stock suspension the bomb?

[blackhawkdown]

I just spent 12 hours reading a lot of threads and post about after market suspension and stock suspension. I've come to a conclusion that the stock suspension is kicking some serious ass in autox and track. So why upgrade it at all and just add stickier tires? I know adding sticky tires change the handling characteristics of the car but does it warrant a new suspension setup? I'm no way a suspension guru nor claim to know anything about suspension. Please share your knowledge so I don't go waste my money on after market suspension for daily driving and hooning.

[SomeoneWhoIsntMe]

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7910

[blackhawkdown]

Originally Posted by SomeoneWhoIsntMe

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7910

Read it.

[7thgear]

because upgraded done right will yield faster times


but this has to be balanced against what you want and whether you're doing it for fun, or for serious competition, and what sort of competition you're in


if you're up against guys who are not only good but ALSO dumping cash into their cars, you'll lose every time. So you'll need to start playing their game or go into a class or race environment where mods are limited.




the point is that you should know what and why you're upgrading and for that you need to be able to identify a problem in the cars handling and express it into words.


what you often see is people simply saying "I want a better handling car," but when i ask them "what is it that's bothering you about your current setup" they go mum.

[CSG David]

Originally Posted by blackhawkdown

I just spent 12 hours reading a lot of threads and post about after market suspension and stock suspension. I've come to a conclusion that the stock suspension is kicking some serious ass in autox and track. So why upgrade it at all and just add stickier tires? I know adding sticky tires change the handling characteristics of the car but does it warrant a new suspension setup? I'm no way a suspension guru nor claim to know anything about suspension. Please share your knowledge so I don't go waste my money on after market suspension for daily driving and hooning.

We've shared all experiences, data, and observations to the community regarding the basis for modification. There are a few suspension threads that address these issues in depth (just in case people go troll mode on the "search" function button).

Suspension and budget has a strong correlation. The higher the budget, the better the suspension setup. Stock suspension has been dialed and optimized for the vehicle utilizing some sort of diagram to balance daily, performance, safety, cost, quality, materials, use, and probably the senior citizen/girl test.

For this instance, you'll notice that suspension kits either lean towards great street comfort but suffer in the performance category. Maybe the cost is super low, so all the other parameters suffer. Perhaps the materials suck but everything else is great just to keep cost in a specific territory. Every parameter affects another one. What you need to do is identify your goals, your budget, and your particular use. These are important before moving forward.

Sticky tires can only go so far. The OEM suspension was designed around upgraded street tires and factory tires. Once you go R-comp, the suspension won't be able to handle the additional stress/loading and the performance will eventually decrease at a certain point. Again, define scope of your use and everything should fall into place.

[Racecomp Engineering]

Originally Posted by CSG David

We've shared all experiences, data, and observations to the community regarding the basis for modification. There are a few suspension threads that address these issues in depth (just in case people go troll mode on the "search" function button).

Suspension and budget has a strong correlation. The higher the budget, the better the suspension setup. Stock suspension has been dialed and optimized for the vehicle utilizing some sort of diagram to balance daily, performance, safety, cost, quality, materials, use, and probably the senior citizen/girl test.

For this instance, you'll notice that suspension kits either lean towards great street comfort but suffer in the performance category. Maybe the cost is super low, so all the other parameters suffer. Perhaps the materials suck but everything else is great just to keep cost in a specific territory. Every parameter affects another one. What you need to do is identify your goals, your budget, and your particular use. These are important before moving forward.

Sticky tires can only go so far. The OEM suspension was designed around upgraded street tires and factory tires. Once you go R-comp, the suspension won't be able to handle the additional stress/loading and the performance will eventually decrease at a certain point. Again, define scope of your use and everything should fall into place.

Well put.

- Andy

[blackhawkdown]

My goal is to run potenza re11 on 17x8.

[CSG David]

Originally Posted by blackhawkdown

My goal is to run potenza re11 on 17x8.

Track, autocross, daily, canyon, etc. What are the percentage breakdowns? Every setting requires a dedicated setup to be competitive, obviously, tweaks can be made to optimize all the parameters but you won't be extremely competitive at every single category.

[7thgear]

Originally Posted by blackhawkdown

My goal is to run potenza re11 on 17x8.

the wheel will bump you out of c-street, if that means anything.


I wouldn't upgrade to anything other than 17x9, as this will cover you in most situations.

[blackhawkdown]

Daily driving and some street hooning. I will probably see 0-1% track time. I am gonna be an Army Instructor at Fort Eustis teaching Advance Individual Training to new boots who just graduated from BASIC. I don't really have time to track or autox. I hate body roll and I like to feel the road. I do not like soft suspensions but I hate really hard ones too. It needs to be comfortable for DD and long rides as I travel a lot. It's not uncommon for me to travel 700+ mile one way.

I've been reading that Bilstein B8 w/ RCE yellow springs or other drop springs are a good pair.

[Jyn]

I've seen a lot of your posts around the suspension threads, and honestly, it seems stock setup is what would suit you. There's minimal body roll, and the very small amount that's present is a good indicator to slow down if you're street hooning as it's right at the limit of where one should be on a public road.

If aesthetics is not something of major concern to you, stock setup should serve you fine, IMO.

[wparsons]

Why do you hate body roll? Making the car corner flat won't automatically give it more grip. Even stock there is good road feel, especially with better tires.

[gramicci101]

Originally Posted by blackhawkdown

I've been reading that Bilstein B8 w/ RCE yellow springs or other drop springs are a good pair.

They do, but the RCE Yellows are designed more for the OEM struts. The RCE Tarmacs are designed to work better with Bilstein B8's. Koni inserts can work with both, as they can be tuned softer for the Yellows and harder for the Tarmacs. But they're an insert, which is a pain in the ass. I think Turn-in Concepts is selling them preassembled into OEM strut bodies.

Also, that's a very nice RS in your sig.

[was385]

Originally Posted by blackhawkdown

Daily driving and some street hooning. I will probably see 0-1% track time. I am gonna be an Army Instructor at Fort Eustis teaching Advance Individual Training to new boots who just graduated from BASIC. I don't really have time to track or autox. I hate body roll and I like to feel the road. I do not like soft suspensions but I hate really hard ones too. It needs to be comfortable for DD and long rides as I travel a lot. It's not uncommon for me to travel 700+ mile one way.

I've been reading that Bilstein B8 w/ RCE yellow springs or other drop springs are a good pair.

I would just go with RCE yellows and be done. Should accomplish all your goals and very affordably.