SCCA Solo C Street Discussion

[SeanRTR]

Originally Posted by Biggins

I thought I was the only one on 235/45s. I didn't see anyone else at any big events or Nats on that size last year. I'm still convinced I'd run within 0.1-2 on any size 215-245.

This size (235/45/17 took the final trophy spot at nationals in 2014, in a BRZ.


This was definitely the better size to run than 235/40/17 at nationals in 2014, just based on day 2's course alone.

[G_Ride]

Originally Posted by Biggins

I thought I was the only one on 235/45s. I didn't see anyone else at any big events or Nats on that size last year. I'm still convinced I'd run within 0.1-2 on any size 215-245.

I only did my first Pro and Tour at Crows Landing, CA last year (and the only ones I could go to). Two cars had 235/45 and they were quick. Of course, as much as everyone seems to make a big deal about tire size, the biggest factor is always the driver.

[Briankbot]

Originally Posted by bholliday

Anybody have any recommendations for air pressures for the Michelin Primacy? I didn't get tires ordered in time for this weekend (too many choices, too much indecision)! My car is a 2015 BRZ, no mods. From what I can find, it looks like I should run first heat and spray the tires each run.

I was pretty happy with 39F/37.5R in my FRS. Obviously a BRZ will be a bit different...

[Briankbot]

Originally Posted by 7thgear

2nd in class on stock tires... yeah, that's fucking horrible


(unless your class had 2 people)

Thanks. I think it was 10 or 11 drivers...the 35 degree temps helped but the multi-driver cars still should have been able to get their tires warm.

[klittl06]

Originally Posted by hukdizzle

Are we stuffing 245/40's on or going with something thinner like a 235/40 or 225/45?

I have 225/45 DII* getting mounted and balanced this weekend. Not that I'm any sort of authority on tire sizes...

[Biggins]

Originally Posted by SeanRTR

This size (235/45/17 took the final trophy spot at nationals in 2014, in a BRZ.


This was definitely the better size to run than 235/40/17 at nationals in 2014, just based on day 2's course alone.

Originally Posted by G_Ride

I only did my first Pro and Tour at Crows Landing, CA last year (and the only ones I could go to). Two cars had 235/45 and they were quick. Of course, as much as everyone seems to make a big deal about tire size, the biggest factor is always the driver.

Good to know. I've gotten accustomed to that size since most of our courses are relatively high speed. I just need to see how everyone does before I throw down money on a new set this year. My season finally starts this Sunday, but we might have a high of 38*. I'm running my 3-year old ZIIs that have been "snow" tires this winter... at least it's seat time.

[simpleisbest]

Well, I just traded in my 2013 for a 2015 (the dealer gave me a screaming trade in deal that could not be refused!) and while going over available options with the local Scion dealer, it appears that we have had the following performance port options available for MY2013/2014/2015 SCION FR-S.

TRD SPRING PKG, P/N: PTR07-18130
TRD SWAY PKG, P/N: PTR11-18130

For those that are not up to speed on what is allowed in Street class, you are allowed only "standard parts" plus the allowable modifications. The key is the definition of a "standard part".

Per the 2015 Rule Book's Section 12 - Automobile Definitions:

Standard Part
An item of standard or optional equipment that could have been ordered
with the car, installed on the factory production line, and delivered through
a dealer in the United States. Port-installed options provided by the manufacturer are considered to be the same as those installed on the factory production line. Dealer-installed options or deletions (except as required by factory directives), no matter how common or what their origin, are not included in this definition. This definition does not allow the updating or backdating of parts.

For us Scion FR-S owners, this means that the TRD sways and springs are legal because they are available as line item Port Options.

For the MY2015 in particular, it is very clear for you can actually build a FR-S on their website with the spring and sways as installed options. Notice the wording that pops up near the price that describes the listed MSRP is the installed MSRP by the manufacturer.

*While unofficial, one can also see these port options in the NADA Guides:
http://www.nadaguides.com/Cars/2015/...onal-Equipment

The catch is that Scion does not have any clear and concise letter or publication listing the available port options. Wording in the brochure has it with interpretation. However, any simple inquiry to a local Scion dealer or Scion's own customer service department will be able to confirm and provide printouts.

I am currently gathering as much evidence as I can to prove their eligibility and legality in hopes to being protested at the next national event and win the protest. With the documents I have gathered so far, I am highly confident. Hopefully once the protest is won, any FR-S owner should have no issues using the listed part numbers (Sect 8.3.8 Preservation of Evidence).

