Pure Pricing?

[xdbuix]

Like another poster said, Penfed the way to go. I got 1.5% after I donated $15 to an organization to be eligible. Then paid like $5 for the check to be fast shipped to me. Awesome experience.

[Timmy_Jones]

Originally Posted by Griff

Im picking mine up Friday. Just bought a Raven A/T. Got mine for less than MSRP including fees and such. But maybe thats cause they dont sell much up here in NH?

I was in the same boat as you with credit, only about a years worth. A local credit union gave me 2.6 something %. Check with the smaller places as well as the big banks

Where in NH did you buy from? Portsmouth Scion?

[xravexboix]

Originally Posted by Enraged21

I'm going to the dealership tomorrow to possibly pick up a brand new FRS. Only if it's within my price range.

I know with Scion Pure Pricing pretty much MSRP is not negotiable. Sticker price is sticker price and that is what you pay. However, where any of you able to negotiate any other factor of the deal? Such as the interest rate, DOC fee, etc?

I've only had credit since the beginning of the year so I don't have much history. I am bringing a co signer just in case they won't approve me by myself. If I can get a good interest rate, then I'll most likely be driving a new FRS

Working at the World's Largest Scion dealer... here are the facts and possible "workarounds":

Pure Pricing = Advertised Price is what you pay. You are correct: no negotiation. You will, however, possibly see a rare discount on one toward the end of the model year when the old year has been collecting dust and the new year is coming in. IE We currently are offering the iQ 2012 @ $1,000. less than the standard MSRP. We just have to be consistent about all 2012 iQ being priced the same way.

Accessories = This is also another part of the Pure Pricing method that alleviates negotiation. Most of the accessory prices actually aren't too bad, but it gets sticky when dealers add aftermarket pieces and put whatever MSRP they want on it. MOST dealers should have the accessory price match whatever is on Scion.com, however, they can modify it as they see fit too as long as they advertise their pricing on that product clearly.

Interest Rate = Again, with Pure Pricing, whatever the posted rates are (based on your credit "Zone/Tier") are not negotiable. This is the only one that sort of has a workaround. If you do finance with an outside bank, you can, of course, get a lower rate. Some dealerships may even offer other banks to finance the loan for you as well, but will have to adhere to posting their available rates based on qualification. Credit Unions are typically the best route to go for low rates, but sometimes even they can be beat by the Toyota Financial rate. It just depends on your location and if your dealer's first choice of bank is TFS.

So Pure Pricing basically aims to churn out consistent experiences to everyone. The promise of Pure Pricing just eliminates the typical game with haggling and bait/switch tactics.

Hopefully that clears up some stuff

[Porsche]

Originally Posted by xravexboix

Pure Pricing = Advertised Price is what you pay. You are correct: no negotiation.

WHOSE "advertised price?"

Toyota's official MSRP?

If so, how does one account for the numerous, apparently, California dealers selling the FR-S with a substantial additional dealer markup (ADM), often $2k-$3k over MSRP?

[xravexboix]

Originally Posted by Porsche

WHOSE "advertised price?"

Toyota's official MSRP?

If so, how does one account for the numerous, apparently, California dealers selling the FR-S with a substantial additional dealer markup (ADM), often $2k-$3k over MSRP?

The dealership's own advertised price. If they literally MUST adhere to MSRP, I'm sure that's pricing fixing and it's frowned upon

MSRP is just that, Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price

I think those dealers were handled once word got around. Some had "market adjustment" which was definitely frowned upon, but they ended up switching to another kink in the system: Aftermarket add-on that doesn't have a Scion MSRP... so you'd see, for example, Five Axis Aero Kits going for $5,000. pre-installed on cars... our everyday price at Longo is $2,400. installed, just for reference. When there is BS as such, the dealer loses their bonus allocation, so to make that quick buck, they will lose future inventory.

Scion can't control their dealers 100% but the ones not adhering to standards are definitely punished with the loss of future inventory.

[Porsche]

Originally Posted by xravexboix

The dealership's own advertised price. If they literally MUST adhere to MSRP, I'm sure that's pricing fixing and it's frowned upon

MSRP is just that, Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price

Thanks.

So, you've confirmed that what I wrote, my original understanding, is in fact correct.

Pure Pricing does NOT mean everyone pays MSRP.

In fact, given that this is true, we're right back in the same boat as before, with every dealer charging whatever they feel they can get away with. Except now, the dealer is DENIED the opportunity to negotiate with me, as I, too, am DENIED the same thing. And since NO dealer is likely to advertise his absolute end-of-the-month bottom-line price ... Scion is unlikely to EVER sell me a car with this outlandish policy.

Telling me I "don't need to negotiate." What insolence! And then telling me it's for my own good!

Oh, please...

As a customer I do not find any of this even remotely reassuring. No offense intended to you, of course.

**************


"Don't pee on my leg, and then tell me it's raining!" -Judge Judy


**************

[acollite]

I was able to get 1.9% and 500 off MSRP

[BlaineWasHere]

I was able to get 1.59% from Toyota... no need for a CU.

Also, for the OP, I'm not sure someone who hasn't even had credit for a year should be buying a brand new car.... Unless you have $10-15K for a down payment.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by BlaineWasHere

I was able to get 1.59% from Toyota... no need for a CU.

Also, for the OP, I'm not sure someone who hasn't even had credit for a year should be buying a brand new car.... Unless you have $10-15K for a down payment.

