Fr-s or 370z?

[driftguy]

Originally Posted by dem00n

Chris Harris has been wrong many times and he even admits it himself. He doesn't have a conventional way at looking at a car, which is why his choices mostly don't fit the majority.

Don't worship him, he's just another guy with an opinion.

His job is to literally drive cars from all over the world and review them, and you're saying he's just another guy with an opinion? Lmfao! No worship here but give the man some credit where it's due.

[extrashaky]

Originally Posted by driftguy

His job is to literally drive cars from all over the world and review them, and you're saying he's just another guy with an opinion? Lmfao! No worship here but give the man some credit where it's due.

I'm not sure you even have to listen to him in that video on the first page. Just watch it with the sound off and notice how differently the two cars handle the turns. Even when the 86 kicks its tail out, you can see that it's more stable than the 370z.

[dem00n]

Originally Posted by driftguy

His job is to literally drive cars from all over the world and review them, and you're saying he's just another guy with an opinion? Lmfao! No worship here but give the man some credit where it's due.

I do give him credit, he makes fantastic videos and has fabulous vocabulary.

But just as him and any other automotive journalists, they are just opinions. Music critics in another form.

[Sideways&Smiling]

The 370z has issues with oil starvation, brakes, and weight. Some problems can be addressed with $$$, but the weight isn't going away. There are also subjective issues like how it feels to shift.

Cars like the S2000 and GT86 are, perhaps, on a lower rung of performance right out of the box (at least, not as fast in a straight line), but they have much more overall potential if you're willing to put $$$ into them. They are already much lighter and better in the corners. Give them more power and they become something truly special, but the beauty of them is they are also fun as-is. So, you start with something that looks good, handles very well, and is very fun to drive even with a lack of power, and, if you WANT to, you can turn it into a track monster that Zs will not be able to hang with due to their inherent problems.

That's really all it comes down to. If you want the extra power, don't mind the weight, and aren't planning to mod or track the car, the 370z is fine, but if you have bigger plans, why not start with a less compromised chassis?

The one thing the Z seems to do well in is drifting (with a lot of mods and usually an engine swap if going for big power)... because it handles pretty well and weight isn't as big of a deal in American drifting when everybody is pushing 700-1200hp............. but then, you could just as easily start with an FR-S/BRZ or even a cheap 240sx and build something just as good, if not better...

[litemup]

Originally Posted by TJ3000

You take the good you take the bad you take them both and there you have, The Mc GangBang (S2000)

Well, now I'm just hungry again.

[Jegan_V]

Originally Posted by Cliu91

Maybe it's way different in Canada.
In Canada:
FRS/BRZ = $26k~
370z = $38~

Pretty big difference if you ask me... this is all based on the base model.

Yep, in Canada the 370Z is extremely overpriced. Its actually cheaper to buy a base G37 or now a Q50(I think...Infiniti's new nomenclature is confusing) where you're getting that engine, platform, in a more practical body and far more luxury features for less. The Z since the 350 to today's 370 has been a dismal seller in Canada primarily due to its price. I understand the Z got a price cut in the US, this didn't happen up here. I have a feeling Nissan Canada has given up on the Z and it does show as you can pick all the affordable mainstream sports cars and either match the base Z with their top trim or in the case of the Mustang GT, twins and Genesis coupe come out cheaper.

[totopo]

Originally Posted by Sideways&Smiling

The 370z has issues with oil starvation, brakes, and weight. Some problems can be addressed with $$$, but the weight isn't going away. There are also subjective issues like how it feels to shift.

Cars like the S2000 and GT86 are, perhaps, on a lower rung of performance right out of the box (at least, not as fast in a straight line), but they have much more overall potential if you're willing to put $$$ into them. They are already much lighter and better in the corners. Give them more power and they become something truly special, but the beauty of them is they are also fun as-is. So, you start with something that looks good, handles very well, and is very fun to drive even with a lack of power, and, if you WANT to, you can turn it into a track monster that Zs will not be able to hang with due to their inherent problems.

