Cylinder 4 ringland issues? - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community

feldy · 08-13-2012, 01:15 AM

So are any of you guys who have had Sti's before worried that our new motor may suffer the dreaded ringland issues? Since this car likes to be reved. I hear horror stories about subie not honoring Warrenty and blaming the consumer for hitting red line to many times.

ichitaka05 · 08-13-2012, 01:22 AM

That ringland problem is more of turbo side of Subaru. I haven't heard much on NA side... but Subaru haven't had a much high performance NA engine

Spaceywilly · 08-13-2012, 01:25 AM

That was only on the 2.5 engine, and as far as I know they would replace it every time. I heard about tons of people getting new short blocks, probably just the few people who didn't get one whine the most about it

Mr. Sociable · 08-13-2012, 01:30 AM

That, and this is a completely redesigned engine. I wouldn't worry.

industrial · 08-13-2012, 10:02 AM

Almost never heard about this issue on the ej207 which revved to 8k. I'm pretty sure the ringland issue was specific to the ej257 and US emissions.

Jayde · 08-13-2012, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ichitaka05

That ringland problem is more of turbo side of Subaru. I haven't heard much on NA side... but Subaru haven't had a much high performance NA engine

This. Like others have said, it's mostly cause of the turbo and emissions. I wouldn't worry.

DarkSunrise · 08-13-2012, 12:02 PM

Clark Tuner did a good analysis of the ej257 here. Basically he suspects a lot of the issues with detonation (and consequently cracked ringlands) on the ej257 came from it being based on the JDM 2.0L, but bored out. Basically to get it to produce 300hp on US crap gas, Subaru bored it out to 2.5L while maintaining the short stroke, causing it to be more prone to detonation than the JDM variant. Detonation is really the root cause of the cracked ringlands.

Probably more information than you wanted, but long story short, the FA20 with its square configuration (86mm x 86mm) and normally aspirated DI setup should *in theory* be less prone to detonation issues than the ej257. But only time will tell, as it's really hard to compare such different engines.

Opie · 08-13-2012, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by feldy

So are any of you guys who have had Sti's before worried that our new motor may suffer the dreaded ringland issues? Since this car likes to be reved. I hear horror stories about subie not honoring Warrenty and blaming the consumer for hitting red line to many times.

You've heard wrong...

86'd · 08-13-2012, 12:57 PM

Here's what I know about ringland failures while researching my WRX purchase:

1. They happened primarily in the '08 STIs. (The all new redesign for that year). Since then the number of reports of engines blowing in subsequent years has been reduced dramatically.

2. WRXs from the same years aren't nearly as effected.

3. Reasons for ringlands blowing are: bad tune from the factory resulting in detonation/NA emissions related, weaker cast pistons; stage 2+ abuse. Though there are generally no symptoms or signs before it does happen, making it a nasty surprise. It tends to generally happen within the first 20k.

Plus this design flaw makes the stock block just not as stout as compared to an EVO's. IF you want to sustain a lot of extra power 350-400whp+(which is a lot IMO to DD with reliably) then you'll want to buy and install stronger internals.

4. As far as warranty, I've heard of many stories of engines being covered, not being covered, covered even if modded, not covered stock...it seems like a wash. Though it'd be a safe bet to not be modded.

In the end, its not as big of a problem now as it was back in '08-'09 in the STI/WRX community, though it's still a concern in a lot of people's minds. And a lot of forums tend to suggest being careful while modding and always get a custom tune or reflash when installing things like intakes and the like.

Lastly it shouldn't have anything to do with the BRZ; like it's been stated, it's a brand new NA differently designed engine. But if you're worried about something like this happening (or any other kinds of problems), don't mod; keep receipts of your regularly scheduled maintenance and enjoy the car.

