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Scion FR-S / Toyota 86 GT86 General Forum The place to start for the Scion FR-S / Toyota 86 | GT86


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Old 05-24-2021, 06:07 PM   #15
ichitaka05
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Originally Posted by YamahaR86 View Post
It's a RWD car so if you haven't driven one you're in for a ride. Have to be careful in rain (I haven't driven in snow). No mashing the pedal and have to be careful on everything.
You make it sounds like we got like 900hp car that like to kill you. Driving the twin over 7yrs in the sun, rain, snow & ice and not once had dying moment. Stock engine barely make 200hp. Even push the pedal to the floor, it's not gonna go anywhere. Even the rear slide, it's not gonna snap like S2k. There's a sign with long... VERY LONG time warning you that it's slipping.

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I'm looking to get either a new 2020 86 GT, BRZ, or a 2022 GR86. I actually like the styling on the '20 86 GT the most, but based on some preliminary searching it seems if I want to get a car with the features and color I want it to have, I'm unlikely to find that specific combination sitting on a dealership lot anywhere in the US. So, probably 2022.

That said, I have some questions.

(1) I noticed that in the newbie Q/A thread it said, effectively, that you can't drive this car in snow with stock tires. This puzzles me. The car clearly has a snow mode (which I understand isn't the same as saying the car can handle snow) and it's really not all that powerful compared to a lot of other things out on the road in the snow, not on snow tires.

So what exactly does that mean? Is that meant to say you can't drive the car (as in drive it as it was meant to be driven) in the snow on stock tires or essentially that, even in snow mode, the car is effectively uncontrollable on stock tires in snow? If it matters, the car I end up with will be automatic (I need the wife to be able to drive it - hoping to get her bitten by the sports car bug) and I have more than a little RWD in snow experience. By that I mean I can keep my pickup straight on the road without sand in the back (but I still load it down after the first "real" snow.) I'd also point out that 99% of the time I will take the truck in bad weather simply because it's just way better at handling that, and at shrugging off little dents to the body panels without lamentation.

Somewhat related:

(2)I see from a lot of posts here and from the very low mileage on a lot of the used cars that many people run these as weekend/track cars and little else. I'm more the "any excuse to blast around in the fun car" driver. Most of the time I'm happy to drive slow and sane - after all, you can't see people staring at the car if you're flying by at warp speed. How safe/sane is the 86 in rain? Are there other concerns about foul-weather driving? Basically, how good is the traction control (this wasn't something I wanted to really "test" on the test drive I took.)

There are some models of cars that have design flaws that result in them rusting through rapidly if exposed to wet roads and especially if they get a little road salt on them (even the best cars deteriorate rapidly if road salt isn't removed promptly). Are there any flaws like that in these cars?

And finally:

(3)Are there any common defaults or problems I need to be aware of? As a quick example, my S10's parking brake and starter solenoid are common problems of the model. As long as I use a soft touch with the parking brake, and expect to replace the starter every few years everything is fine. (The solenoid is mounted to the starter as a complete unit, thus the heat from the starter kills the solenoid - another option is to replace the unit with a racing model that has a remote solenoid).


I test drove an 86 (non-GT) at a dealership in a different city a little bit ago and really liked it. To me it felt entirely tame and controlled in normal driving - with a definite wildness available at higher RPMs. It didn't seem like it would be too much of a handful in rain or snow (in fact this test drive was in the rain). Kansas weather can turn on a dime, so if I have to worry about getting caught in a downpour or a sudden snow flurry it greatly limits the available driving days. I haven't been 18 in more than that many years, and my lead foot has lost a lot of weight since then.
1. Simple answer. Stock tire is a summer tires. Summer tires aren't good idea to drive in the winter, especially in the snow. Tires make or break the performance of the car.

2. This is same as 1. Tires make or break the performance of the car. I've driven in the crazy hot sunny day hitting well over 130 to all the way to -15 in dry, wet, ice & snow road condition. Stock tires aren't bad. Not much grip even in the dry. Rain is same, just tiny bit slippery, but still can control it.

3. Depends on the model year. <'14MY with valve, cam plate and TOB are common issues. <'17MY front bumper sag issue (TBH all year still have an issue). Dash trim warp can be seen if you leave your car outside in the hot sun.

Tip of advice, if you're interested in picking up one, get better tires that fit your needs and better brake pads. Stock are good enough, but not great.
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Old 05-24-2021, 09:09 PM   #16
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Both times I drove in the snow on stock tires, I did not make it to where I was going. As everyone else is saying, a lot depends on your tires. For a rwd car, it's very forgiving. Long wheelbase, narrow tires, and forward weight distribution makes it pretty easy to control even beyond the limit of grip if you don't panic. Main problem in the snow is traction on hills, which may or may not be a problem for you.

Only time I lost control of the car was in the rain driving much quicker than I should have been on a twisty road (I was young, stupid, and apparently lucky that I didn't hit anything or fall into the river...). A reasonable speed on any road is no problem at all in the rain.

It seems to hold up well against rust. I found a little bit at the edges of the front subframe (which I corrected and repainted) and a little bit on some bracket in the rear wheel well, but nothing particularly concerning.

