Price... what the FRS/BRZ should cost

[suprachica79]

Originally Posted by A Gomez

Thank you for quickly summarizing the general consensus and getting me up to the speed.

The reason why I posted the question is that now I think the trim levels we know as of now are likely to start just around $25K (basically, all of them are now north of $25K including destination charges) based on all the information I have gotten so far. The price is not necessarily for the masses and if Toyota/Subaru are serious about selling these in decent volumes, it seems logical to add a lower trim level to either brand or both of them. That being said, I do not know what can be stripped further... LSD and aluminum wheels are the first to go. I am not sure if 4 wheel vented disc-brakes are considered standard currently, but if so, they can be let go and vented disc are for the front only , too.

I don't see much you could strip out of the Scion that wouldn't diminish the performance and/or handling that the car was originally made for. It's not like there are really any amenities to take out to lower the cost since we know the interior is fairly stripped in comparison to the Subaru variants, and getting rid of the LSD I think would kill some sales for people who may drive this car in the elements, and I think would diminish its performance as well. We already know there won't be HIDs so can't take those out, and I guess you could scale back the brakes a bit but how much money would that really save?

[tripjammer]

Originally Posted by suprachica79

I think based on how Scion has presented itself since its inception, it will be mono-spec with options/accesories. That's not to say that they may change that business model, but it's a general consensus here that this will remain the same for the FR-S.

As for the Subaru, I think it's possible that there will be a BRZ base along with the already fairly well known trim levels of the premium and limited. I wouldn't be surprised if there were the original 2 trims we know of, or if they add in a third base-level model. However, a base model might compete too much with the Scion which we believe to be the least-luxurious. So again, it's possible that Toyota would not allow that to happen and would heavily petition that Subaru only offer the Premium and Limited trim levels.

You know this is possible since there are 3 trims on the WRX...base, premium and limited. Subaru might go this way.

That would make the BRZ, at the same or close to the price of the FR-S.

And Scion or Subaru never said that the FR-S was going to cost less than the BRZ. We just know it will in our hearts of hearts! Because we all know Scion does have very competitive pricing and does include a lot of stuff for you money. Since the FR-S does not really have a lot of equipment, we all speculate that the price might be very low.

New Updated Pricing Speculation:

2013 Subaru BRZ:
Subaru BRZ $23k (17 inch wheels, CD radio, Aluminum pedals, LSD) I doubt this is going to happen, too close to the price of the FR-S but hey anything is possible in this world of ours!

Subaru BRZ Premium $24k (adds Navi and HIDS, 4 wheel vented disk brakes)

Subaru BRZ Limited $25k (adds Dual AC with Push start, leather\alcantara heated seats, wing)



2013 Scion FR-S:
Scion FR-S $22.5k (CD Radio, Aluminum pedals, 17 inch wheels, 4 wheel vented disk brakes, LSD, white tach)

Scion FR-S Release 1.0 $24.5k (HIDS, Dual Zone AC with Push start, leather\alcantara heated seats, wing)

[tripjammer]

Originally Posted by A Gomez

Thank you for quickly summarizing the general consensus and getting me up to the speed.

The reason why I posted the question is that now I think the trim levels we know as of now are likely to start just around $25K (basically, all of them are now north of $25K including destination charges) based on all the information I have gotten so far. The price is not necessarily for the masses and if Toyota/Subaru are serious about selling these in decent volumes, it seems logical to add a lower trim level to either brand or both of them. That being said, I do not know what can be stripped further... LSD and aluminum wheels are the first to go. I am not sure if 4 wheel vented disc-brakes are considered standard currently, but if so, they can be let go and vented disc are for the front only , too.

If the scion FR-S is $25k and you don't get HIDS and push start and better seats, it won't sell.

A $25k scion is a fully loaded Scion FR-S which would be HIGH-SPEC Toyota 86 based.

Why are some people still thinking that the BRZ limited is going to be a $30K car in the USA? This is not going to happen.

The reason why they have not announced pricing is because they know if they price this car wrong, it will kill it in the market.

We might not get pricing to like 2 months before release date.

