3 Way component speakers, amp and DDX916WS

[Recoil6]

Hi everyone, I hope the audio pros out there can give me a hand since I am confused.
I decided to update my sound system with a Kenwood DDX916WS and I am planing on replacing the speakers and adding an amp, I am thinking of buying 3-way components that are reasonable priced, I am leaning towards the Precision Power P65C3, if there is other suggestions please let me know.
I think the logical thing to do is to put the tweeter and mid-woofer on the dash and the woofer on the doors. Now here is where I get lost, all the speakers connect to the x-over that in turn connects to the amp, is this correct? Does this mean that the speakers take just 2 channels out of the amp?
To add more confusion the DDX916WS has 6 preouts, 2 for tweeter, 2 for mid range and 2 for woofer, does this means that I should use those channels without the x-over that comes with the speakers?
However if that is true how would I connect the back speakers and the sub woofer? Guys could you please illuminate me with your infinite wisdom? I'll appreciate all the help I can get.

[Chimera]

Originally Posted by Recoil6

Hi everyone, I hope the audio pros out there can give me a hand since I am confused.
I decided to update my sound system with a Kenwood DDX916WS and I am planing on replacing the speakers and adding an amp, I am thinking of buying 3-way components that are reasonable priced, I am leaning towards the Precision Power P65C3, if there is other suggestions please let me know.
I think the logical thing to do is to put the tweeter and mid-woofer on the dash and the woofer on the doors. Now here is where I get lost, all the speakers connect to the x-over that in turn connects to the amp, is this correct? Does this mean that the speakers take just 2 channels out of the amp?
To add more confusion the DDX916WS has 6 preouts, 2 for tweeter, 2 for mid range and 2 for woofer, does this means that I should use those channels without the x-over that comes with the speakers?
However if that is true how would I connect the back speakers and the sub woofer? Guys could you please illuminate me with your infinite wisdom? I'll appreciate all the help I can get.

That head unit has 2way and 3way built in, looking at it, it appears as if the 3 way option would be used if you wanted to do an active setup on a sub, woofer/mid, and tweeter setup. which is cool. IF you are thinking of buying a passive 3way for your front stage, AND using a sub, I would recommend using the 2 way option on the head unit. Take the sub output, and run it to your sub. Take the other output and wire it to the amp for your 3 way front stage if you have one, or from the head unit to the front stage. I am going to assume you will have an amp for the 3 way front stage if you are dropping that kinda money.


Long story short, the head unit gives you options depending on how far down the granular control rabbit hole you wish to go. using the crossover from the 3 way component set will be a passive setup, and the head unit will perceive all 3 (6 total left and right) speakers as 1 (2).


hope this helps clarify a little bit. a good followup question is what amps are you planning on using as it will help answer the number of channels you have at your disposal.


last comment: a 2way setup with the passive crossover will be easier to setup and will still sound great.

[Recoil6]

Thank you for the reply Chimera,
Yes I want to put in a new amp, I am a bit torn on how I want to do this, initially I was thinking of getting a Kicker Q Class IQ1000.5 however it is pricey. I was thinking of using 2 channels for the component 3 way speakers, 2 for the rear and 1 for the sub. With that said would I be able to designate the outs of the DDX916WS to allow for this? I am confused since the manual marks 2 channels for tweeter, 2 channels for mid and 2 channels for woofer, I am going to guess this channels are user configurable in the settings where I can change their specification? Is this the granular control you talk about?
And yet there is one more thing to consider, do I want the speakers on the rear? Or should I just let go of them and free 2 channels?
Then again I was thinking of buying a 4 channel amp, 2 for the component, 2 for the back and get a powered sub, I think that would work too and perhaps it be cheaper.
I been looking at amps and I am leaning towards a dsp+sub all in one but I am unsure how good of an idea is that.
Anyhow thank you for the help I appreciate it

[KnightRyderx2]

I looked at the manual for the head unit and did see where it said "tweeter", "mids", and "subwoofer". I was a little confused on that one too as I have never seen them marked like that. It is usually front, back, and subwoofer. If you look at page 74; that tweeter, mids, and SW is for region 3 and on the left of the page is front, rear, and SW. That is pretty much how it sounds, front pre-out for front amplifier going to front speakers, rear pre-out for the rear amplifier going to rear speakers, and SW for the subwoofer amp going to subwoofer.

Let me throw this in here, the front dash and door speakers are hooked up to the same output on the stock head unit. From the head unit it splits and one goes to the dash and the other goes to the stock amp in the trunk, then from the amp it goes to the doors. That is just a little FYI to think about.

