Stupid sales people

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by shawnperolis

I would have ordered my damn car on the internet if it meant not dealing with a car salesman/dealership.

This can't happen soon enough, I would have paid EXTRA money to just get what I wanted delivered with no headache.

The best salesmen are the ones that shut up, answer the questions you have, show you how to work whatever nonsense features are on the car and don't B.S. you on junk like options and undercoating.

[Gen]

It's unfortunate the draconian laws of the US prevent manufacturers from opening their own dealerships. I think just about everyone would prefer dealing with the manufacturer directly.

[Beyer Subaru]

Wow. So much hate and animosity. In this day and age you don't have to deal with the Salesman. You can buy your cars over the internet. I regularly have customers that I will only meet once at the time of delivery.
It is your choice to work with the Salesman of your choice. If the first one that walks up to you doesn't know his stuff, then talk to someone else.

If I have a bad experience with someone in a service oriented trade, I will ask to deal with someone else. This is only as hard as you make it.

No one is forcing you to deal with a tool.

When I bought my STi in 03 the Salesman was such an idiot, I bypassed her and only dealt with the Sales Mgr and Finance Mgr.

I know that y'all got a lot of hate and stigma for us and this will fall on deaf ears. But here's a great video showing our(my) daily life.

From the other side of the fence: ***NWS for Language***
[ame]http://youtu.be/PAACjJ20-G0[/ame]




Ninja Edit: Page King-woot!

[Rayme]

I knew more about the FR-S than my salesman, but still I don't recall him saying anything remotely wrong.

[raphy]

It not easy to be on the sales side we have to be picture perfect every time, but there is never an excuse or rudeness or misinformation. If I don't have an answer to a question I will get it for you simple as that. But I get how everyone feels about us I work for a non-scion dealer and when I went to another dealer the people weren't very nice to me either because of my age. All the managers receptionists and sales ignored me.

[Atticus808]

not all salesman are idiots.
but I mean telling me an engine is off to the side?????

[Gen]

Originally Posted by Beyer Subaru

Wow. So much hate and animosity. In this day and age you don't have to deal with the Salesman. You can buy your cars over the internet. I regularly have customers that I will only meet once at the time of delivery.
It is your choice to work with the Salesman of your choice. If the first one that walks up to you doesn't know his stuff, then talk to someone else.

If I have a bad experience with someone in a service oriented trade, I will ask to deal with someone else. This is only as hard as you make it.

No one is forcing you to deal with a tool.

When I bought my STi in 03 the Salesman was such an idiot, I bypassed her and only dealt with the Sales Mgr and Finance Mgr.

I know that y'all got a lot of hate and stigma for us and this will fall on deaf ears. But here's a great video showing our(my) daily life.

From the other side of the fence: ***NWS for Language***

Ninja Edit: Page King-woot!

I completely understand and agree that sales are hard, and I may be antisocial, but I would much prefer to purchase my vehicle from a vending machine with a guy that hands me a key to test drive it first. I mean no offense, but car salesman are in the same boat as travel agents these days. They're just becoming unnecessary as the younger generation grows up. There's literally no information a car salesman can provide me that Google cannot. A salesman, at his or her core, is in the business of information. You inform me so that I feel I am making an appropriate purchase, but there's simply no way a salesman can compete with the internet.

I recently helped my mother purchase a vehicle, and I think this is a big generational gap, but she had no idea what she wanted to buy. She was going to different dealership to be informed. I don't know of this occurring in anyone under 35--we already know all the specs on the vehicle, we just want the best price and a salesman is seen as an obstacle while they grimace and wince and do the "you're really bustin' my balls here Gen, but let me go talk to the big man. I can't really cut it that low without his sign off". I already know what the invoice is. I know what your holdback is. I know how much volume you do.

[russv]

I have noticed a trend lately in that car sales people have become easier to work with and less high pressure, possibly because my grey hair indicates I've done this before. I actually enjoy the car buying experience now that I have had all the tricks pulled on me and can stop the game playing with a simple blank stare.

[Beyer Subaru]

Originally Posted by Gen

I completely understand and agree that sales are hard, and I may be antisocial, but I would much prefer to purchase my vehicle from a vending machine with a guy that hands me a key to test drive it first. I mean no offense, but car salesman are in the same boat as travel agents these days. They're just becoming unnecessary as the younger generation grows up. There's literally no information a car salesman can provide me that Google cannot. A salesman, at his or her core, is in the business of information. You inform me so that I feel I am making an appropriate purchase, but there's simply no way a salesman can compete with the internet.

I recently helped my mother purchase a vehicle, and I think this is a big generational gap, but she had no idea what she wanted to buy. She was going to different dealership to be informed. I don't know of this occurring in anyone under 35--we already know all the specs on the vehicle, we just want the best price and a salesman is seen as an obstacle while they grimace and wince and do the "you're really bustin' my balls here Gen, but let me go talk to the big man. I can't really cut it that low without his sign off". I already know what the invoice is. I know what your holdback is. I know how much volume you do.

Yes and no.

Yes - Google is your friend when searching out any info.
No - My wealth of knowledge about my cars rivals google.