[A Gomez]

Originally Posted by suprachica79

I don't see much you could strip out of the Scion that wouldn't diminish the performance and/or handling that the car was originally made for. It's not like there are really any amenities to take out to lower the cost since we know the interior is fairly stripped in comparison to the Subaru variants, and getting rid of the LSD I think would kill some sales for people who may drive this car in the elements, and I think would diminish its performance as well. We already know there won't be HIDs so can't take those out, and I guess you could scale back the brakes a bit but how much money would that really save?

I am totally with you. Let's hope Toyota/Subaru won't take out anything further and still keep the prices at the lower end of our guess. Just FYI, there are 4 trim levels rumoured in Japan, base (for competition), standard, luxury and super luxury.

Base - 1.99M yen ($25k)
Standard - 2.48 M yen ($31K)
Luxury - 2.78M yen ($35K) -> This is the US Scion version equivalent
Super Luxury - 2.98 M yen ($38K)
(using $1 = 80 yen, prices are not official)

Take a look at the interior that the base and standard will get just for fun. This won't work in the US market.

http://cdn.mkimg.carview.co.jp/minka...dbfb5139f7.jpg

[suprachica79]

Originally Posted by tripjammer

You know this is possible since there are 3 trims on the WRX...base, premium and limited. Subaru might go this way.

That would make the BRZ, at the same or close to the price of the FR-S.

And Scion or Subaru never said that the FR-S was going to cost less than the BRZ. We just know it will in our hearts of hearts! Because we all know Scion does have very competitive pricing and does include a lot of stuff for you money. Since the FR-S does not really have a lot of equipment, we all speculate that the price might be very low.

New Updated Pricing Speculation:

2013 Subaru BRZ:
Subaru BRZ $23k (17 inch wheels, CD radio, Aluminum pedals, LSD) I doubt this is going to happen, too close to the price of the FR-S but hey anything is possible in this world of ours!

Subaru BRZ Premium $24k (adds Navi and HIDS, 4 wheel vented disk brakes)

Subaru BRZ Limited $25k (adds Dual AC with Push start, leather\alcantara heated seats, wing)



2013 Scion FR-S:
Scion FR-S $22.5k (CD Radio, Aluminum pedals, 17 inch wheels, 4 wheel vented disk brakes, LSD, white tach)

Scion FR-S Release 1.0 $24.5k (HIDS, Dual Zone AC with Push start, leather\alcantara heated seats, wing)

The WRX doesn't have an almost identical car from another brand to compete with, so I don't think the comparison is valid. As for your prediction for the FR-S release 1.0, I would buy that in a heart beat. That is exactly what I want and I would definitely pay the extra 2k for it. Except that I'd want completely leather seats rather than the leather-alcantara mix.

[tripjammer]

Originally Posted by suprachica79

The WRX doesn't have an almost identical car from another brand to compete with, so I don't think the comparison is valid. As for your prediction for the FR-S release 1.0, I would buy that in a heart beat. That is exactly what I want and I would definitely pay the extra 2k for it. Except that I'd want completely leather seats rather than the leather-alcantara mix.

Your right the WRX is very unique for what it is.

I was just using that as a way for Subaru to make 3 models of the BRZ. But there will probably only be two models...premium and limited.

I have not seen any 86 models with full leather seats. So this is not going to happen. Leather-alcartara is still cool.

[A Gomez]

Originally Posted by tripjammer

The reason why they have not announced pricing is because they know if they price this car wrong, it will kill it in the market.

tripjammer, I could really use your perspective on this. Let's leave out the numbers for now (although I can tell you I am definintely rooting much more for your predictions than my pessimism broguth back by some information). For what could Toyota possibly use an extra month or two to finalize the prices of these cars? Many people are anticipating the information will be released at the Detroit Autoshow and I am one of them as I just want to be done with the first step which is to decide whether or not I am even going to consider to buy one of these. If they already know what range would be accepted by the market, shouldn't they be able to at least suggest the range? Or do you think the range they have at this moment is still too big (say, more than $3K - $4K within the same trim level)?

