Full throttle Electric Supercharger Build Thread

[Robftss]

Originally Posted by bfrank1972

Fenton, looking at your dyno charts I don't doubt it. At SL I'm thinking the torque curve is starting to look similar to my old E36 M3 (but in a much much lighter vehicle).

So I'm sifting through this entire thread now, and have read the specs on Phantom's website (what I could make of them). To circle back to one of my original questions - say I leave the thing on and just run it wide open at the track. I mean run the hell out of it. What happens when you completely deplete the batteries? Anything bad? Does it eventually start placing heavy load on your alternator or does the control module shut things down?

I know we're in the development stages here, just curious. Sounds like you guys might need a 'sea level' tester. Ahem cough I live near the beach

Failsafes:
Thermal derate
Thermal shutdown
or LVC (low voltage cut-off)

A duty cycle of over 20% will cause one or all of these things to happen to protect itself and the car.

It is impossible to safely harvest enough energy from an alternator.

Now...a time attack event on a road course is do able, with a few provisions.

[Calum]

Originally Posted by bakerr6

You could utilize the unichip to run this, but you would need to alter the reading to pass through the unichip first. What I mean by this is for instance, you could controll boost with the boost controller built into the unichip, I don't see why you couldn't control the load via an input signal into the unichip. May be an interesting theory.

I'm still new to this whole theory, but have been paying close attention. I like the idea of the electric supercharger

The problem is going to be controlling the motor. From a control stand point a pulse wide modulated input power would be easier to produce without dumping a bunch of power to heat. But I doubt the motor would enjoy that much at all. A low pass filter might work to smooth out the power delivery, but again it'll dump a bunch of power as heat. There's other options, but none that I can think of are very appealing to an application where even the temperature of the batteries is enough to cause noticeable power differences.

[Calum]

Originally Posted by Robftss

Failsafes:
Thermal derate
Thermal shutdown
or LVC (low voltage cut-off)

A duty cycle of over 20% will cause one or all of these things to happen to protect itself and the car.

It is impossible to safely harvest enough energy from an alternator.

Now...a time attack event on a road course is do able, with a few provisions.

A few provisions, in the name of three Odyssey PC2150's as 'ballast.' lol

[Bu-Tang]

Originally Posted by Sojhinn

Here's a question: with a few of us wondering if the unichip could be utilized to run this I was wondering if the motor controller on the phantom was variable.

The unichip reads the throttle position so in theory we could use the unichip to control the speed of the super charger that way it's not full bore on when activated. I.e variable speed on the supercharger based on throttle position.

Based on my driving experience, it sounds like a good idea but you would never need this feature, your not getting an insane amount of boost, 5PSI is not alot to begin with, when you want it you go WOT, anything less NA is more than enough.


Its hard to explain I guess since Im actually driving it but I thought the same as well prior to getting it, until I had it.

Maybe @fenton can explain better.....

[Thatruth2001]

Based on my converstion with Rob, I am running the system without drag reduction, I think. Maybe he can confirm.

ECUteck tuning continues. OK a few things to note about this dyno:

Typical stock runs are around 142 whp
4 runs were completed back to back (2 w/ ESC Turned Off and 2 w/ ESC On Boosting)
All tuning has been done with ECUtek
Perrin Performance (Chris and Jeff) doing the tuning


I have run the following ECUteck files so far:

Stock
Perrin NA Tune

Dyno Test
Perrin ESC Test Tune

Currently, the dyno results are in Jeff and Chris' hands. The AFRs will eventually be cleaned up in the coming days.

Note, with the ESC off, the dyno came back -12 whp compared to stock. I do not know if this is tune related or an air restriction, but we will eventually find out once the tune is tightened up. I have another updated file at home to install after work to address the check engine light.

Personally, this dyno expains what I have been feeling and why I have not been quick to do any 0-60 mph runs. Currently, I know once the tune is corrected this will really shine below 4,500

This project is killing my productivity at work....... Let the debate begin !

[fenton]

Originally Posted by Bu-Tang

Based on my driving experience, it sounds like a good idea but you would never need this feature, your not getting an insane amount of boost, 5PSI is not alot to begin with, when you want it you go WOT, anything less NA is more than enough.


