Header and tune Decision

[Toyota GT 86]

I'm running Invidia Q300 + invidia catless frontpipe + invidia overpipe, perrin inlet hose + perrin cold air intake + perrin crank pulley.
The sound is really good (pretty quiet) and the power also without a tune yet.
Now I'm looking for a Header + tune.

What do you people with experience in headers and tunes recommend? I've in mind until now this options in header:
JDL
Tomei
FT86SP Catted

And for the tune not sure if going with OFT or Ecutek.

I'm looking for the best power gains.

Thanks.
@Sportsguy83

[FR-S Matt]

JDL header in that list provides the most gains, lifetime warranty, and coating options. Superior to the ones listed.

Ecutek is better than OFT as long as you're having someone do a custom tune and not an off the shelf one. You can pull close or right at 200 whp with those mods and a JDL header on 93 octane. Depends on how good your tuner is and also not all cars being the same. With those mods though, 200 whp should be doable depending on what gas you have available.

[lucid215]

im running the openflash headers and oft. havent got dynoed yet

[DarkSunrise]

I've heard a few times now that OFT runs more timing (aggressive) to make the same power gains vs. what a tuner would do on a custom tune. Is anyone able to confirm?

[FR-S Matt]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

I've heard a few times now that OFT runs more timing (aggressive) to make the same power gains vs. what a tuner would do on a custom tune. Is anyone able to confirm?

I don't see how that's possible because not everyone's car is the same which is what OFT assumes.

A custom tune will ALWAYS be better because its tailored for your car and not everyone elses. You can maximize gains on the dyno and also keep your car in the safe operable range. When it comes to tuning, I wouldn't even think twice about the OFT because it's cheaper. I'm not saying you won't get gains from an OFT. It's just a matter of how your car responds to the file that everyone else uses and how aggressive the map really is. Ecutek even has off the shelf maps from tuners for people who want a quick solution. Ecutek offers so much more both N/A and FI down the road if that's the path you want to take. For FI, Ecutek is a must. Most professional tuners use Ecutek at shops on dynos for our cars.

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by FR-S Matt

I don't see how that's possible because not everyone's car is the same which is what OFT assumes.

A custom tune will ALWAYS be better because its tailored for your car and not everyone elses. You can maximize gains on the dyno and also keep your car in the safe operable range. When it comes to tuning, I wouldn't even think twice about the OFT because it's cheaper. I'm not saying you won't get gains from an OFT. It's just a matter of how your car responds to the file that everyone else uses and how aggressive the map really is. Ecutek even has off the shelf maps from tuners for people who want a quick solution. Ecutek offers so much more both N/A and FI down the road if that's the path you want to take. For FI, Ecutek is a must. Most professional tuners use Ecutek at shops on dynos for our cars.

Sorry I may have been a bit vague as to what I was saying there. It was more a knock against OFT because I've heard it unnecessarily runs more timing than necessary for a given HP gain versus a custom (and theoretically safer) ECUTek tune. I was just hoping someone could confirm with hard data, as I haven't seen any yet.

So no one thinks I'm biased, I actually have an OFT on order that I'm thinking about canceling for a custom ECUTek tune. Still on the fence.

[FR-S Matt]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

Sorry I may have been a bit vague as to what I was saying there. It was more a knock against OFT because I've heard it unnecessarily runs more timing than necessary for a given HP gain versus a custom (and theoretically safer) ECUTek tune. I was just hoping someone could confirm with hard data, as I haven't seen any yet.

So no one thinks I'm biased, I actually have an OFT on order that I'm thinking about canceling for a custom ECUTek tune. Still on the fence.

I had a buddy remote tune my car on Ecutek and it runs amazing. All street pulls and I did probably about ~20 logs for him. Amazing what technology can do these days.

When I go FI, I'll be on the dyno though along with some street pulls. Not going to mess around with the tune for that.

[Shady195]

You're comparing an OTS tune meant to be a happy medium on thousands of cars vs a more customized tune whether it be done locally on a dyno or as an etune..

A custom tune to YOUR car will always be better, and more expensive.

[Shiv@Openflash]

Originally Posted by FR-S Matt

JDL header in that list provides the most gains, lifetime warranty, and coating options. Superior to the ones listed.

Ecutek is better than OFT as long as you're having someone do a custom tune and not an off the shelf one. You can pull close or right at 200 whp with those mods and a JDL header on 93 octane. Depends on how good your tuner is and also not all cars being the same. With those mods though, 200 whp should be doable depending on what gas you have available.

Custom tuned, you will get the same exact result running OFT as you will any other platform (ecutek included). And I really don't believe there is more than a few hp left in our OTS tunes to be extracted from custom tuning.

[Shiv@Openflash]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

Sorry I may have been a bit vague as to what I was saying there. It was more a knock against OFT because I've heard it unnecessarily runs more timing than necessary for a given HP gain versus a custom (and theoretically safer) ECUTek tune. I was just hoping someone could confirm with hard data, as I haven't seen any yet.

Someone is feeding you nonsense, to put it bluntly.

[Kodename47]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

It was more a knock against OFT because I've heard it unnecessarily runs more timing than necessary for a given HP gain versus a custom (and theoretically safer) ECUTek tune.

So, based on 2 (near) identical engines how does one make more power than another?


Also what is unnecessary ignition advance? Surely so long as it isn't knocking, why does it matter?

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by Shiv@Openflash

Someone is feeding you nonsense, to put it bluntly.

Shiv,

Thanks I was hoping you'd chime in. If you don't mind me asking (I'm a tuning newb, so forgive my ignorance) but I've read that in broad strokes, the proper way to dial in timing is to advance it until you're not making any additional power on a dyno (and obviously not knocking), than dial it back 1-2 degrees from there for safety. Is that correct, and is that how you dialed-in the OFT maps?

Thanks!

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by Kodename47

So, based on 2 (near) identical engines how does one make more power than another?


Also what is unnecessary ignition advance? Surely so long as it isn't knocking, why does it matter?

I assume through cam timing, A/F ratio, etc.

Unnecessary ignition advance would be any more than would make power on a dyno. Also see my post above to Shiv about pulling 1-2 degrees for safety.

Again I'm still learning about this, so I could be way off base.

[Shiv@Openflash]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

Shiv,

Thanks I was hoping you'd chime in. If you don't mind me asking (I'm a tuning newb, so forgive my ignorance) but I've read that in broad strokes, the proper way to dial in timing is to advance it until you're not making any additional power on a dyno (and obviously not knocking), than dial it back 1-2 degrees from there for safety. Is that correct, and is that how you dialed-in the OFT maps?

Thanks!

That's a sound approach if you can get to that point (Min timing for best torque). But on pump gas (and with high compression or turbo engines), you will run into detonation before that at most engine speeds. At which time the knock sensors will start to do their job and retard timing. So typically, one tunes up to this point on how much torque each advance increment is worth. At higher engine speeds, each degree can be worth big gains. So retarding 2 degrees from an ever-moving knock threshold isn't the best approach if you want something close to optimal performance. The mistake a lot of tuners make is that they dial things in exclusively on a dyno. And in a dyno room that doesn't have the best ventilation. So they are tuning in an environment that you will never see on the street. So once the car its the real world and breathes fresh air, it runs leaner than desired. Which is probably why they adopted the "retard 2 degree" rule. When the rule should really be "add a bit extra fuel"