I am not sure how this will affect class balance, but to just go and leave this level of legal relatively cheap prep (I paid less than $700 from the dealer for both!!) on the table does not sit well for me. If it can be done legally, it should be done, IMO.

I hope that before anyone flames my post, that you simply do yourself a favor and call your local Scion dealer or chat with Scion Customer Service on their website to confirm. That's what I did!!

I will look to post the documents for all to use later in this thread!

[renfield90]

Originally Posted by simpleisbest

Well, I just traded in my 2013 for a 2015 (the dealer gave me a screaming trade in deal that could not be refused!) and while going over available options with the local Scion dealer, it appears that we have had the following performance port options available for MY2013/2014/2015 SCION FR-S.

TRD SPRING PKG, P/N: PTR07-18130
TRD SWAY PKG, P/N: PTR11-18130

For those that are not up to speed on what is allowed in Street class, you are allowed only "standard parts" plus the allowable modifications. The key is the definition of a "standard part".

Per the 2015 Rule Book's Section 12 - Automobile Definitions:

Standard Part
An item of standard or optional equipment that could have been ordered
with the car, installed on the factory production line, and delivered through
a dealer in the United States. Port-installed options provided by the manufacturer are considered to be the same as those installed on the factory production line. Dealer-installed options or deletions (except as required by factory directives), no matter how common or what their origin, are not included in this definition. This definition does not allow the updating or backdating of parts.

For us Scion FR-S owners, this means that the TRD sways and springs are legal because they are available as line item Port Options.

For the MY2015 in particular, it is very clear for you can actually build a FR-S on their website with the spring and sways as installed options. Notice the wording that pops up near the price that describes the listed MSRP is the installed MSRP by the manufacturer.

*While unofficial, one can also see these port options in the NADA Guides:
http://www.nadaguides.com/Cars/2015/...onal-Equipment

The catch is that Scion does not have any clear and concise letter or publication listing the available port options. Wording in the brochure has it with interpretation. However, any simple inquiry to a local Scion dealer or Scion's own customer service department will be able to confirm and provide printouts.

I am currently gathering as much evidence as I can to prove their eligibility and legality in hopes to being protested at the next national event and win the protest. With the documents I have gathered so far, I am highly confident. Hopefully once the protest is won, any FR-S owner should have no issues using the listed part numbers (Sect 8.3.8 Preservation of Evidence).

I am not sure how this will affect class balance, but to just go and leave this level of legal prep on the table does not sit well for me. If it can be done legally, it should be done, IMO.

I hope that before anyone flames my post, that you simply do yourself a favor and call your local Scion dealer or chat with Scion Customer Service on their website to confirm. That's what I did!!

I will look to post the documents for all to use later in this thread!

Can you confirm this applies to all model years, not just 2015?

If true we're totally gonna win at Nats this year and then get booted from the class.

You should try to get a written letter from Scion stating those part numbers are available as port-installed options.

[simpleisbest]

Originally Posted by renfield90

Can you confirm this applies to all model years, not just 2015?

If true we're totally gonna win at Nats this year and then get booted from the class.

You should try to get a written letter from Scion stating those part numbers are available as port-installed options.

According to Scion's internal "Scion Accessories Sales Guide", which is an internal dealer only accessible website, they list both PNs as being available for 2013, 2014, 2015. I have a printout showing this. If you ask your local Scion sales guy to check and pull it up in the system, it will say the same.

I requested a letter from Scion's motorsports division, but see if I can email elsewhere. A official letter would make things much easier.

[MPot]

This sounds similar to what I think it was Wilcox found with the John Cooper Works parts on MINIs. The only funky part would be if it did apply to '13 & '14 too.
A note to Doug Gill (dgill@scca.com) might help once you get the documentation.
Mike

[SeanRTR]

Wasn't the yellow TRD FR-S put into B-Street on the sole reason because it has bigger sway bars and springs on it?
I can't imagine these are going to fly in CS.

[simpleisbest]

Originally Posted by SeanRTR

Wasn't the yellow TRD FR-S put into B-Street on the sole reason because it has bigger sway bars and springs on it?
I can't imagine these are going to fly in CS.

Yup! The fact is port options are legal, though...

[Shark_Bait88]

I have a feeling that, even if you can show that the mods are technically legal under the current rules, there will be enough protest that the rules will be adjusted to close that loophole.

[G_Ride]

I think the answer is quite obvious: Bring that yellow FRS to CS!