On top of that he's still in school, early graduation present I guess

Edit: to curtail the "YOU DON'T KNOW ME" arguments I suppose he could be working his way through school and has disposable income to cover what will likely be a minimum of $300/month cay payment along with living expenses and tuition.

[xravexboix]

Originally Posted by Porsche

Thanks.

So, you've confirmed that what I wrote, my original understanding, is in fact correct.

Pure Pricing does NOT mean everyone pays MSRP.

In fact, given that this is true, we're right back in the same boat as before, with every dealer charging whatever they feel they can get away with. Except now, the dealer is DENIED the opportunity to negotiate with me, as I, too, am DENIED the same thing. And since NO dealer is likely to advertise his absolute end-of-the-month bottom-line price ... Scion is unlikely to EVER sell me a car with this outlandish policy.

Yea, the theory behind it is great. The Saturn brand, obvious THE BEST CARS EVER... [please know I'm being sarcastic]... had the highest Sales Process ratings due to their haggle-free process... albeit the practice is what dictates how positive the procedure is perceived.

There is an unwritten guideline where you're not supposed to have a 'weekend fire sale' with temporary repricing. The unwritten rule asks for at least a month period where the new pricing is in effect.

But one small thing, if they are trying to sell the car for a lower price, why wouldn't they advertise the heck out of them? At the end of the month, it's about moving units to hit unit bonuses~ but anyhow, no system is ever perfect. Everyone finds the kinks in the playbook and repeats until caught in any situation

[jipstyle]

Originally Posted by BlaineWasHere

Also, for the OP, I'm not sure someone who hasn't even had credit for a year should be buying a brand new car.... Unless you have $10-15K for a down payment.

I'm an example of someone who falls into this category and I'm perfectly comfortable saying that I should be buying a brand new car.

Why? I'm a new immigrant to the US. My SSN is only several months old -- since November, in fact -- and I've only got my two new credit card appearing on my report. On the other hand, I'm trading in a 2008 STI and have a generous Bay-area IT salary.

I really wish that I could find a lender willing to use my Canadian credit rating as a basis for a loan. Unfortunately, the only lender willing to do that (BoA) also refuses to offer a loan to someone on a work visa.

Sigh.

[BlaineWasHere]

Originally Posted by jipstyle

I'm an example of someone who falls into this category and I'm perfectly comfortable saying that I should be buying a brand new car.

Why? I'm a new immigrant to the US. My SSN is only several months old -- since November, in fact -- and I've only got my two new credit card appearing on my report. On the other hand, I'm trading in a 2008 STI and have a generous Bay-area IT salary.

I really wish that I could find a lender willing to use my Canadian credit rating as a basis for a loan. Unfortunately, the only lender willing to do that (BoA) also refuses to offer a loan to someone on a work visa.

Sigh.

That's not the same at all. You've had credit elsewhere and although it isn't honored here you have experience with it.

Is your STi paid off? If so you could just save until you have cash on the trade to pay in full. STi should have plenty of value still.

[jipstyle]

Originally Posted by BlaineWasHere

That's not the same at all. You've had credit elsewhere and although it isn't honored here you have experience with it.

True enough. Sadly, the credit agencies don't see it that way.

Is your STi paid off? If so you could just save until you have cash on the trade to pay in full. STi should have plenty of value still.

It isn't paid off but the dealer offered me enough to pay the balance of the loan and have $10k toward the FR-S. I'd get more if I drove it home to Vancouver and sold it privately -- but that is a long-ass drive and selling a car is a phenomenal pain in the ass.

You're right -- I could have enough to buy the car outright in less than a year. The thing is -- I'd like to buy a home once I establish permanent residency and I need to build credit. The best way to do that is to establish excellent ratings using a variety of credit products and a secured car loan is an easy way to do that.

The annoying thing is that two of the three credit agencies (TU and Exp) are the two credit reporting agencies in Canada. Same company, but they aren't allowed to compare notes.

[fistpoint]

Everything Porsche wrote is the same conclusions that I came to when researching the silly Pure Price scheme. I would like to add though that recently Scion and many dealers have removed the wording: "dealers are free to set their own prices" from their websites. I'd like to think it's because of all the hammering we've given PP on this very website(Scion/Toyota does read here).

Also, people are saying your interest rate is negotiable. I have a different perspective on that, much more simple. If you see an offer for 1.9% from Scion/Toyota for example, simply tell them when your are being dealt with that all you want to know is if you qualify for that 1.9% or not. Do not come back with 2.x or 3.x...tell them you want a yes or no answer only. You did qualify for 1.9%, you did not qualify for 1.9%.

When I financed my Acura I had already secured a 5.0% myself(10 years ago, average APR's were much higher then, and my credit not as good as today). Anyway, Acura was offering 2.9% at the time for well qualified buyers which was fine because my father co-signed and he had the highest you can get. So when the finance lady asked what % they were trying to beat, I just starred at her for a moment in awkward silence, and replied with: "well, you're offering 2.9% right? So you're trying to beat 2.91%".

If they say you didn't qualify for the lowest, ask to see the form and exactly what rate they did qualify you for. The extra .1%'s are nothing more than points that help the finance person score the dealership vacation giveaway to the "best" seller. I don't actually know if they get a printed reply or if they just read off the computer. But I don't think there is any legal reason they can't show you exactly what they read to give you an answer. I'd assume they are hiding the truth if they won't let you see the reply.

It's like your friend from middle/high school when he asks you what you scored on your placement tests or SAT. He provides a higher score than you, but won't show you the paper even though you showed yours. Wait, you told me what it was but I can't see it? Yup, bullshit.