Full throttle Electric Supercharger Build Thread

[Pug]

Originally Posted by Thatruth2001

Be careful with setting this expectation when summer heat comes into the equation. Based on the feedback provided to Rob the control unit has been redesigned to better manage both the unit's and engine bay heat.

Currently I believe PUG has been running the unit the past few months in Phoenix and I wonder if he has tripped the unit on a few occasions.

I only tripped the thermal derate when testing while stationary, I never got it while driving when there was airflow into the engine bay. Notably in August I was doing a canyon run, [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arizona_State_Route_88"]Arizona State Route 88 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame], with a lot of ESC; according to my notes: car's ambient was 48 C (119 F), intake temperature was 58 C (137 F).

My ESC has DS18B20 temperature sensors mounted on the top of the controller and the top of the DC compressor motor. Those sensors on that run capped out at 67 C (152 F) on the controller and 75 C (167 F) on the compressor motor. If I remember correctly, thermal derate happens at 80 C.

Every straightaway I punched it, both in and out, so the ESC was getting a workout. It kept on working. So, the lesson is: keep moving when it's 119 F outside.

[migueralliart]

OK I didn't have the time to read thru the entire thread and this is basically my first post here.

I'm interested in this kit as it seems like a great way to add a bit more HP and TQ without spending hours and hours in installation.

I do have a couple of suggestions/questions with this kit;

1- Battery

My take is that the 24V battery is a low capacity high discharge battery (can you confirm the capacity?). From watching the videos I think this could be potentially improved. As soon as the system kicks in there is a voltage drop that is typical from the LEAD acid batteries and this leads to a loss in power. A couple of things that could potentially fix this are;

Use a small capacity LIFEPO4 battery (A123 cells) that is safe to use in Cars - These batteries recharge pretty quick and their discharge curve is flat meaning you will have a more constant discharge which means stable boost and more HP. Another advantage is the weight savings (not that this is a concern here). Charging the LIFEPO4 battery could be done with a custom bulk charger DC-DC converter etc.

2- Motor

The motor looks like a brushless 3 phase DC motor. If you up the voltage and lower the current with these motors the loss is less and efficiency goes up (power loss is the squared of the current).

3- Heat from motor transferring to Compressor Inlet

As you constantly use the motor it will heat up and also gather heat from the engine bay. A good thing could be to design a phenolic strong spacer to isolate the motor from the compressor. This could also be achieved by ceramic coating the inlet.

4- Variable Geometry inlet vanes

There are potential increases in HP from switching to a variable geometry inlet vane system. The drawback is that it is more complex to tune and design but it could be done. The positive thing about it is that it could potentially increase torque pre 5k rpms and therefore increase its overall performance curve giving you better acceleration.



Note; Take these as suggestions, I'm not implying that something is wrong with your system. I'll actually like to purchase it myself but I'm waiting for further improvements to make a purchase.

Keep up the good work I think this is an EXCELLENT mod to this engine.

[mid_life_crisis]

Originally Posted by Robftss

Attachment 66949

SPM mod. *this is for track KERS style testing, not needed for DD,AutoX,drag*

Left pic is stock WOT.
Right pic: de-solder exposed wire, solder wire extension (~24ga) to switch to 'open' circuit.

IMHO the SPM switch should be mounted near the gear lever center console...so when you shift the switch can be activated.

There used to be shift knobs you could buy with a switch built in. Wouldn't that make even more sense? Just thumb the switch forward or backward when you grab the shifter?

Originally Posted by Luckrider

Way more work than you think it is, and, you would need to have a working range on the rack or something.

Modern cars know the steering wheel position: there must be someplace to tap in.

[mid_life_crisis]

So far I've thought the switch discussion was about being able to prevent it from kicking in when negotiating turns, but I'm beginning to realize that some of you want to selectively engage it at part throttle when setting up to exit a turn so you can accelerate out with full power available as you step on the gas instead of the sudden rush of full throttle activation. Will this approach require any special tuning considerations?

[fenton]

Originally Posted by migueralliart

Note; Take these as suggestions, I'm not implying that something is wrong with your system. I'll actually like to purchase it myself but I'm waiting for dyno graphs to see the torque curve myself.

Keep up the good work I think this is an EXCELLENT mod to this engine.