As for your three way speaker, Im with Chimera on this one, save your money and go for a two way set up. Also when you have components you want to point the tweeters toward the person listening. High sound waves dont bounce very well and they dissipate fast, unlike bass waves. So if you put the tweeters in the dash and mids in the door, the tweeters will not be balanced with the mids and it wont sound very good. You want to put the tweeters in the door or some place that it can be pointed at you. These component setups have a crossover box with them. It takes a speaker level input, from the head unit or an amp, filters out the really low frequencies, then sends the correct frequencies to the right speakers. This way you dont get mid level from the highs and visa versa.

If you want that 5 channel, there should be a front, rear, and sub input, then the amp will split the signal up to the appropriate outputs and you just make sure you run the wire the correct speakers.

As far as amp sub/speaker setups go, there is so many scenarios that you can do. It comes down to budget, time, simplicity, your capability, and how far you want to go with it.

[Recoil6]

Thank you KnightRyderx2, you understand my confusion with the outputs, my unit is a region 3 hence the labeling "tweeter", "mids", and "subwoofer" applies on my case, however what has me confused is that (as you mention) I see the labels "rear", "Front" and "sw" in the manual and I wonder if those outs can go either way or am I stuck with the first instance.

The setup with the stock amp is really weird, I will replace it and rewire everything once I decide what kind of amp I am going to go with.

Reading from both of you guys I will get the component 3 way speakers and use the x-over that comes with them taking 2 channels out of the amp.

I like to hear from you guys about the back speakers, should I get an amp that can drive back and front plus sub? In essence 5 channels; or should I do 4 channels front and back and get a powered sub? Or go the cheaper route and do either a 4 channel amp use 2 for the front and bridge the other 2 for the sub and get rid of the back speakers? Or a 2 channel amp for the front and a powered sub? Darn there is too many options and I am unsure what is going to give me better sound.

Anyhow I thank you one more time for your input I appreciate it.

[KnightRyderx2]

No problem.

As far as the preamp outputs go, I would just hook them up as front, rear, and sw. I wouldn't worry about the tweeter, mid range thing.

I looked at the 3 ways your planning on and they look pretty good and handle quite a bit of power. Although, like I said earlier, you should put the tweeters some place else besides in the the dash. A component system is designed to break up the frequencies between the speakers, lows for the sub, mids from the mid, and highs for the tweeter. Low and mid level frequencies travel and bounce pretty well but high level frequencies do not. You want the tweeter to be pointed at you for the best sound stage possible.

I would replace the stock amp with a mini amp and hook that up the components that you plan on getting. This amp would do maybe 60 watts RMS per channel and have a RCA inputs. Its up to you if you want to get a 4 channel mini amp but they are pretty cheap and fit right where the stock amp is. You can either bridge the outputs to run only the fronts and the rears run off the deck, car is wired for this already, or you can run in 4 channel front and back, replace the rears with a set of 4 1/2 coaxles or something. Then get mono amp for a sub or look into a powered subwoofer like you were saying.

[Chimera]

The rear brackets hold 3.5" speakers. I have them, I just run mine on HU power, and even then I have mine running at -3db from the head unit speaker level adjustment. They "barely" do anything.. which is what they are supposed to do. When I turn them on and off the only real effect I notice at all is that the sound to my right sounds more complete, but doesn't shift or anything.




Note on the Power Precision speakers. I have looked at them a lot.. a lot.. still thinking about getting them.. they list the tweeter as a 1.75". The stock location is a 1". If you are looking at a stealth install (which has lots of drawbacks, off axis, firing into the windshield for example) then the power precision tweeter will not fit.


If you don't mind cutting, the worlds your oyster or so they say .


My personal setup I have strived for the stealth setup, which limits me to stuff that fits in the stock locations.

[Chimera]

On the topic of Amps, if you want to use the stock amp wiring which is convenient alpine and pioneer both make small 15A amps that will work there on speaker level inputs and put out 90W bridged. which is what I am doing. if you want a bigger amp, you will need a power line (not that big a deal tbh if you are running one for the sub anyways)

[Recoil6]

I hear what are you saying KnightRyderx2 however I do not know if those outs are going to work that way, when I go to the audio settings and look at the front speaker setup it is labeled tweeter and it shows this option…
HIGH PASS FILTER frequency (Hz)
Through/1 k/1.6k/2.5k/4k/5k/ 6.3k/8k/1 Ok/12.5k
I do not know frequencies perhaps you guys can tell me but I would think those are only high freq. hence is not passing everything through those channels and is meant just for tweeters, please correct me if I am wrong since I am hoping I am wrong. I do not see an option to pass all freq. or disable the x-over. Since it is passing only the highs I would guess I can’t use those channels for anything else but tweeters.
When I look at the rear speakers I see this …
Band PASS FILTER frequency (Hz)
Through/30/40/50/60/70/80/90/ 100/120/150/180/220/250
1k/1.6k/2.5k/4k/5k/6.3k/8k/10k/ 12.5k
And under sub I see this …
LOW PASS FILTER frequency (Hz)
Through/30/40/50/60/70/80/90/ 100/120/150/180/220/250/

