Autocar: BRZ vs. MX-5 vs. 370Z - Page 3 - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community

Draco-REX · 04-07-2012, 12:48 PM

I'm not so sure. Hopefully a reviewer will dredge up a stock S2K to put against the BRZ. I think they'll be very close.

SUB-FT86 · 04-07-2012, 01:00 PM

What makes you think it'll be close? So far Zdan is 100% correct.

ichitaka05 · 04-07-2012, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZDan

I don't know what the S2000 c.g. height is, but I doubt it's much (if any) higher.

S2k's CoG is estimated around 18.8~19.8. FRS/BRZ claims 460mm (18.1"?), so about inch or 2 higher for S2k.

blu_ · 04-07-2012, 01:11 PM

No clue which would be faster. You can't really compare them stock for stock. The ap1 has even worse stock tires and is heavier.

NESW20 · 04-07-2012, 01:13 PM

i'm very interested to see how it compares to my MR2...

WingsofWar · 04-07-2012, 01:14 PM

with some considerable seat time in the AP1 S2k i wouldn't dare talk about performance vs performance factor against the Zx6. The AP1 has considerable advantage on a cumulative scale.

Despite that, the BRZ still has something unique to its character that makes me overall always choose the Zx6 over purchasing a s2000. They explain it pretty well in that article above, even if they omit more reasonable technical jargon.

While I have yet to drive the current MX-5 and BRZ and i have only a few hours of real seat time in a Z34 370z. I can pretty much gauge what kind of driving experience ill have with the BRZ, and its looking very positive.

SUB-FT86 · 04-07-2012, 01:14 PM

The ap2 is heavier at 2800+ lbs. The ap1 is 2750 lbs.

blu_ · 04-07-2012, 01:17 PM

You sure? I thought both were over 2800.

ichitaka05 · 04-07-2012, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blu_

You sure? I thought both were over 2800.

Yes, you're correct both AP1 & AP2 is over 2800 lbs

ZDan · 04-07-2012, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ichitaka05

S2k's CoG is estimated around 18.8~19.8.

*Estimated*

Quote:

FRS/BRZ claims 460mm (18.1"?),

*Claims*

Quote:

so about inch or 2 higher for S2k.

Not necessarily...

In any case, with a driver and fuel the FR-S/BRZ is going to be carrying 8% more weight on the fronts than the rears, whereas the S2000 will actually have ~2% more weight on the rears than fronts.

Even if the FR-S/BRZ c.g. is 1"-2" lower, I bet it is putting more load on the outside front while cornering (of course spring and sway bar rates play heavily in this).

ZDan · 04-07-2012, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ichitaka05

Yes, you're correct both AP1 & AP2 is over 2800 lbs

My '01 is bone stock except for a 40 lb. roll bar. Weighed in at 2780 lb. at the track with ~1/8 tank of fuel (~10 lb.).

Pretty sure the early AP1s are closer to 2750 lb. and the AP2+ are ~2850 lb.

blu_ · 04-07-2012, 01:26 PM

Subaru is known for saving weight, mainly because there drivetrain is so heavy because of awd. The body panels are so thin on my car the hood quivers on the highway.

ichitaka05 · 04-07-2012, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZDan

*Estimated*

Unless you can prove it wrong, my statement to be true

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZDan

*Claims*

Yes, which they have posted/stated several official papers, so I'll take that as official #.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZDan

Not necessarily...

In any case, with a driver and fuel the FR-S/BRZ is going to be carrying 8% more weight on the fronts than the rears, whereas the S2000 will actually have ~2% more weight on the rears than fronts.

Even if the FR-S/BRZ c.g. is 1"-2" lower, I bet it is putting more load on the outside front while cornering (of course spring and sway bar rates play heavily in this).

I'll wait for your proof... til then it's your estimation

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZDan

My '01 is bone stock except for a 40 lb. roll bar. Weighed in at 2780 lb. at the track with ~1/8 tank of fuel (~10 lb.).

Pretty sure the early AP1s are closer to 2750 lb. and the AP2+ are ~2850 lb.

*pretty sure* isn't a proof. Also show your S2k's curb weight doesn't mean anything. Dry weight, +-2700lbs for S2k is understandable

blu_ · 04-07-2012, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZDan

My '01 is bone stock except for a 40 lb. roll bar. Weighed in at 2780 lb. at the track with ~1/8 tank of fuel (~10 lb.).

Pretty sure the early AP1s are closer to 2750 lb. and the AP2+ are ~2850 lb.

Curb weight includes a full tank of gas. Which weights 8lbs per gallon.

04-07-2012, 01:13 PM	#33
NESW20 2.1L 3SGTE Join Date: Oct 2009 Drives: MR2 Turbo & Tacoma Location: Columbus, IN Posts: 1,248 Thanks: 29 Thanked 24 Times in 22 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	i'm very interested to see how it compares to my MR2... __________________ 1991 MR2 Turbo - 2.1L high compression stroker 3SGTE 2006 Tacoma 4x4 TRD Off Road - All-Pro front bumper, Old Man Emu shocks, Old Man Emu HD front coils, All-Pro leafs 1990 240SX Coupe - sold 2008 Civic Si Sedan

04-07-2012, 01:14 PM	#34
WingsofWar MODERATOR-SAMA Join Date: Oct 2009 Drives: Swagtron Scooter Location: Seattle Posts: 2,685 Thanks: 345 Thanked 1,562 Times in 524 Posts Mentioned: 81 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	with some considerable seat time in the AP1 S2k i wouldn't dare talk about performance vs performance factor against the Zx6. The AP1 has considerable advantage on a cumulative scale. Despite that, the BRZ still has something unique to its character that makes me overall always choose the Zx6 over purchasing a s2000. They explain it pretty well in that article above, even if they omit more reasonable technical jargon. While I have yet to drive the current MX-5 and BRZ and i have only a few hours of real seat time in a Z34 370z. I can pretty much gauge what kind of driving experience ill have with the BRZ, and its looking very positive. __________________

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04-07-2012, 12:48 PM	#29
Draco-REX Corner Junkie Join Date: Feb 2012 Drives: 13 BRZ, 11 STI, 99 RS Location: Ohio Posts: 2,908 Thanks: 129 Thanked 1,521 Times in 702 Posts Mentioned: 11 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	I'm not so sure. Hopefully a reviewer will dredge up a stock S2K to put against the BRZ. I think they'll be very close.

04-07-2012, 01:00 PM	#30
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04-07-2012, 01:11 PM	#32
blu_ Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Drives: SWP BRZ LTD Location: Portland, OR Posts: 889 Thanks: 637 Thanked 170 Times in 106 Posts Mentioned: 5 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	No clue which would be faster. You can't really compare them stock for stock. The ap1 has even worse stock tires and is heavier.

04-07-2012, 01:17 PM	#36
blu_ Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Drives: SWP BRZ LTD Location: Portland, OR Posts: 889 Thanks: 637 Thanked 170 Times in 106 Posts Mentioned: 5 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	You sure? I thought both were over 2800.

04-07-2012, 01:26 PM	#40
blu_ Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Drives: SWP BRZ LTD Location: Portland, OR Posts: 889 Thanks: 637 Thanked 170 Times in 106 Posts Mentioned: 5 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Subaru is known for saving weight, mainly because there drivetrain is so heavy because of awd. The body panels are so thin on my car the hood quivers on the highway.

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