These are all great suggestions and the reason that some of them haven't been implemented is

1. Costs - alot of these additions would significantly increase cost. Rob wanted to keep the cost of entry as low as possible.
2. KISS (Keep it simple stupid) - Adding complexity in the first iteration of this great product could lead to problems and Rob really wanted to develop a solid product that shows real results - which he did

As far as Dyno's.....there have been many!

[migueralliart]

I hear you ... thou there's been talks about different motors/compressors.

It'll be good to know if there is an optional motor capable of 5psi tapering down to 4 maybe. From the videos I see that boost peaks at 4 and comes down to almost 3.

I know the website is not fully capable for ordering yet.


Is there a current dyno using E85 ?

[WNDSRFR]

This car is such a blast to drive with the ESC. Not that it isn't fun to drive stock. But now I can pass with confidence and zip through traffic. I think I can finally keep up with my GTI. And I don't even have a tune yet! And the batteries haven't even been conditioned yet. Whenever I bought the FR-S, six months ago, I thought I would continue to drive the GTI to work. I mean the VW has been a blast to drive for the last 12 years but since I got the FR-S I'll bet I haven't put 100 miles on the GTI. I only use the VW as a truck to carry bags of dirt and my windsurfing gear. In fact, I finally know what people mean when they talk about VW's rubbery shifter and long clutch travel. Driving the VW now feels like I'm driving a semi.
Well, todays project is putting in the relay mod. I NEVER remember to turn the thing off. And I'm hoping for my new tune from Shiv.

[fenton]

Originally Posted by migueralliart

I hear you ... thou there's been talks about different motors/compressors.

It'll be good to know if there is an optional motor capable of 5psi tapering down to 4 maybe. From the videos I see that boost peaks at 4 and comes down to almost 3.

I know the website is not fully capable for ordering yet.


Is there a current dyno using E85 ?

Yes the first one I posted is e85 and the tq250. It made 223hp.

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[WNDSRFR]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

I have sent out OTS maps for the Phantom SC to several people over the last few days. If you need one, just email me (shiv@vishntuning.com) and include your original ROM.

Shiv,


Is this the proper e-mail address or is it shiv@vishnutuning.com?

[fenton]

Originally Posted by WNDSRFR

Shiv,


Is this the proper e-mail address or is it shiv@vishnutuning.com?

Email both lol. He will get one for sure

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[Shiv@Openflash]

Oops... Definitely shiv@vishnutuning.com

[1086]

@shiv@vishnu - Many people suggest getting 'true wideband' and 'boost gauges' if you are going to run FI.

In the future will the OFT offer true wideband as well as show me boost if I had an FI kit installed (whichever one it may be?) I am curious as I don't necessarily want EcuTek since I have your solution. Thank you.

[jamesm]

Originally Posted by 1086

@shiv@vishnu - Many people suggest getting 'true wideband' and 'boost gauges' if you are going to run FI.

In the future will the OFT offer true wideband as well as show me boost if I had an FI kit installed (whichever one it may be?) I am curious as I don't necessarily want EcuTek since I have your solution. Thank you.

you can log the map sensor, and depending on how much boost this thing makes the stock one may be good enough that you don't have to replace it. it reads up to ~5psi or so. if you're going with something else, you'll want at least an aftermarket map sensor to read higher than that. for the wideband, you'd have to add an aftermarket unit like an innovate lc1/lc2, aem uego, etc. you can scale the stock o2 sensor to read lower but it's not very accurate at richer afrs.

i wouldn't really worry about adding a boost gauge for this though. very little chance of overboosting . if you have a turbo, you should definitely either wait until OFT implements a boost cut function or get racerom so you can implement one yourself or have your tuner do it for you. if you're going with a supercharger you wouldn't need to worry about that.

[Shiv@Openflash]

Originally Posted by 1086

@shiv@vishnu - Many people suggest getting 'true wideband' and 'boost gauges' if you are going to run FI.

In the future will the OFT offer true wideband as well as show me boost if I had an FI kit installed (whichever one it may be?) I am curious as I don't necessarily want EcuTek since I have your solution. Thank you.

It would't be terribly hard to integrate a wideband input and justing datalogging channels accordingly. Easy option would be to replace the rear o2 sensor with a wideband o2 sensor and a controller that offers both a linear 0-5v output as well as a ECU friendly 0-1v output. That would be simple and really wouldn't require any more work than adding another logging channel name and applying voltage to AFR/lambda conversion in the logging code.

But for all intents in purposes, I don't know how useful that is since the front o2 sensor is already a wideband until, albeit limited by software and questionable calibration settings.