FRS/BRZ vs 2013 Base Mustang GT

[sdiver68]

Originally Posted by ZDan

Also, for straight-line performance, I'd be *very* surprised if the auto isn't repeatably measurably slower in terms of ET and mph in the 1/4. It just isn't going to be able to stay in the powerband as well as the closer-ratio manual.

Of course even the manual isn't a FAST car, but it is going to be less slow than the automatic. Which, for my street usage, really wouldn't be a factor, honestly.

All the above said^^^, if there were no manual, only the existing automatic FR-S/BRZ, I would *still* buy one over any other car on the market today! But the manual is going to be the better-performing model.

Agreed with everything above, respectfully disagree which is faster on a road course.

[Tbomb 25]

Very nice ZDan....

[Tbomb 25]

Ok guys lets get back on this....between the price of the base GT and the FRS/BRZ...

[Tbomb 25]

Me personally i think the base GT is best budget performance buy in automotive history,I think the Twins need boost or a high reving 2.5 or so Boxer...then it will unquestionably be a monster....monster performer maybe something we havent seen yet under $40k. So for me at this point the GT is a good ways above the twins even with its bigger size but until those changes occur for the Twins...i think remaining best cars under 30k are the FRS/BRZ,Miata,V6 Stang,WRX,Gen Coupe,and possibly the Focus ST all lumped up in no particular order they all offer some amazing attributes.

[alyon]

Is it just me or are people forgetting cost to buy versus cost to own. If you look at the FRS or BRZ the cost to buy isn't that great compared to other cars such as a the 5.0. But when you start looking into insurance, gas, depreciation, and tires the 86 is a much cheaper choice. Even in comparison to the v6 PP it is a cheaper choice. That depreciation point is huge also. Mustangs have a bad habit of dropping to under 40% value after just 4-5 years... which is just about as bad as it comes for depreciation on a car. Hell, I see v6 stangs go through the dealer auctions at 16k after 1 year.

Or am I just on crazy pills? It is a big deal that people seem to gloss over when talking about how expensive a car is.

I will still admit the 5.0 is one hell of a buy.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by alyon

Is it just me or are people forgetting cost to buy versus cost to own. If you look at the FRS or BRZ the cost to buy isn't that great compared to other cars such as a the 5.0. But when you start looking into insurance, gas, depreciation, and tires the 86 is a much cheaper choice. Even in comparison to the v6 PP it is a cheaper choice. That depreciation point is huge also. Mustangs have a bad habit of dropping to under 40% value after just 4-5 years... which is just about as bad as it comes for depreciation on a car. Hell, I see v6 stangs go through the dealer auctions at 16k after 1 year.

Or am I just on crazy pills? It is a big deal that people seem to gloss over when talking about how expensive a car is.

I will still admit the 5.0 is one hell of a buy.

while i dont exactly disagree, i think the new mustangs are different enough from the previous generations that i dont think that we can make assumptions based on the cars history (although i would hope so because that would just mean rock bottom prices for us looking to buy used)

[shadoquad]

Originally Posted by alyon

Is it just me or are people forgetting cost to buy versus cost to own. If you look at the FRS or BRZ the cost to buy isn't that great compared to other cars such as a the 5.0. But when you start looking into insurance, gas, depreciation, and tires the 86 is a much cheaper choice. Even in comparison to the v6 PP it is a cheaper choice. That depreciation point is huge also. Mustangs have a bad habit of dropping to under 40% value after just 4-5 years... which is just about as bad as it comes for depreciation on a car. Hell, I see v6 stangs go through the dealer auctions at 16k after 1 year.

Or am I just on crazy pills? It is a big deal that people seem to gloss over when talking about how expensive a car is.

I will still admit the 5.0 is one hell of a buy.

It's a good point. These are all logs on the fire when considering a vehicle.

[sdiver68]

Originally Posted by fatoni

while i dont mind it, i just dont think that we should let statements like that go unchecked. trying to pass selling the better tire to barely break even on worse tires that cost half as much like it is a good idea (with respect to performance or finance) is a good idea should be frowned upon. just go to tire rack and compare them

Hey Fatoni, where is your retract and apology now that the Road and Track video has been posted that shows 2.3 seconds per lap simply by changing to performance tires?

http://www.roadandtrack.com/tests/vi...-a-faster-fr-s

We can't let statements like yours go unchecked can we?

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by sdiver68

Hey Fatoni, where is your retract and apology now that the Road and Track video has been posted that shows 2.3 seconds per lap simply by changing to performance tires?

http://www.roadandtrack.com/tests/vi...-a-faster-fr-s

We can't let statements like yours go unchecked can we?

I think what he's saying is that the stock Michelins are very expensive tires which have their own desirable attributes. They might not be the highest grip tires, but grip isn't the only thing you look for from a tire. Perhaps he is suggesting that tossing away a set of expensive tires is not very smart. No one doubts that more grip = faster.

[alyon]

Originally Posted by fatoni

while i dont exactly disagree, i think the new mustangs are different enough from the previous generations that i dont think that we can make assumptions based on the cars history (although i would hope so because that would just mean rock bottom prices for us looking to buy used)

Yes, but aren't they doing a MAJOR revamp in 2014?

[Grateful Dave]

Originally Posted by titusdrake

Btw, Ford has perfected the live rear axle. I have no problems keeping my girl in line.



Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

Nice! The Mustang is more your size. You are a very Big man.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by sdiver68

Hey Fatoni, where is your retract and apology now that the Road and Track video has been posted that shows 2.3 seconds per lap simply by changing to performance tires?

http://www.roadandtrack.com/tests/vi...-a-faster-fr-s

We can't let statements like yours go unchecked can we?

theres no need for apology because a)star specs arent the tires that we were discussing, we were talking about the 300 treadwear htrz III which isnt in the same league b) the 2.3 seconds shaved was noted on a different track so that doesnt directly relate to the head to head and c)even if it did, that was a v6 and the time difference still does not make the brz faster than the mustang gt

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by alyon

Yes, but aren't they doing a MAJOR revamp in 2014?

yeah but that happens to many cars. my point was just that i think mustangs up until this one were er...one trick ponies that were substandard in every other category other than straight line speed. the newer car seems better built both in terms of performance and quality. i dont think its going to bottom out like previous generations.

[Grateful Dave]

The Mustang is a great looking and performing muscle car for sure. I do appreciate them, but I'm more of sports car guy. If I had the money, I would rather own a Corvette or Cayman.

In the meantime, Toyota/Subaru built a beautiful practical sports car that I can afford. It can be a Daily Driver or a Track Car. It has a stiff, track ready chassis with a specialized boxer motor & fuel injection, a nice rear wheel drive drivetrain (MT or AT), and a performance designed suspension that is affordable to buy and drive. Yes, I wish it had more power but then costs go up. When they work out the intake, exhaust and forced induction, I'll consider those performance mods. As is, it has plenty power to have fun on a mountain road.
Yet for the cost to buy and drive, the FR-S/BRZ is Awesome!!! It performs really cool. I get high end sports car handling for one third to half of the cost.
Thank you Mr. Toyoda, Tada, Subaru and everyone involved in the design and production of this car.