I am really confused since as I mention before I would have liked to just use the front channels for the speakers x-over.
I been thinking about the tweeters, as Chimera pointed out the speakers I was looking at the tweeter is 1.75” so I think I am going to go with different ones, perhaps the Hertz Energy ESK 163L.5, those tweeters are 1”, I am undecided on what I want to do either go “stealth” like Chimera and loose some audio, by the way how much do you lose by putting the tweeter in the dash? Is it livable? Or mount them in between the door handle and the AC vent above the window controls I think it would be a good position for a small tweeter, I think a 1” tweeter would fit nicely there if possible.
Chimera, you make a great point of powering the rear speakers with the HU, that way they are not just lost, I like that idea a lot.
So depending on what I can do with the HU outputs is going to dictate what am I going to do with the amp, and that one is still up on the air, I hope there is a way to disable the x-overs in the HU.
Thank you gentleman for all your help, please keep it coming

[Recoil6]

It turns out that turning the x-over is possible, if you keep cycling through the frequencies you get to a "through" setting. That solves that problem, you can do the same for all channels

[KnightRyderx2]

Ohh i get what your saying. I was talking about that speakers themselves, not the head unit. As for the head unit, you want the setting to be "through", as you discovered, for the front and rear speakers. The subwoofer you want to set it below about 200 Hz maybe 150 Hz, just see what you like.

Your 3-way speakers will come with a crossover, tweeter, mid, and sub, 2-ways do away with the sub. The speakers are self explanatory. The crossover is a little box that has circuity to separate the frequencies and sends the right frequencies to the right speakers. You take the wire from the head unit or amp, that would normally go to your speaker, to the cross over input, then it has an output for each of the different speakers.

Low-level frequencies, subwoofer sounds, are anything below about 250 hz (subwoofers). Mid-level frequencies start about about there and go up to about 3000 hz (mids). High-level frequencies go from there on up to whatever but most people cant hear past just under 20k hz (tweeters). Beyond that you go into dog hearing.

In the stock setup, the door speakers pass every frequency not only lows and mids. The dash speakers are more of a 2 way setup, although I wouldn't even call them that. The tweeter in the dash just helps the door speaker for a more "fuller" sound in the cabin. If you were to replace all the speakers with a 2-way or 3-way setup like how you originally planned, placing the tweeters in the dash, you will barely hear any highs. Like I said earlier highs do not bounce/travel very good and they dissipate fast especially when bouncing off things, like the glass. This does not make for a good sound stage. You want the tweeters to be pointed at you. Because of this, the speaker manufacturer should include a variety of mounting options included in the box with the tweeters. This way you can go for a more stealthy look or if you dont want to make any obvious holes. Just as long as the tweeter is aim at you, you can mount them anywhere.

[Chimera]

depends a bit on your amps.
I would go with the 2way option vs the 3way option on that head unit as it gives you 18db and 24db (and 6 and 12)crossover curves, and the 3 way option only gives you 6 and 12. I pulled the manual it looks to support both. Anyways for the front channel you could use a HPF controlled from the head unit which is easier to adjust than playing with amps. let the speakers crossover handle the signal for the 3 ways speakers. I would (and did) run the rear off the head unit unless you plan on getting bigger speakers back there. for the sub, just run the sub RCAs


crossover points can be complicated, I still play with mine every few months. sometimes I change things up just b/c. They can let you boost some frequencies, and are generally used for smoothing things.


Right at this exact time I'm running a HPF @160hz -6db rolloff on my fronts, and LPF @80hz with a -18db rolloff. this has the fronts playing at -6db@80hz, and -12db@40hz. same logic applies the other direction too, so my sub plays at -18db@160hz etc etc..


Long story is theres a lot of wiggle room in that range so you can tweek the bass response to your liking, and looking at the Kenwood unit I think it has even more options than my Pioneer does.

[Recoil6]

Hi KnightRyderx2 and Chimera, I can't thank you enough for all your input.

I am going to run the components in the front from 2 channels in my amp as you suggested. I am considering making an MDF bracket that encloses the back to put a couple of 6.5" to connect to the other 2 channels of the amp. The remaining amp will be for the sub.

Since I am already going to have to tear apart the interior I am looking into sound deadener, any of you guys did it? Again thank you for the input.

[Chimera]

2nd skin audio here