That's really all it comes down to. If you want the extra power, don't mind the weight, and aren't planning to mod or track the car, the 370z is fine, but if you have bigger plans, why not start with a less compromised chassis?

The one thing the Z seems to do well in is drifting (with a lot of mods and usually an engine swap if going for big power)... because it handles pretty well and weight isn't as big of a deal in American drifting when everybody is pushing 700-1200hp............. but then, you could just as easily start with an FR-S/BRZ or even a cheap 240sx and build something just as good, if not better...

So this seems to be the prevailing opinion I am trying to convince people is not quite correct. Weight isn't the only factor, even in handling. Or else everyone should just get miatas and tune them and they should dominate NASA tt e-ttu. That is obviously not the case. With equal tires, the stock z and the Frs probably have similar cornering speeds. If anything the z might beat it.

The Frs is more in the miata class rather than the s2k class. Just hp doesn't show the full performance of an engine. 220ft.lbs torque for the s2k compared to 150 for the brz is quite a significant difference .

When you start talking about tuning, why cant you tube the z as well? It's silly to compare tuned cars to stock cars. With all the money and warantee issues, what if you sank that same money into a z?

[TheAsianRacer]

Originally Posted by totopo

So this seems to be the prevailing opinion I am trying to convince people is not quite correct. Weight isn't the only factor, even in handling. Or else everyone should just get miatas and tune them and they should dominate NASA tt e-ttu. That is obviously not the case. With equal tires, the stock z and the Frs probably have similar cornering speeds. If anything the z might beat it.

The Frs is more in the miata class rather than the s2k class. Just hp doesn't show the full performance of an engine. 160ft.lbs torque for the s2k compared to 150 for the brz is quite a significant difference .

When you start talking about tuning, why cant you tube the z as well? It's silly to compare tuned cars to stock cars. With all the money and warantee issues, what if you sank that same money into a z?

corrected, but that torque dip we have is sort of similar to AP1 S2000 when VTEC kicks in. The good news for us though is that we can just get a different header and that torque dip will be eliminated.

The choice will really depend on what your needs of a sports car is. If you want a car with some umph to it when you accelerate, the FRS really doesn't quite cut it but if you want something practical and similar to a Miata in handling, the FRS is definitely the better choice even though these "back seats" are quite useless for humans larger than 5ft tall.

[totopo]

Originally Posted by TheAsianRacer

corrected, but that torque dip we have is sort of similar to AP1 S2000 when VTEC kicks in. The good news for us though is that we can just get a different header and that torque dip will be eliminated.

The choice will really depend on what your needs of a sports car is. If you want a car with some umph to it when you accelerate, the FRS really doesn't quite cut it but if you want something practical and similar to a Miata in handling, the FRS is definitely the better choice even though these "back seats" are quite useless for humans larger than 5ft tall.

Crap, sorry, my bad. I stand corrected

[Sideways&Smiling]

Originally Posted by totopo

So this seems to be the prevailing opinion I am trying to convince people is not quite correct. Weight isn't the only factor, even in handling. Or else everyone should just get miatas and tune them and they should dominate NASA tt e-ttu. That is obviously not the case. With equal tires, the stock z and the Frs probably have similar cornering speeds. If anything the z might beat it.

The Frs is more in the miata class rather than the s2k class. Just hp doesn't show the full performance of an engine. 220ft.lbs torque for the s2k compared to 150 for the brz is quite a significant difference .

When you start talking about tuning, why cant you tube the z as well? It's silly to compare tuned cars to stock cars. With all the money and warantee issues, what if you sank that same money into a z?

That's kinda the point I was making though. The Z doesn't have as high potential. It will always be compromised. If you took care of the oil starvation and braking problems, it may be reliable on track, but it would still never be as nimble or light. Power can always be added. The S2000 especially does well with forced induction, more so than the other 2.

My opinion will always be biased towards the types of cars that do well in time attack though. I like Silvias, RX7s, S2000s, the GT86, etc.... and RWD, obviously, as Evos seem to dominate everything entirely most of the time. haha. What can I say? I like the underdogs.... but these underdogs are the ones out there setting records, and yeah, they are heavily modified, but they were chosen as base platforms for good reason. Weight and cornering ability.

