ecutek ?

[Luckrider]

Originally Posted by kuhlka

Open Flash Tablet is like Tuneboy (motorcycles). Yeah, it's great for people who can do tuning themselves, but good luck finding a professional who specializes in it and is willing to use it on a dyno (even though it works almost identically to Power Commander).

The fact that Ecutek is opening things up makes me think they're trying to stay in competition with the other options popping up.

There are numerous shops already committed to tuning with it since it works with RomRaider which is a highly popular Subaru tuning platform already and with the increased logging that is soon to be released for the OFT, it is becoming an even more useful tool. At this point there are only 3 key differences.

ECUtek has Custom Maps Great extra for ECUtek as it allows much more control and safety for FI. @jamesm can speak to this and holds this particular feature in high regard. It also allows for multiple maps without flashing, just swapping with the cruise control stalk. These features require a MasterTuner to make them or a paid license of the extra RaceRom features for $300 IIRC.

ECUtek can be locked hard (.dev files will soon allow CARB complience while maintaining open standards for the OFT). Locked tunes and cracked (redesigned) ROMs are bad for things like dealer visits. This could cause issues for things like the CAL ID update at the dealer and could kill your warranty quickly. The OFT can revert back to 100% stock.

Price. The cheapest you can get into ECUtek is for ~$750 IIRC and that is without a tune depending on the tuner.

Edit: Just to add to the point, @kuhlka, here is one of the big companies using an OFT to prove their product.

[Luckrider]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

It also seems to be quite great for people who don't do tuning themselves and just want to run our off-the-shelf maps that seem to work as well (or better) than custom tuned maps from other tuning platforms. Some people forget that we have been tuning Subaru engines since 1999. We have nothing to hide and are proud of the way our OTS map work. And the results speak for themselves. All this talk of needing to custom dyno or e-tune maps is outlandish on 99% of all customer cars. I sometimes wonder what motivates others to suggest that they need all these additional services. Toyota can make a map that works consistently on all cars of similar hardware configuration, all of the time. No reason why a competent tuner can't do the same to cars with different hardware configuration.

Especially when the tuner has OEM experience

[kuhlka]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

It also seems to be quite great for people who don't do tuning themselves and just want to run our off-the-shelf maps that seem to work as well (or better) than custom tuned maps from other tuning platforms. Some people forget that we have been tuning Subaru engines since 1999. We have nothing to hide and are proud of the way our OTS map work. And the results speak for themselves. All this talk of needing to custom dyno or e-tune maps is outlandish on 99% of all customer cars. I sometimes wonder what motivates others to suggest that they need all these additional services. Toyota can make a map that works consistently on all cars of similar hardware configuration, all of the time. No reason why a competent tuner can't do the same to cars with different hardware configuration.

And seriously, hard time finding tuners who will use OFT? What nonsense. The only tuners that will refuse to tune with OFT/Rom Raider are those who are already invested in a competing tuning platform. And with that in mind, they are more interested in their needs than yours. Go elsewhere and find tuners that actually tune in exchange for money, not job security.

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make. Should I have specified dyno, on-road, or e-tune? What this whole OFT vs Ecutek vs other options boils down to is different strokes for different folks. Some people want map switching and the numerous other features Ecutek offers. Some people want a moderately less expensive option that offers most of the same features.

Is there a website I can go to which shows clearly nationwide WHO actively uses OFT and offers package deals? That's probably what the OP is looking for if they're considering OFT as an option.

Better to promote OFT's features and add new stuff than waste time knocking Ecutek. You've got a name recognition hill to climb. I've had an STI since 05, and I've never heard of OFT.

[Luckrider]

Originally Posted by kuhlka

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make. Should I have specified dyno, on-road, or e-tune? What this whole OFT vs Ecutek vs other options boils down to is different strokes for different folks. Some people want map switching and the numerous other features Ecutek offers. Some people want a moderately less expensive option that offers most of the same features.

Is there a website I can go to which shows clearly nationwide WHO actively uses OFT and offers package deals? That's probably what the OP is looking for if they're considering OFT as an option.

Better to promote OFT's features and add new stuff than waste time knocking Ecutek. You've got a name recognition hill to climb. I've had an STI since 05, and I've never heard of OFT.

Before this devolves into another sour day for a vendor (who has been banned more than once for discussion about tuning platforms with a different troll vendor), please not that Shiv has only talked about the OFT. It is others like myself who mention ECUtek and I personally love what they offer but disagree with some of their methods and don't see the need for such powerful ROM cracking for most people.

[kuhlka]

Originally Posted by Luckrider

Edit: Just to add to the point, @kuhlka, here is one of the big companies using an OFT to prove their product.

I wasn't suggesting OFT is a sub-par product, merely that Ecutek is widespread and their website has tons of master tuners listed, making it easy to find someone within a few hours away to dial in the car. I had a great experience with Drift-Office and the car vastly improved from stock to their final map. If I'd remained stock I might have burned up my valves or ended up with a DI failure...

If I had the money to blow, I'd pick up an OFT just to check it out.

[kuhlka]

Originally Posted by Luckrider

Before this devolves into another sour day for a vendor (who has been banned more than once for discussion about tuning platforms with a different troll vendor), please not that Shiv has only talked about the OFT. It is others like myself who mention ECUtek and I personally love what they offer but disagree with some of their methods and don't see the need for such powerful ROM cracking for most people.

The last comment was a snipe, "Go elsewhere and find tuners that actually tune in exchange for money, not job security."

