear sir! and a very valid point!

[kbogarto]

I installed my AVO kit myself. to answer the question from page 1

[Calum]

Originally Posted by Drift-Office

Thank you - that was the affirmation I was looking for. "Multiple Issues if the same thing" on the interwebs makes it a majority.

I'll keep that in mind for the future.

While I will concede to people are having problems with their installs, but the consensus remains that those complaints that you perceive are mostly from self installers, largely first timers on a FA / EJ setup doing it at a hobbyist level, without a lift and a 150 piece Craftsman tool set.

Would you not agree to that?

I'll just leave this here for thought.

Sorry to have this OP, my apologies.

Regards,


Bob @ Drift-Office, LLC

I've got a hell of a lot more than a 150 piece tool kit at home, I've been employed as a technician for the last 16 years and getting paid to turn wrenches since I was 11, but I've never removed the exhaust manifold from a boxer. Can you explain what's different/special about installing an exhaust manifold on a boxer?

Originally Posted by AVOturboworld

There are some owners of the kit that had issues with the flanges, whether it was self induced or via our error on some of the early manifolds. Some owners were also quite new to the Subaru Boxer manifold world, and tried to correct a perceived fault that wasn't there and then created a fault. Some of those kits then got sold on, and their second owner inherited an issue.

But the biggest reason there is a number of complaints is because we sold so many of the kits. We've been selling it for two years now, to an enormous amount of customers worldwide. So even if we have far less issues than, say, kit XYZ out there, it'll look like more issues if kit XYZ only sold to 20 people.

We've updated the flanges and a lot of other details over time, for any issues that popped up, or if there was going to be any potential issues. We will always be committed to improving our kits as best possible.

Were the flanges damaged due to persistent leaking? Warped to due over tightening? Something else?



*I'm honestly curious.*

[cdrazic93]

The last i heard of the gasket avo leaking, was the first generation of avo kits sent out had a gasket that was too thin, iirc.

[AVOturboworld]

Originally Posted by Calum

Were the flanges damaged due to persistent leaking? Warped to due over tightening? Something else?

At least one I know the inside nut on one side wasn't fully tightened, as it is in a tight space and really needs a crow's foot to best torque it down. This caused a leak that blew out the gasket and did cause the flange to warp. Another one sitting at my office, the bracket was not fitted down to the block at the turbo end and was sitting on top of the nut head, pushing it out and causing the header to crack at the flange over time.

One of the more common ones, that happened in a couple of cases, was lack of exposure to a split header design (which is relatively unique to the boxer engine). They decided that the right and left flanges were not flat in relation to the other, and put the flanges on a flat grinder. This caused them both to no longer be square. The most extreme example, they took 10mm out of the flange. Of course, if they had just bolted it down properly they would have noticed the header flexes enough to bring it square.

There were a couple of cases where the flange surface was not fully flat, and that is our fault. They probably had warped during the welding process. But this is out of 270 kits sold worldwide, so it's not exactly a common occurance.

Edit: Here is an illustration I made a while ago to explain what was happening.
The first illustration is of a manifold bolted down, the second of the manifold before it has been bolted down. There may be a slight bend in it from side to side, this is common with solid pipes as the heat cycle. The third illustration shows what happens when somebody tries to grind them flat in relation to each other.

[Calum]

Originally Posted by AVOturboworld

snip

Thank you. That clears a lot of things up.

[Drift-Office]

@Calum :

Ah ha! A drawing better than my explanation!

Cheers!


Bob @ Drift-Office, LLC
http://www.driftoffice.com

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by Drift-Office

How many here are voicing that sentiment? Or the one persistent guy who was out to sell someone else's kit after a botched installation? I'm curious - of that breakdown, how many were done at home, in their driveway or at a professional shop with experience?

Bob @ Drift-Office, LLC

Who was that persistent owner who was out to sell someone else's kit @Drift-Office ?

[SkAsphalt]

Originally Posted by Sportsguy83

Who was that persistent owner who was out to sell someone else's kit @Drift-Office ?

There was that guy who was basically a salesman for FA20 club... maybe him?