To the manual FR-S drivers

[industrial86]

Hola,

This isn't a FR-S specific question, and I am not a professional driver..I have questions basic driving method. I am not exactly new at manual driving, but I want to get solid conclusive answers for these questions.

Here are my 2 questions:

A) Burning the clutch: I am under the impression it is only really possible to burn the clutch if you either engage the clutch while revving Too HIGH and or ride the clutch halfway for prolonged periods of time. A normal low RPM balanced engagment of the clutch on first gear shouldn't theoretically burn anything right?

B) I know you maintain more control over the vehicle if you downshift to a stop, BUT is there anything actually wrong with Pressing down to disengage the clutch/using the brake to come to a stop? if you are are sitting at a Redlight in 1st gear and have the Clutch fully pressed down to disengaged...this Shouldn't damage the car at all right?

Realistically is there a MAJOR advantage to downshifting to a stop? Should i be sitting at red lights in neutral...then shifting into 1st on green? It's more personal preference, correct?

Thanks!

[SubieNate]

A. Correct. Even normal use will eventually wear out the clutch though. It is a wear item. Generally, a clutch should last a minimum of 150k with normal street driving. Sometimes more. My Impreza L Wagon's clutch made it close to 170 before it went, and it was accelerated by a cracked shift fork which caused it to drag every time I shifted.

B. There's technically nothing wrong with just pushing the clutch in, coming to a stop, and putting it into first and going. But, there are advantages to downshifting. First off, even if you don't let the clutch back out, it's easier to row down through the gears than to go 6-1. At a stop, the high gears become more difficult to get out of, and as you downshift the shaft speeds in the transmission are naturally going to closer to what you want when you shift into first.

Downshifting and engine braking to a stop, under normal traffic conditions, can really reduce the amount of brake you have to use around town. Which will make your pads last longer, especially if you're running track/street combo type pads that wear things more quickly. I also like to practice revmatching and heel toe shifts as I drive around town. It can be a real challenge to pull off a smooth heel toe at a slow pace.

I shift to neutral at red lights and quickly put it into first right before I think it's going to turn green. Usually on the yellow for the opposing traffic. It's mostly personal preference, but I tend to believe that your throw out bearing will last longer if you're not holding the clutch down for extended periods of time.

Hope that helps.

Nathan

[Rayme]

Originally Posted by industrial86

Hola,

This isn't a FR-S specific question, and I am not a professional driver..I have questions basic driving method. I am not exactly new at manual driving, but I want to get solid conclusive answers for these questions.

Here are my 2 questions:

A) Burning the clutch: I am under the impression it is only really possible to burn the clutch if you either engage the clutch while revving Too HIGH and or ride the clutch halfway for prolonged periods of time. A normal low RPM balanced engagment of the clutch on first gear shouldn't theoretically burn anything right?

B) I know you maintain more control over the vehicle if you downshift to a stop, BUT is there anything actually wrong with Pressing down to disengage the clutch/using the brake to come to a stop? if you are are sitting at a Redlight in 1st gear and have the Clutch fully pressed down to disengaged...this Shouldn't damage the car at all right?

Realistically is there a MAJOR advantage to downshifting to a stop? Should i be sitting at red lights in neutral...then shifting into 1st on green? It's more personal preference, correct?

Thanks!

1. You won't burn the clutch in first in everyday driving, I usually rev up to around 1500-1600 and steadily release the clutch, it should take less than a second to fully release it when you're used to it without bucking the car.

2. If you are coming to a stop or a red light, there's nothing wrong coasting in neutral. Downshifting without rev matching will wear out the clutch a bit more but it's pretty much you're own driving style, there's no right or wrong.

If it's only to slow down with the intention to accelerate, downshifting is the way to go.

There's nothing wrong with having the clutch pressed in at a stop light for short time, but I wouldnt do that for minutes long...it gives un-needed wear on the through out bearing. (Or if you have a 2nd gen DSM, hehehehehe )

[industrial86]

thanks a lot that does help. I finally feel like i've been driving correctly the whole time haha.

[DanoFA20]

Originally Posted by industrial86

Hola,

This isn't a FR-S specific question, and I am not a professional driver..I have questions basic driving method. I am not exactly new at manual driving, but I want to get solid conclusive answers for these questions.

Here are my 2 questions:

A) Burning the clutch: I am under the impression it is only really possible to burn the clutch if you either engage the clutch while revving Too HIGH and or ride the clutch halfway for prolonged periods of time. A normal low RPM balanced engagment of the clutch on first gear shouldn't theoretically burn anything right?

B) I know you maintain more control over the vehicle if you downshift to a stop, BUT is there anything actually wrong with Pressing down to disengage the clutch/using the brake to come to a stop? if you are are sitting at a Redlight in 1st gear and have the Clutch fully pressed down to disengaged...this Shouldn't damage the car at all right?

Realistically is there a MAJOR advantage to downshifting to a stop? Should i be sitting at red lights in neutral...then shifting into 1st on green? It's more personal preference, correct?

Thanks!

holding the pedal in and in first gear isnt ideal usually for best or lowest amount of wear,just drop her in neutral and wait for the light.
never down shift to first. and using brakes and not downshifting wont hurt anything you may just stall. lol its more efficient to slow down using a mix of down shifting and lightly braking, in everyday driving :-)

best way to learn in my experience is to just go somewhere quiet, put hte car in first rev up to 2800 rpm and slowly lift the pedal till you feel that nice friction/catching point. once you get the feel for it, the rest youll learn naturally

[SVThis]

It's cheaper to replace brake pads than a clutch.

[PNW FRS]

Originally Posted by SVThis

It's cheaper to replace brake pads than a clutch.

+1

[SubieNate]

Originally Posted by SVThis

It's cheaper to replace brake pads than a clutch.

And that's why you don't slip the clutch tard. Rev match and clutch wear from downshifting is minimal at most.

Nathan

[rice_classic]

To reduce wear on my clutch I just "drop the hammer". Yeah, that's a technical term.

[SVThis]

Originally Posted by SubieNate

And that's why you don't slip the clutch tard. Rev match and clutch wear from downshifting is minimal at most.

Nathan

Don't think I mentioned anything about slipping the clutch tard

[TuxedoCartman]

One benefit of donwshifting as you're slowing down: should you need to execute any sort of emergency maneuvers, you will be in a proper gear already, and less likely to stall the vehicle. This is a vital technique in motorcycling that I feel still has merit in car driving.

[SubieNate]

Originally Posted by SVThis

Don't think I mentioned anything about slipping the clutch tard

Oops. Just read my post. My phone autocorrected me into sounding like an asshole. That'll teach me. There was supposed to be a "like a" in there. Didn't mean to imply you didn't know how to drive or were mentally deficient in any way. My apologies.

TuxedoCartman brings up a good point. On a bike, if you don't revmatch properly you can seriously screw yourself over. Too little rear grip to get away with letting the clutch out suddenly in the wrong gear. So being in the correct gear for the speed you are travelling, regardless of whether you are positively or negatively accelerating is very important.

Nathan

[SVThis]

Apology accepted

[oaroyale]

I too was burning my clutch before I adjusted it. It's just set too high out of the factory, Go to the DIY section and follow the clutch adjustment post, it takes 15 min. Trusts me, its ten times better.