Frs vs s2000

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by juliog

I've spent many, many evenings pondering this.

[DylanFRS]

Originally Posted by Andrew025

What if we made them both exactly the same?

Yeah! So we give them the same engine, same suspension, same chassis, same gearing, and a rear wing? Then which one @CSG Mike? I bet the BRZ will be faster because everyone knows that Subaru badges are faster on any given track than Honda badges.

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by juliog

If Honda took the F22C, gave it direct injection (assume that would allow it to meet modern-day emissions and fuel economy, and possibly hit 270 hp), and placed it into an S2000 coupe, that would be very close to my ideal car.

Double-wishbones all around, 50/50 weight distribution, 270 NA hp, 2800 lbs, RWD, and no need for a roll bar for the track.

I wouldn't hesitate to pay ~$35k for it if Honda could price it that low. Unfortunately I don't think modern-day Honda has the stones to bring a product like that to the market.

[iLuveKetchup]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

If Honda took the F22C, gave it direct injection (assume that would allow it to meet modern-day emissions and fuel economy, and possibly hit 270 hp), and placed it into an S2000 coupe, that would be very close to my ideal car.

Double-wishbones all around, 50/50 weight distribution, 270 NA hp, 2800 lbs, RWD, and no need for a roll bar for the track.

I wouldn't hesitate to pay ~$35k for it if Honda could price it that low. Unfortunately I don't think modern-day Honda has the stones to bring a product like that to the market.

I agree with this. And if the s2k came out in as a coupe in '00, its weight would be lower than 2800lbs. The s2k only weighs that much because of the extra chassis rigidity from being a convertible. Which is crazy how the little BRZ weighs as much as it does.

It makes me miss my track s2k -- sitting at 2550lbs @ ~260hp.

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by iLuveKetchup

I agree with this. And if the s2k came out in as a coupe in '00, its weight would be lower than 2800lbs. The s2k only weighs that much because of the extra chassis rigidity from being a convertible. Which is crazy how the little BRZ weighs as much as it does.

It makes me miss my track s2k -- sitting at 2550lbs @ ~260hp.

Yeah bloated weights are endemic to the auto industry as a whole. Every car seems to be getting heavier. If you look up the weight on BMW's new 2-series, it might shock you. Probably has to do with increasing emphasis on safety regs.

Why did you sell that track s2k? Looks like a ton of fun.

[evomike]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

I've spent many, many evenings pondering this.

a k series makes much more sense i have pondered it a time or two

[iLuveKetchup]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

Yeah bloated weights are endemic to the auto industry as a whole. Every car seems to be getting heavier. If you look up the weight on BMW's new 2-series, it might shock you. Probably has to do with increasing emphasis on safety regs.

Why did you sell that track s2k? Looks like a ton of fun.

Yea I totally agree with all cars gaining massive weight & size. The new M3/4 are bigger than ever.

I sold it to have money set aside, so I can just walk out of my job at anytime they give me $h!t. Plus I'm not the smartest, I'm stupid for selling her.

[CSG Mike]

http://www.roadandtrack.com/boot/egi...?src=soc_fcbks

[Sideways&Smiling]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

If Honda took the F22C, gave it direct injection (assume that would allow it to meet modern-day emissions and fuel economy, and possibly hit 270 hp), and placed it into an S2000 coupe, that would be very close to my ideal car.

Double-wishbones all around, 50/50 weight distribution, 270 NA hp, 2800 lbs, RWD, and no need for a roll bar for the track.

I wouldn't hesitate to pay ~$35k for it if Honda could price it that low. Unfortunately I don't think modern-day Honda has the stones to bring a product like that to the market.

I think a 1 or 1.5 liter version of the new S660 concept (S1000? S1500?) is the best we're going to get. But I think I'm ok with that if the rumors are true and it ends up weighing 2000 pounds, is mid-engined, and comes from the factory with a turbo. There is a LOT of potential there. I'll miss the old H pattern manual, but I think I could ignore that issue if everything else was great.

[AsianStyle]

Originally Posted by iLuveKetchup

The s2k also doesn't suffer from ice mode braking (atleast not as often). The s2ks trump card is its reliability, especially from its engine.

Yes, the thing that really bothers me the most about this car is the engine issues and that dumb torque dip. Only if they used a more robust engine with better tuning.

[chrisl]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

The S2000 still will have more mechanical torque. Are we equalizing gearing too?

If you increased the BRZ's horsepower to match the s2k by increasing its torque across the rev range (and keeping the redline the same), the BRZ would make about the same wheel torque as the s2k. If you increased its power by making the engine rev higher and make power at 8k+rpm, but didn't redo the gearing, you would be wasting the potential of the new powerband.

[emutcfut]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

You forgot front downforce, double wishbone suspension, better weight distribution.

Mike, just curious, are you referring to the base s2000 or an s2000 with the CR lip with regards to front downforce?

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by emutcfut

Mike, just curious, are you referring to the base s2000 or an s2000 with the CR lip with regards to front downforce?

All S2000 make downforce in the front.

Note that from a MPG perspective, there is ZERO incentive for any manufacturer to go past zero lift. Most entry level lux cars and eco cars have zero lift as their design goals.

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by Superstar

Same power, same tires, I think the FRS/BRZ would overall be the faster vehicle. Didn't your past reviews validate this?

Compare stock to stock, except without stock tires and brake pads.

Once you modify the FRS to be at the same power you have to give the S2K owner money to fix it's weaknesses. It becomes a pointless arguement.