Full throttle Electric Supercharger Build Thread

[fenton]

Originally Posted by Fast_Freddy

Except that no one else had similar results on other dynos. Most gained about 25whp to your 37whp.


IIRC Shiv was running 93 octane for that 217whp result but claimed the tune was "safe" for 91. The ECU handles such slight differences quite well on it's own. Anyway, here's a recent dyno from someone who hit 199whp on 91 with just a few bolt-ons.


http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64200


And here is 206.5 whp on 92:

There is always going to be the factory freaks i think we can all agree with that. There have been 100's upon 100's of FRS's on the dyno with full exhaust and a tune on 91 getting in the 180 range.

The second graph says no weather corrections and if im not mistaken the thread says that those conditions probably created another 10 hp or so.

In any regard, to each there own. Many people that want 200 hp also want 180 tq at 2500 rpm, thats what this system gives most people on the OFT tune.

Once e85 is vetted out for all that's a bump to 225hp for those that have access to it.... unfortunately i do not

[Fast_Freddy]

Originally Posted by fenton

The same could be said for most FI. Not many exhaust systems make a world of difference on the final numbers.

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

Actually exhaust mods can work miracles with true FI, especially turbocharging, but not with little battery powered blowers that can't keep up as air flow increases. It's all about airflow.


Where this little ESC excels is by pumping a lot of extra air into the engine at low rpm when it couldn't possibly ingest that same volume through suction alone. Where it fails is at max airflow and sustained volume. The blower spins too slowly and the batteries drain too quickly to warrant any comparison to real FI.


I don't think we'll see any ESCs at Bonneville any time soon but it is a great alternative to Nitrous for street use.

[Robftss]

Originally Posted by Jac

If installing my front/over pipe wasn't such a pain (had to jack the motor) I'd do a dyno without it to get a true stock vs. ESC only comparison.

I don't think it matters too much though, it should be pretty clear that the Phantom isn't about big peak hp gains but big low end torque. Thats loud and clear from every dyno in this thread.

Jac, I think your results are accurate and thanks for all the effort for this 100% independent test.

Certianly your base line is a little higher due to a little better VE with your mods, as expected. Most NA mods have little effect when the VE is raised with positive pressure. I'm sure on a stock car with just the Phantom and a proper tune will result in 25-30 whp (peak) on a dynojet.

This is great...add another dyno to the list.

Also 1/2 dump conversion Pdf is on the website.

Thanks, Rob.

[Jac]

Originally Posted by fenton

Cant wait to see what Rob has up his sleeve next, he seems to always have something

Crossing my fingers for the TQ300. On the street I don't get anywhere close to running out of juice with my single dump pack so I'm quite happy to sacrifice duration for more psi.

[Sojhinn]

Originally Posted by Jac

Crossing my fingers for the TQ300. On the street I don't get anywhere close to running out of juice with my single dump pack so I'm quite happy to sacrifice duration for more psi.

Do you have the .5 on order?

[Andrew025]

Originally Posted by fenton

This is the best way to describe it.

You get a lot of torque down low and it revs freely all the way to redline. The torque does decline after 6000 rpm...most boosted cars do as well....the important thing is the horsepower keeps climbing and makes a nice fat peak at the top.

You don't ever want HP to fall like it would in a VW gti or something like that.....that feels bad for a sports car.

You also don't want something that makes peak torque at redline where you have to rev the crap out of it all the time to not get walked over by a Toyota sienna.

Once you get to drive one I think you will be pleasantly suprised

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

Originally Posted by WNDSRFR

This is almost offensive.
Have you ever driven a turbocharged GTI?
HP falling off? WTF?


I'm trying my best to get the same performance I have enjoyed with my VW and I am pretty much there.


But really HP falling off?

Originally Posted by Robftss

Sorry this is what I am talking about.

After 5000 rpm the HP actually declines. It gets worse when you turn up the boost because you get more torque down low but the same HP up top.

Sorry wasn't trying to offend just was the first car that came to my mind.

Not that it really matters, but Rob=Fenton? Or am I seeing/missing something?

[fenton]

Originally Posted by Fast_Freddy

Actually exhaust mods can work miracles with true FI, especially turbocharging, but not with little battery powered blowers that can't keep up as air flow increases. It's all about airflow.


Where this little ESC excels is by pumping a lot of extra air into the engine at low rpm when it couldn't possibly ingest that same volume through suction alone. Where it fails is at max airflow and sustained volume. The blower spins too slowly and the batteries drain too quickly to warrant any comparison to real FI.


I don't think we'll see any ESCs at Bonneville any time soon but it is a great alternative to Nitrous for street use.

Oh what have we done without you here Freedy... i seriously started to miss you

The ESC is a new concept, its being worked on, its getting better and better

[Sojhinn]

Originally Posted by Andrew025

Not that it really matters, but Rob=Fenton? Or am I seeing/missing something?

Refresh. I don't have that on mine.

[Fast_Freddy]

Originally Posted by Jac

Got a link? I could only find this one but on Dynojet.

Stock: 178whp
ESC TQ250: 202whp

Now that is a typical Phantom esc gain. Fenton's gains are unique and have never been repeated.

[Sojhinn]

Originally Posted by Fast_Freddy

Now that is a typical Phantom esc gain. Fenton's gains are unique and have never been repeated.

Again I'm assuming my gains were due to my exhaust.

[Jac]

Originally Posted by Fast_Freddy

Where this little ESC excels is by pumping a lot of extra air into the engine at low rpm when it couldn't possibly ingest that same volume through suction alone. Where it fails is at max airflow and sustained volume. The blower spins too slowly and the batteries drain too quickly to warrant any comparison to real FI.

First, I completely agree with your synopsis of the pros and cons. But, i disagree that because of its single con (max/sustained airflow) you can't compare it to other FI.

For daily/street driving where cost/install time are valued above peak performance the ESC is a true alternative to traditional FI.

I'm getting similar (if not the same in some cases) WTQ between 3-5.5K that you'd easily pay at least double for using Innovate/Vortech/belt-driven SC.

[Fast_Freddy]

Originally Posted by Sojhinn

So im confused how much horse power is my op/ front pipe/ cbe producing in your opinion?

It's impossible to know without some very controlled dyno testing but IMO your exhaust mods with a good tune should be worth about 20-25 whp.

[Sojhinn]

Originally Posted by Fast_Freddy

It's impossible to know without some very controlled dyno testing but IMO your exhaust mods with a good tune should be worth about 20-25 whp.

So I started searching for any dyno to show gains for front pipe/ cbe gains. The most you could get even tuned was 5-7 hp from reputable sources. ( Perrin and nameless to name two). I have yet to see any gain 20 hp. Even shiv with a catless header, full exhaust and e85 still only hit 200 hp starting from his 172 hp base. It's safe to say that the gains here have been proven multiple times.

I'm not exactly sure why you are so negative towards this setup Freddy.

I know the esc doesn't produce the greatest gains up top. ( I'm sure it will with time) but it's still the best bang for your buck you can get.

[Andrew025]

Originally Posted by Sojhinn

Refresh. I don't have that on mine.