Otherwise, I totally agree with your sentiment. Nothing wrong with OFT, I'm just not sure why it exploded in this thread when the OP was asking about Ecutek. There are tons of threads about both.

[Shiv@Openflash]

Originally Posted by kuhlka

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make. Should I have specified dyno, on-road, or e-tune? What this whole OFT vs Ecutek vs other options boils down to is different strokes for different folks. Some people want map switching and the numerous other features Ecutek offers. Some people want a moderately less expensive option that offers most of the same features.

Is there a website I can go to which shows clearly nationwide WHO actively uses OFT and offers package deals? That's probably what the OP is looking for if they're considering OFT as an option.

Better to promote OFT's features and add new stuff than waste time knocking Ecutek. You've got a name recognition hill to climb. I've had an STI since 05, and I've never heard of OFT.

I'm not knocking anyone. I'm merely addressing your comment about not being able to find a tuner who will custom tune via OFT/Rom Raider as there are plenty of them. Rom Raider has been used successfully by the Suby community for years and anyone who refused to tune with it is just being stubborn at this point. It is also a mistake to limit your search to tuners who are active on this forum. There are many more out there that focus exclusively on tuning and not on selling product or engaging in internet wars. These are probably the tuners that many people will find helpful in their quest for nicely tuned car (assuming that the OTS maps don't fit their needs already).

The truth is that there are many participants in the professional tuning community to treat tuning like it's black magic. Often because to them, it is black magic due to inexperience. They will tell people that they absolutely need A, B and C features to get their cars to run like it should. 9/10 times this isn't true. And nothing makes that point more obvious that someone else proving that point in a open environment.

[Luckrider]

There certainly are some great ECUtek tuners out there, but others have had some less than spectacular tunes from so called "MasterTuners." Then their are guys like FBM and Drift-Office who provide nothing but great tunes for their customers. I wouldn't trust that list since it is no different than a company that list all of the stores that sell their product and half of them are shady ebay stores. Building a reputation with a local tuner for dyno/road tuning, or checking into a highly reputable vendor who doesn't shroud their work in a veil of mystery.

[Shiv@Openflash]

Originally Posted by Luckrider

There certainly are some great ECUtek tuners out there, but others have had some less than spectacular tunes from so called "MasterTuners." Then their are guys like FBM and Drift-Office who provide nothing but great tunes for their customers. I wouldn't trust that list since it is no different than a company that list all of the stores that sell their product and half of them are shady ebay stores. Building a reputation with a local tuner for dyno/road tuning, or checking into a highly reputable vendor who doesn't shroud their work in a veil of mystery.

The truth.

[jamesm]

what you use to tune has much less to do with the result than who is doing the work. of course i'll argue ecutek is the only way to go if you're FI or plan on making big power, because right now it's the only way to tune a turbo car safely, imho. that said, you sound like the perfect candidate for an OFT and OTS maps. if your car is spec'd right for one of the OTS tunes, they're the best you can get without doing it yourself or paying someone local, with experience tuning fa20s to do it, and they're pretty damn rare unless you happen to live near delicious, drift office, or a couple others.

it doesn't seem to me as though you'd be taking advantage of any of the more advanced features ecutek offers. get an OFT and enjoy it. if you do decide to go turbo in the future, there's a good chance oft will have come a long way by then, and if not you can always sell it.

[kuhlka]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

I'm not knocking anyone. I'm merely addressing your comment about not being able to find a tuner who will custom tune via OFT/Rom Raider as there are plenty of them. Rom Raider has been used successfully by the Suby community for years and anyone who refused to tune with it is just being stubborn at this point. It is also a mistake to limit your search to tuners who are active on this forum. There are many more out there that focus exclusively on tuning and not on selling product or engaging in internet wars. These are probably the tuners that many people will find helpful in their quest for nicely tuned car (assuming that the OTS maps don't fit their needs already).

The truth is that there are many participants in the professional tuning community to treat tuning like it's black magic. Often because to them, it is black magic due to inexperience. They will tell people that they absolutely need A, B and C features to get their cars to run like it should. 9/10 times this isn't true. And nothing makes that point more obvious that someone else proving that point in a open environment.

I think I'm just speaking from my own experience. There aren't a ton of options in NWOH. Accelerated in Toledo doesn't have an Ecutek license and I'd already purchased Ecutek since I'm planning to eventually go supercharged. Pure? LOL. I've heard horror stories and it took them over a month to do a wheel bearing. Aside from that, there aren't many options under 2 hours away. At least now I can get the latest update and have Accelerated help me out when I go FI.

I really hope the open guys are able to get the FI stuff bumped up so tuning is much more affordable for people with a clue. My comment about Tuneboy wasn't meant to be a knock. I use it on my Triumph and two Ducatis. It actually let me add cruise control to my Diavel and fully remap the bike to be smooth as butter down to 1500rpm. It's one of the few options out there for direct ECU reflash/trim. The problem in the motorcycle world is that most shops only use Power Commander.

[FT-86 SpeedFactory]

If this Ecutek is coming from us, its's coming from our in house tuner, who does nothing but tune cars and will tailor this tune to your car and your exact mod list and logs.

Stages 1, 2, and 3 are all marketing terms. If things went they way I wished there would be no "stages" but only custom tunes to fit the extract specifications. Unfortunately too many companies have muddied the waters with stages so most are forced to follow.

Rest assured we only tune to the specific car and the parts installed.