No common defects I know of for 2020 cars, or 2022, but nobody knows much about those yet.
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Old 05-25-2021, 10:51 AM   #17
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The only problems I've had on the '13 is the TOB, the window indexing, and CRAPPY lug studs that strip out if you look at them too hard.
Hopefully all of these terrible problems have been corrected by now.

Forgot about the lug studs as well. I've had to replace about 6 of mine in different wheels. It's debatable too as some users on here will say it's "user error"
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Old 05-25-2021, 11:36 AM   #18
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It's not.
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Old 05-25-2021, 11:54 AM   #19
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Forgot about the lug studs as well. I've had to replace about 6 of mine in different wheels. It's debatable too as some users on here will say it's "user error"
I swap my lug nuts to extended studs, but before that I've put on & off the wheels for Autox every Saturday for 4 year without snapping any of em. While local '13 FR-S owner still have stock one still (& do autox & track)... vs local 15 BRZ owner (who doesn't autox) snapped 8 out of 20 studs.

So it's more of hit or miss kinda thing imo
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Old 05-25-2021, 11:59 AM   #20
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I swap my lug nuts to extended studs, but before that I've put on & off the wheels for Autox every Saturday for 4 year without snapping any of em. While local '13 FR-S owner still have stock one still (& do autox & track)... vs local 15 BRZ owner (who doesn't autox) snapped 8 out of 20 studs.

So it's more of hit or miss kinda thing imo
How do you break nearly half and not just replace all of them?

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Old 05-25-2021, 12:00 PM   #21
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How do you break nearly half and not just replace all of them?

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He did. He had to get it towed to the shop to get all the studs replaced. Funny part was 2 more studs broke while getting towed lol
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Old 05-25-2021, 12:01 PM   #22
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He did. He had to get it towed to the shop to get all the studs replaced. Funny part was 2 more studs broke while getting towed lol
Oh so he broke them all at once? That's pretty crazy

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Old 05-25-2021, 12:15 PM   #23
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Oh so he broke them all at once? That's pretty crazy

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Yeah, He snapped all 5 studs on rear driver side. 2 rear passenger. 1 front passenger. Every time he snapped you can hear him scream "FUCK!" few blocks away. lol
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Old 05-25-2021, 12:18 PM   #24
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Good stuff, thanks to everyone who's thrown their 2c in.

Kansas is pretty flat, so around here snowy conditions are pretty tame. Most people who get into trouble are either those brilliant fools who think the AWD on the back of their soccer-mom crossover means they can still go 75mph on a 60mph highway despite packed snow and black ice, or the people who don't give themselves more room to stop and do a pre-stop brake test. Like if you're coming up on a stop sign, push the brakes a little to see if you have any grip, well in advance of where you're going to NEED that grip to actually stop.

I actually like driving my truck in the winter more than I do in the summer for two simple reasons. First, the heater in it will absolutely bake you to death if you crank it. Love it. Second, the truck is MUCH more maneuverable if I can "steer" with the rear tires. It's a 2.2L I4, so it's not like it has much power, but it gets good mileage and I have a 5 speed manual in it so I can put the power it has down pretty precisely.

So it sounds like the 86 would be a handful with the stock tires on it, but something I could keep in line if I'm alert. Smarter move would be some all-season tires at least for winter. But since the truck can collect dents without worry (so long as I don't bend the frame or the wheels I'm not worried) it'll still be the preferred foul-weather driver.
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Old 05-25-2021, 12:21 PM   #25
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Yeah, He snapped all 5 studs on rear driver side. 2 rear passenger. 1 front passenger. Every time he snapped you can hear him scream "FUCK!" few blocks away. lol
How TF do you snap all 5 lugs on one wheel? What was he thinking?

Two lugs can hold a wheel well enough limp it onto a flatbed or (if you're very daring) to a shop.

So at the point you snap 4 lugs on one wheel why would you even try the fifth? What would be the goal of that? I wouldn't even put the weight of the car on a wheel held by only one bolt.
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Old 05-25-2021, 12:34 PM   #26
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How TF do you snap all 5 lugs on one wheel? What was he thinking?

Two lugs can hold a wheel well enough limp it onto a flatbed or (if you're very daring) to a shop.

So at the point you snap 4 lugs on one wheel why would you even try the fifth? What would be the goal of that? I wouldn't even put the weight of the car on a wheel held by only one bolt.
When he snapped 3rd one, he stopped and went to other side (rear passenger). When he snapped 1 of em, rest of the rear driver side 2 studs snapped.

Lets just say he wasn't happy at the end bill
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Old 05-25-2021, 12:35 PM   #27
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How TF do you snap all 5 lugs on one wheel? What was he thinking?



Two lugs can hold a wheel well enough limp it onto a flatbed or (if you're very daring) to a shop.



So at the point you snap 4 lugs on one wheel why would you even try the fifth? What would be the goal of that? I wouldn't even put the weight of the car on a wheel held by only one bolt.
Yeah that sounds a bit irresponsible. I might do it but only because I know I'd be replacing the studs myself, so it wouldn't matter. I've already done my fronts with the help of a tool from harbor freight that was intended for some other purpose but works great. 20$well spent

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Old 05-25-2021, 12:38 PM   #28
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So it sounds like the 86 would be a handful with the stock tires on it, but something I could keep in line if I'm alert.
For what it's worth, I think you are misreading that. I would not say you are going to keep it in line with anything less than all-seasons.
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