[ayau]

Originally Posted by A Gomez

tripjammer, I could really use your perspective on this. Let's leave out the numbers for now (although I can tell you I am definintely rooting much more for your predictions than my pessimism broguth back by some information). For what could Toyota possibly use an extra month or two to finalize the prices of these cars? Many people are anticipating the information will be released at the Detroit Autoshow and I am one of them as I just want to be done with the first step which is to decide whether or not I am even going to consider to buy one of these. If they already know what range would be accepted by the market, shouldn't they be able to at least suggest the range? Or do you think the range they have at this moment is still too big (say, more than $3K - $4K within the same trim level)?

Could be a marketing thing too. By not releasing the prices, enthusiasts like yourself will continue to speculate until the official announcement. This keeps the car from getting stale.

[Longhorn248]

Originally Posted by ayau

Could be a marketing thing too. By not releasing the prices, enthusiasts like yourself will continue to speculate until the official announcement. This keeps the car from getting stale.

The car may be fresh, but the pricing debate/argument I think is dwindling pretty quickly. I'm sure things will heat back up after the prices are announced so we can all start racking our brains on exactly what we want to buy.

[tripjammer]

Originally Posted by A Gomez

tripjammer, I could really use your perspective on this. Let's leave out the numbers for now (although I can tell you I am definintely rooting much more for your predictions than my pessimism broguth back by some information). For what could Toyota possibly use an extra month or two to finalize the prices of these cars? Many people are anticipating the information will be released at the Detroit Autoshow and I am one of them as I just want to be done with the first step which is to decide whether or not I am even going to consider to buy one of these. If they already know what range would be accepted by the market, shouldn't they be able to at least suggest the range? Or do you think the range they have at this moment is still too big (say, more than $3K - $4K within the same trim level)?

Most auto manufacturers do not release the pricing of their new cars till about 2 months before they are released. This is about when you will be able to order the car.

lets go with June 1, 2012 as the release date of the first batch of FR-S\BRZ in the USA....You will be able to officially order the car, when you get the complete pricing. So that will probably happen Mid march to early April 2012.

We won't get the pricing till then. But they will take you deposits starting now or after the Detroit auto show.

I my opinion, I do not think Scion knows what to include in the car as standard equipment. They want to price the car right but they don't want it too stripped. They also don't want to too close to pricing of the tC.

I am not in marketing, I am just a computer engineer. But what I suggest is..

Scion make a Mono spec FR-S, but let the end user customize the car like they want.

Go with a low price point of $22k and let us have the option for HIDS, Dualzone AC with push start, and leather\alcantara heated sport seats, along with the TRD parts. Somebody from Scion mentioned that there would be like up to 600 different accessories available to the FR-S. Please let this be true.

[suprachica79]

Originally Posted by tripjammer

Most auto manufacturers do not release the pricing of their new cars till about 2 months before they are released. This is about when you will be able to order the car.

lets go with June 1, 2012 as the release date of the first batch of FR-S\BRZ in the USA....You will be able to officially order the car, when you get the complete pricing. So that will probably happen Mid march to early April 2012.

We won't get the pricing till then. But they will take you deposits starting now or after the Detroit auto show.

I my opinion, I do not think Scion knows what to include in the car as standard equipment. They want to price the car right but they don't want it too stripped. They also don't want to too close to pricing of the tC.

I am not in marketing, I am just a computer engineer. But what I suggest is..

Scion make a Mono spec FR-S, but let the end user customize the car like they want.

Go with a low price point of $22k and let us have the option for HIDS, Dualzone AC with push start, and leather\alcantara heated sport seats, along with the TRD parts. Somebody from Scion mentioned that there would be like up to 600 different accessories available to the FR-S. Please let this be true.

I wish I would have kept a tally of how many times you have directly addressed the company Scion in this forum lol, it cracks me up. And pretty much saying the exact same thing every time. And because what you say is exactly what I want, it doesn't even irritate me

[Mari0]

Dunno about the "600" options, but their VP said the "most out of any scion before"

[poormans_LFA]

Originally Posted by Mari0

Dunno about the "600" options, but their VP said the "most out of any scion before"

where did you hear/read that??

[Longhorn248]

Originally Posted by Mari0

Dunno about the "600" options, but their VP said the "most out of any scion before"

"600" and "most out of any scion before" sounds like a pretty wide range. This just bring the debate back around the circle on whether or not the Scion is supposed to be the base model without all the fancy options like the BRZ to try and keep the markets separate for the cars.