08-13-2012, 01:15 AM	#1
feldy Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Drives: 2013 FRS Asphalt Location: SF Bay Area Posts: 1,155 Thanks: 309 Thanked 335 Times in 212 Posts Mentioned: 21 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Cylinder 4 ringland issues? So are any of you guys who have had Sti's before worried that our new motor may suffer the dreaded ringland issues? Since this car likes to be reved. I hear horror stories about subie not honoring Warrenty and blaming the consumer for hitting red line to many times. __________________ 2013 Scion FR-S AT Picked up 5/30/2012

08-13-2012, 01:22 AM	#2
ichitaka05 Site Moderator Join Date: Oct 2009 Drives: ichi 86 Project Location: Middle of No where Posts: 21,048 Thanks: 7,728 Thanked 19,277 Times in 8,387 Posts Mentioned: 696 Post(s) Tagged: 28 Thread(s)	That ringland problem is more of turbo side of Subaru. I haven't heard much on NA side... but Subaru haven't had a much high performance NA engine __________________

08-13-2012, 01:25 AM	#3
Spaceywilly ZC6A2B82KC7J Join Date: May 2011 Drives: 2002 WRX Location: Providence, RI Posts: 1,632 Thanks: 361 Thanked 727 Times in 236 Posts Mentioned: 7 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	That was only on the 2.5 engine, and as far as I know they would replace it every time. I heard about tons of people getting new short blocks, probably just the few people who didn't get one whine the most about it __________________ Straights are for fast cars. Turns are for fast drivers.

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08-13-2012, 01:30 AM	#4
Mr. Sociable Hombabe Join Date: Oct 2009 Drives: 2014 BRZ Location: Colorado Posts: 75 Thanks: 2 Thanked 53 Times in 16 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	That, and this is a completely redesigned engine. I wouldn't worry.

08-13-2012, 10:02 AM	#5
industrial Add lightness! Join Date: Apr 2012 Drives: 17' WRX Location: Boston Posts: 1,253 Thanks: 380 Thanked 888 Times in 411 Posts Mentioned: 20 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Almost never heard about this issue on the ej207 which revved to 8k. I'm pretty sure the ringland issue was specific to the ej257 and US emissions.

08-13-2012, 12:02 PM	#7
DarkSunrise Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Drives: 22 BRZ (Previously 13 FR-S) Location: USA Posts: 5,797 Thanks: 2,186 Thanked 4,243 Times in 2,221 Posts Mentioned: 48 Post(s) Tagged: 2 Thread(s)	Clark Tuner did a good analysis of the ej257 here. Basically he suspects a lot of the issues with detonation (and consequently cracked ringlands) on the ej257 came from it being based on the JDM 2.0L, but bored out. Basically to get it to produce 300hp on US crap gas, Subaru bored it out to 2.5L while maintaining the short stroke, causing it to be more prone to detonation than the JDM variant. Detonation is really the root cause of the cracked ringlands. Probably more information than you wanted, but long story short, the FA20 with its square configuration (86mm x 86mm) and normally aspirated DI setup should in theory be less prone to detonation issues than the ej257. But only time will tell, as it's really hard to compare such different engines.

08-13-2012, 12:57 PM	#9
86'd Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Drives: 2012 WRX Sedan Location: Los Angeles Posts: 511 Thanks: 25 Thanked 97 Times in 55 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Here's what I know about ringland failures while researching my WRX purchase: 1. They happened primarily in the '08 STIs. (The all new redesign for that year). Since then the number of reports of engines blowing in subsequent years has been reduced dramatically. 2. WRXs from the same years aren't nearly as effected. 3. Reasons for ringlands blowing are: bad tune from the factory resulting in detonation/NA emissions related, weaker cast pistons; stage 2+ abuse. Though there are generally no symptoms or signs before it does happen, making it a nasty surprise. It tends to generally happen within the first 20k. Plus this design flaw makes the stock block just not as stout as compared to an EVO's. IF you want to sustain a lot of extra power 350-400whp+(which is a lot IMO to DD with reliably) then you'll want to buy and install stronger internals. 4. As far as warranty, I've heard of many stories of engines being covered, not being covered, covered even if modded, not covered stock...it seems like a wash. Though it'd be a safe bet to not be modded. In the end, its not as big of a problem now as it was back in '08-'09 in the STI/WRX community, though it's still a concern in a lot of people's minds. And a lot of forums tend to suggest being careful while modding and always get a custom tune or reflash when installing things like intakes and the like. Lastly it shouldn't have anything to do with the BRZ; like it's been stated, it's a brand new NA differently designed engine. But if you're worried about something like this happening (or any other kinds of problems), don't mod; keep receipts of your regularly scheduled maintenance and enjoy the car.

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