Is the BRZ/FR-S/86 a sports car?

[TylerLieberman]

Originally Posted by soulreapersteve

Yeah.... ~375 dollars for an STI. How these fellas around my age can afford it without having a decently paying job is beyond me! Probably go without no insurance, just like a lot of the Honda guys around here.

About $200 a month for my '16 STI and my wife's '13 Focus ST.

I'm 23, she's 24. Clean record on both.

[DAEMANO]

The definition I've most commonly read is:

A lightweight car designed so that with minimal modification can be used for motorsports.

Thus sports car.

There are sub-categories of sports car, like GT (Gran Touring/Turismo, Muscle car, etc). Being a roadster definitely does not make a car more of a sports car, in fact, due to safety regulations at tracks and with sanctioning bodies, it can make a car less so.

Arguments like...

A. "it doesn't do _______ as well as an S2K stock" are typically tossed out by Honda invested businesses (like Spoon) and nostalgic fanbois but logically fail because:

1. A typically designated sports car like the Miata also doesn't perform out of the box like an S2K but is still considered a sports car. This is mostly because....

2. ... if sold today, S2Ks adjusted for inflation would cost over $40,000. A hypothetical $40k FR-S or Miata would certainly include motorsports ready parts like forged internals, and in the case of an 86, a more adjustable alignment from the factory. These are the two most commonly identified issues Honda guys mention about the 86 (which starts at $26k).

B. "It's not ready for racing right out of the box like a Miata"
This argument also falls apart. A Miata was also designed to require minimal modification to be used in motorsports. A $26K 2016 ND Miata does not include a lot of hardware needed to be motorsports ready (e.g. a limited slip diff, a roll bar, a fixed roof, who knows about the engine, oiling, etc). Some modifications have to be made (either by the factory (Club edition) or the aftermarket).

An 86 was designed to with minimal modification be used in motorsports.

The 86 is definitely a sports car.

[hmong337]

Is this even a debate? Who the hell said no? Lol.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by bcj

Right and wrong don't apply.
I only said I disagreed with that single aspect.
If you can't believe a difference in opinion is possible in (any|this) universe, you may become despondant eventually.

Sorry, been spending time in rougher forums.

Strictly speaking, I don't think it's a sports car.
Broadly speaking it's more a sports car than anything available today except the Miata.

[SUB-FT86]

If any of you guys think the car is a GT then you guys are smoking something. GT's are typically much heavier and bigger cars in comparison. A tiny backseat doesn't make the 86 a GT. The 86 represents the modern take on old sports cars with small engines, lightweight, low CoG, and some of which had tiny backseats also.


A sports car (sportscar) is a small, usually two seater, two door automobile designed for spirited performance and nimble handling.[2][3] According to the Merriam-Webster dictionary, the first known use of the term was in 1928.[2]
Sports cars may be spartan or luxurious, but high maneuverability and minimum weight are requisite.[4] They may be equipped for racing, "especially an aerodynamically shaped one-passenger or two-passenger vehicle having a low center of gravity and steering and suspension designed for precise control at high speeds."[5]




Some sports cars have small back seats that are really only suitable for luggage or small children. Such a configuration is often referred to as a 2+2 (two full seats + two "occasional" seats). The more typical seating arrangement is two-seats.




The drive train and engine layout significantly influences the handling characteristics of an automobile, and is crucially important in the design of a sports car.
The front-engine, rear-wheel-drive layout (FR) is common to sports cars of any era and has survived longer in sports cars than in mainstream automobiles.


Everything in bold is the 86.

[Vracer111]

It's as much a sports car as a miata is... actually it's a better one than a miata - its the one with a better chassis and suspension out the box.

[DarkSunrise]

It's all relative. Compared to a bare-bones 1600 lbs. MG Midget or 1200 lbs. Caterham from the 1960's and 70's, I could see why someone would consider a modern 2750 lbs., 2+2 coupe like the FR-S/BRZ to be a GT car. Especially when it comes with frivolities like bluetooth, climate control, heated seats, 6 airbags, etc.

But in the realm of modern-day production cars, it's definitely on the lighter/minimalist side of the spectrum. I'd consider it a sports car today, along with pretty much any sub-3000 lbs. RWD coupe/roadster made in the past 15 years.

[Teseo]

For me "sport car" most be a:
Low profile (like nsx or vette)
RWD
Fun to drive without wrecking

[hmong337]

The frs/brz IS a sports car at its more basic form. I also class the Miata along side this car too. The new Civic type R is a sporty car. Its roots come from economy fwd slushboxes. The frs and miata where concieved with racing on a track in mind. The Civic Type R, Focus St, Mazdaspeed3 were all after thoughts. They were designed around hauling people first, sport second. Frs/brz were built around haulling your race gear to the track!

[Njnickd]

Originally Posted by hmong337

The frs/brz IS a sports car at its more basic form. I also class the Miata along side this car too. The new Civic type R is a sporty car. Its roots come from economy fwd slushboxes. The frs and miata where concieved with racing on a track in mind. The Civic Type R, Focus St, Mazdaspeed3 were all after thoughts. They were designed around hauling people first, sport second. Frs/brz were built around haulling your race gear to the track!

This is actually a good point. The gt86 was built to be driven like a sports car out the gate. The type R, ST, Speed3 are much more of "sporty trims or versions" of eco people haulers. I'm fairly certain that the FA20 was designed to be a performance engine first. Otherwise we'd all be redlining FB20s lol.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Teclis]

The 86 is on the list of sports car https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sports_cars

[Rampage]

I have my own definition of a sportscar.

A sportscar is a vehicle that is designed, purpose built and knowingly sacrifices utility to provide maximum driving enjoyment for the driver and a passenger.

Examples:
Miata
FR-S/BRZ
911
Corvette
Cayman
Elise
s2000
370Z
Z4
R8
ETC. ETC.

A sporty car is a car that was designed first as a passenger car and then enhanced with features that increase the driver's driving enjoyment.

Examples:
Mustang
Camaro
WRX/STi
EVO
Focus ST
VW GTI
GTR
M3
RC-F
ETC. ETC.

It works for me.

[SUB-FT86]

Originally Posted by Rampage

I have my own definition of a sportscar.

A sportscar is a vehicle that is designed, purpose built and knowingly sacrifices utility to provide maximum driving enjoyment for the driver and a passenger.

Examples:
Miata
FR-S/BRZ
911
Corvette
Cayman
Elise
s2000
370Z
Z4
R8
ETC. ETC.

A sporty car is a car that was designed first as a passenger car and then enhanced with features that increase the driver's driving enjoyment.

Examples:
Mustang
Camaro
WRX/STi
EVO
Focus ST
VW GTI
GTR
M3
RC-F
ETC. ETC.

It works for me.

I can not disagree with you one bit!!

[SUB-FT86]

Haven't you guys also realized that sports cars tend to have smaller, higher revving type engines that don't necessarily make huge torque?

Like the 458 Italia for instance. It has a 4.5 liter which is a smaller V8 than a LSX,Hemi or 5.0 Mustang yet because it is a much more cleverly engineered vehicle it didn't need a bigger size engine to be competitive with even something like a Hellcat(Fattcat). I respect clever engineering over the " Put a big engine in and call it a day" mentality. That's why I've always been sports car bias and can't stand muscle cars for lots of reasons.