There are a lot of NSXs out there killing it too... but that's neither here nor there, considering the cost and the inherent advantages of a mid-engine car.

[totopo]

Originally Posted by Sideways&Smiling

That's kinda the point I was making though. The Z doesn't have as high potential. It will always be compromised. If you took care of the oil starvation and braking problems, it may be reliable on track, but it would still never be as nimble or light. Power can always be added. The S2000 especially does well with forced induction, more so than the other 2.

My opinion will always be biased towards the types of cars that do well in time attack though. I like Silvias, RX7s, S2000s, the GT86, etc.... and RWD, obviously, as Evos seem to dominate everything entirely most of the time. haha. What can I say? I like the underdogs.... but these underdogs are the ones out there setting records, and yeah, they are heavily modified, but they were chosen as base platforms for good reason. Weight and cornering ability.

There are a lot of NSXs out there killing it too... but that's neither here nor there, considering the cost and the inherent advantages of a mid-engine car.

Haha, speaking about tuned cars is a slippery slope. So you say the frs could be faster with a turbo and like 300hp. Well, a turbo 370z putting out 600hp would be even faster!! Tuned cars is mostly just about budget and rules. What rules are you talking about? what budget are you talking about?

Personally, since I need a daily driver, I don't need the hassle of touching the engine. Maybe you like pouring 10s and 10s of thousands into a project car and have a different daily driver, all the more power to you! I love seeing those cars, but I am not able to spend that kind of money or time now. For the fr-s, at what point would it have been more worth it to save the money and buy a porsche cayman s?

Buying a car for the potential if you pour 100k into it is silly unless you are going to pour the 100k into it. Which at that point you might as well just have bought a porsche gt3 rs.

The world time attack cars are ridiculous. Again, unless you are prepared to fabricate all new suspension parts, calculate new suspension geometry, and have access to an aero designer and fabricator, buying a daily driver based on what people do to it is kind of silly. I mean, it's kind of like buying a scion tc because of chris rado's time attack tc.

[RockRoll]

Go with the FRS. It is lighter and less money. And more fun factor.

[Sideways&Smiling]

Originally Posted by totopo

Haha, speaking about tuned cars is a slippery slope. So you say the frs could be faster with a turbo and like 300hp. Well, a turbo 370z putting out 600hp would be even faster!! Tuned cars is mostly just about budget and rules. What rules are you talking about? what budget are you talking about?

Personally, since I need a daily driver, I don't need the hassle of touching the engine. Maybe you like pouring 10s and 10s of thousands into a project car and have a different daily driver, all the more power to you! I love seeing those cars, but I am not able to spend that kind of money or time now. For the fr-s, at what point would it have been more worth it to save the money and buy a porsche cayman s?

Buying a car for the potential if you pour 100k into it is silly unless you are going to pour the 100k into it. Which at that point you might as well just have bought a porsche gt3 rs.

The world time attack cars are ridiculous. Again, unless you are prepared to fabricate all new suspension parts, calculate new suspension geometry, and have access to an aero designer and fabricator, buying a daily driver based on what people do to it is kind of silly. I mean, it's kind of like buying a scion tc because of chris rado's time attack tc.

I did say the 370z would be fine as a daily driver if you didn't mind the weight and wanted the power. Some people are different. Modding IS the fun for some people. Some are happy with a kinda-fun sporty car that they'll leave as-is to avoid hassle. Some prefer a more affordable car with excellent handling traits that they can build on. Some want the best thing they can afford to dominate in tight auto cross courses with.

Yeah, some of it is ridiculous with insanely expensive carbon shells and relocated suspension pickup points, I know, but some retain key characteristics of the cars, and they are chosen for specific reasons.

The Z just isn't particularly impressive. It's pretty good all around, but doesn't stand out in any particular way. Some see it as a safe bet for something that performs pretty competently. Others see it as unexciting.

[extrashaky]

Originally Posted by Sideways&Smiling

Others see it as unexciting.

Until they bling it out with gold rims and the "I C U Lookin'" script across the top of the windshield.