Its hard to explain I guess since Im actually driving it but I thought the same as well prior to getting it, until I had it.

Maybe @fenton can explain better.....

Without the drag resistance I would have said yes for sure I want partial activation. Now I can safely say that it wouldn't bother me one way or the other.

Only place you would really notice a partial activation is at low rpm in 5th or 6thgear.

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[fenton]

Originally Posted by Thatruth2001

Based on my converstion with Rob, I am running the system without drag reduction, I think. Maybe he can confirm.

ECUteck tuning continues. OK a few things to note about this dyno:

Typical stock runs are around 142 whp
4 runs were completed back to back (2 w/ ESC Turned Off and 2 w/ ESC On Boosting)
All tuning has been done with ECUtek
Perrin Performance (Chris and Jeff) doing the tuning


I have run the following ECUteck files so far:

Stock
Perrin NA Tune

Dyno Test
Perrin ESC Test Tune

Currently, the dyno results are in Jeff and Chris' hands. The AFRs will eventually be cleaned up in the companing days.

Note, with the ESC off, the dyno came back -12 whp compared to stock. I do not know if this is tune related or an air restriction, but we will eventually find out once the tune is tightened up. I have another updated file at home to install after work to address teh check engine light.

Personally, this dyno expains what I have been feeling and why I have not been quick to do any 0-60 mph runs. Currently, I know once the tune is corrected this will really shine below 4,500

This project is killing my productivity at work....... Let the debate begin !

Looks like you were having a similar issue to us in the beginning. Problem being the tune didn't account for the load being generated down low. As soon as it drops out of the ecus tables it goes extremely rich which is why you don't have any torque below 4000 rpm.

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[fenton]

Did you run the car on the dyno with the system taken off? We have seen variance of 10 HP car to car stock depending on the motor.

My prediction is without the drag reduction system on place your na perfmance will take a small hit once over 4000 when the engine needs more air. Rob can elloborate I'm sure.

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[Thatruth2001]

Originally Posted by fenton

Did you run the car on the dyno with the system taken off? We have seen variance of 10 HP car to car stock depending on the motor.

My prediction is without the drag reduction system on place your na perfmance will take a small hit once over 4000 when the engine needs more air. Rob can elloborate I'm sure.

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I wanted a reference point to confirm what I have been feeling with the unit left off entirely.

And the wave that was produced on the dyno confirmed a feeling I experienced initially when it was engaged at Low RPMS. I have confidence Perrin will figure out what's going on. It sucks though becuase I want to autoX the car this Sunday and may decided to take the ESC off to just be safe.

[Robftss]

I have requested a 'stock tune' run, so we can all see its affect.

Seems close, at least in the normal AFR range.

Expectations are +20% peak HP, +33% peak TQ, and a 50% jump in HP/TQ @ 4000 rpm.

Thanks Thatruth2001

[Tromatic]

I'm having trouble with the images for some reason. I'm from the comments that a whole lot of gains are coming below 5k? Has anyone tested the turbo at a lower throttle percentage yet?

[fenton]

Originally Posted by Tromatic

I'm having trouble with the images for some reason. I'm from the comments that a whole lot of gains are coming below 5k? Has anyone tested the turbo at a lower throttle percentage yet?

First page. Once I got a tune we were able to start as low as 2000 rpm.

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[bfrank1972]

Yikes if I'm reading right, looks like AFR is way outta wack in the lower rpm band with the ESC, the HP curve dives below stock. Gains in the upper RPM band where boost is already trailing off look very encouraging - let's get that tune sorted!

[fenton]

Originally Posted by bfrank1972

Yikes if I'm reading right, looks like AFR is way outta wack in the lower rpm band with the ESC, the HP curve dives below stock. Gains in the upper RPM band where boost is already trailing off look very encouraging - let's get that tune sorted!

This is something that people have never tuned before. Its going to take a little bit for people without experience to tune. With @Toma we were tuning for a solid 4 hours for our intro baseline.

This was a quick and dirty get it working at all RPM's and get the AFR's optimal.

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