How to run E85 on stock 86 BRZ FRS with OFT tune

[steve99]

Originally Posted by tmichel

Will try a tank of united once this one is empty and see how that goes.

caltex e85 is fine, its just on first tank of any e85 their is always maybe 8 litres if petrol left so e% bit low. caltex will be better for cold weather starts as it has lower e% than united E85.

[Krazy]

Noob question, is e85 different from each gas station? Such as arco e85 vs chevron e85

[Wayno]

Comparing 2.06 E85 vs non E85, shiv has multiplied 68F (20C) and below by 1.05. Those values would start for me on the second try consistently.

Updated post a few below this one.

[s2d4]

Something doesn't seem right with table F

[Wayno]

If you open your stock rom you'll see the same thing. It's only -10C that's out anyway.

[tmichel]

Originally Posted by steve99

caltex e85 is fine, its just on first tank of any e85 their is always maybe 8 litres if petrol left so e% bit low. caltex will be better for cold weather starts as it has lower e% than united E85.

I put 43 litres of 85 in so your right about the fuel content that would be in there will do another run when fully fueled again.

[poptopclk]

I am in S Florida where it is seldom cold.


I am running Shiv's E85 tune, we have lots of E85 stations & for some reason our E85 is a minimum of 85% ethanol according to the pump label.


The car starts every time, 1st try when it is 70F or above and takes 2 starts to fire up when it is closer to 60F as it was this week.


Not a deal breaker but it is surprisingly sensitive to ambient air temperature when it comes to starting.


I almost wonder if we get E100 since there is no smell of gasoline what so ever when it starts.

[DC2R]

Originally Posted by poptopclk

I am in S Florida where it is seldom cold.


I am running Shiv's E85 tune, we have lots of E85 stations & for some reason our E85 is a minimum of 85% ethanol according to the pump label.


The car starts every time, 1st try when it is 70F or above and takes 2 starts to fire up when it is closer to 60F as it was this week.


Not a deal breaker but it is surprisingly sensitive to ambient air temperature when it comes to starting.


I almost wonder if we get E100 since there is no smell of gasoline what so ever when it starts.

That's just a label. Are you on soflo FRS group? Post on there for ideas of real ethanol levels

[Wayno]

These are all my current E85 rom changes, I won't say they are final but certainly done after a lot of testing.

1. Try to make 6800rpm a little bit richer. For some reason it leans up and knocks at 6800rpm when the ambient tempt is hot - not good on E85-E90!
http://datazap.me/u/wayne/206-stg2-u...=0&data=1-5-14
Only made these changes recently and haven't tested fully.
Tables:
- Primary Open Loop Fueling
- Primary Open Loop Fueling Additive

2. Cold (and hot) starting.
- Multiply the Stg2 91 columns 68F(30C) and below by 1.25
(OR multiply the 2.06 Stg2 E85 columns 68F(30C) and below by 1.2)
- Multiply the 2.06 Stg2 E85 columns 86F(40C) and above by 1.05
Tables:
- Cranking Fuel Injector Pulse Width A
- Cranking Fuel Injector Pulse Width B
- Cranking Fuel Injector Pulse Width C
- Cranking Fuel Injector Pulse Width D
- Cranking Fuel Injector Pulse Width E
- Cranking Fuel Injector Pulse Width F

3. AT Soft rev limit
- Set 7450rpm row to -0.12. No other changes required.
Table:
- Base Timing B

4. Radiator Fan Activation
- See other thread in software forum.
Tables:
- Radiator Fan Modes A
- Radiator Fan Modes B

5. Tweak Idle
- Tweaked for personal preference
Tables:
- Idle Speed Target A
- Idle Speed Target B
- Idle Speed Target D

6. Disable P0420
- Not disabled on EU AT roms.

[steve99]

@Wayno I wonder if recsaling the IAT vs Cranking IPW as per below would achieve similar results to adjusting the cranking IPW tables

Also the cranking IPW vs accelerator looks interesting appears you can decrease the cranking ipw compensation substantially by pressing accelerator to 70% or more during cranking.

[Wayno]

That's probably a lot cleaner once you find the correct values but I plan on not touching mine for a while, spent too much time tuning those damn manifold extenders. Maybe in 6 months I'll need to change the 50F/10C column and below to 1.3, but rather stop spending so much time on it till then.

[Luckrider]

Originally Posted by poptopclk

I am in S Florida where it is seldom cold.


I am running Shiv's E85 tune, we have lots of E85 stations & for some reason our E85 is a minimum of 85% ethanol according to the pump label.


The car starts every time, 1st try when it is 70F or above and takes 2 starts to fire up when it is closer to 60F as it was this week.


Not a deal breaker but it is surprisingly sensitive to ambient air temperature when it comes to starting.


I almost wonder if we get E100 since there is no smell of gasoline what so ever when it starts.

This all has to do with the flash point of gasoline vs ethanol and their various mixtures. For gasoline, this is about -45°F. The flash point is simply the temperature at which a flammable liquid can burn.

From Wikipedia:

An ethanol-water solution that contains 40% ABV (alcohol by volume) will catch fire if heated to about 26 °C (79 °F) and if an ignition source is applied to it. This is called its flash point.[75] The flash point of pure ethanol is 16.60 °C (61.88 °F), less than average room temperature.[citation needed]
The flash points of ethanol concentrations from 10% ABV to 96% ABV are shown below:[76]
10% — 49 °C (120 °F)
20% — 36 °C (97 °F)
30% — 29 °C (84 °F)
40% — 26 °C (79 °F)
50% — 24 °C (75 °F)
60% — 22 °C (72 °F)
70% — 21 °C (70 °F)
80% — 20 °C (68 °F)
90% — 17 °C (63 °F)
96% — 17 °C (63 °F)

From here you would need to factor in the gasoline. We can assume ethanol fuels to be 90%+ pure alcohol for the alcohol part of the blend (as this is a requirement of the fuel. I believe 93% is the legally required minimum). If I am not mistaken, the flashpoint for e90% is something like 55°F and it continues to go lower as the gasoline content increases. Note, the two figures stated in this paragraph are from memory and should be considered wrong, however, it demonstrates the point.

[VakaGT]

Could I run stage 2 EL e85

On an all stock car but with an air intake (Grimmspeed)? Or will I need to edit things like MAF scaling?

[steve99]

Originally Posted by VakaGT

Could I run stage 2 EL e85

On an all stock car but with an air intake (Grimmspeed)? Or will I need to edit things like MAF scaling?

looking at the grimspeed maf scaling the oft guys put in their tunes its very close to the stock scaling so it should be ok , but check with shiv at openflash he is the expert on that tune.

the grimspeed scaling was about 4% different in the midrange area.