Knowing Invoice, Holdback, Volume means absolutely nothing. You don't know what that dealer needs to make every month to stay afloat. The happiest customers I've ever had have payed MSRP or close. The most unhappy customers that I have ever had nickled and dimed me to the point that we would almost take a loss on the deal to roll the car and they were still trying to get more discount.

The internet was supposed to eliminate car salesman. But we're still here and I doubt that we will go anywhere as long as the Mfrs think that selling a car requires customer service.

It would be like saying "I hate waiters. I wish I could go to a restaurant and just order my food from a kiosk." Not gonna happen.

I deal with all manners of people from 18-80. Their might be some people that know more than me but the majority of people cannot tell the difference between a model, trim, option or accessory.

The FT guys might know everything about the FT. But the other 99% of my customers buying Legacy, Outback, Impreza, WRX/STi and Tribeca still appreciate me, all of the information that I provide and the job that I do for them.

Y'all have to stop and realize - You do this once every 6-10 years. We do at least 6-10 cars every month-in, month-out.

Again, this goes back to - If you don't like your guy, get a different guy. If there's not one available go to a different store.

[mkiisupra]

[QUOTE=Beyer Subaru;786320]

I know that y'all got a lot of hate and stigma for us and this will fall on deaf ears. But here's a great video showing our(my) daily life.

From the other side of the fence: ***NWS for Language***
[QUOTE]


I only made it halfway, and had to stop. Please, if all salespersons did what this video stated, this thread wouldn't exist.

If cars were around when Dante was writing, he'd probably place carsales with lawyers in the same level of Hades...

That being said, being well informed, using internet and phone will prevent most of the hucksters. Although there is still good comedy when you ask several Scion dealers about extended warrantee pricing. Really good laughs, they should be on a conference call together just to hear them stammer their way though collective BS reasoning and rationale.

Had a great time (due to dilligence and preparation) with Dale F at Gosch Toyota/Scion in Hemet, CA

Eric G

[Gen]

Originally Posted by Beyer Subaru

Yes and no.

Yes - Google is your friend when searching out any info.
No - My wealth of knowledge about my cars rivals google.

Knowing Invoice, Holdback, Volume means absolutely nothing. You don't know what that dealer needs to make every month to stay afloat. The happiest customers I've ever had have payed MSRP or close. The most unhappy customers that I have ever had nickled and dimed me to the point that we would almost take a loss on the deal to roll the car and they were still trying to get more discount.

The internet was supposed to eliminate car salesman. But we're still here and I doubt that we will go anywhere as long as the Mfrs think that selling a car requires customer service.

It would be like saying "I hate waiters. I wish I could go to a restaurant and just order my food from a kiosk." Not gonna happen.

I deal with all manners of people from 18-80. Their might be some people that know more than me but the majority of people cannot tell the difference between a model, trim, option or accessory.

The FT guys might know everything about the FT. But the other 99% of my customers buying Legacy, Outback, Impreza, WRX/STi and Tribeca still appreciate me, all of the information that I provide and the job that I do for them.

Y'all have to stop and realize - You do this once every 6-10 years. We do at least 6-10 cars every month-in, month-out.

Again, this goes back to - If you don't like your guy, get a different guy. If there's not one available go to a different store.

I get it and I'm not trying to imply at all that there aren't a lot people that appreciate you. I think the problem stems from the fact that you guys do indeed do this 6-10 times a month. It creates an information imbalance around the process in favor of the salesman and customers are inherently distrustful.

FWIW, sales put food on my table. I don't directly sell anything and sit in a nice cushy office at the top of a giant building, but the people under me do. They're constantly pushed by their superiors to sell every warranty and accessory on big ticket items you can shake a stick at in the name of 'taking care of the customer and providing a total package'. If they didn't, I would not have a pay check as these happen to be where all the margin is at. My honest opinion is that it's nearly impossible to make your boss happy without taking advantage of some customers, even if those customers thank you for it.

After my mother purchased her car, she went back and purchased a 100k mile / 8 year 'maintenance package', that included everything except tires for $4000. She felt great because she talked them down from $4600 and raved about their wonderful service. The woman put 34k miles on her last car in 9 years--the whole thing was absurd.

[Demiurge]

Originally Posted by Beyer Subaru

No one is forcing you to deal with a tool.

I don't know about that. You might remember my 'Is my dealer full of shit?" thread

I gave that dealer a bad review to SCION, and asked if they could fix the scratches, but they told me the only way was for me to go to that dealer again. Which doesn't really help, if I don't trust them as they lied to me every single interaction I had. I ended up going to second closest dealer for oil change, at which point they charged 90$ to do it early and I accidentally saw them drive the car like crazy on the way to their garage. Oh well. I don't really have a choice, and it seems that sometimes, or most of the time, we are indeed forced to deal with tools, and I'd rather not. Don't think I'm buying a new car ever again.

[wbradley]

Originally Posted by Beyer Subaru

The happiest customers I've ever had have payed MSRP or close. The most unhappy customers that I have ever had nickled and dimed me to the point that we would almost take a loss on the deal to roll the car and they were still trying to get more discount.

That is so true in many industries.

The ones that nickel and dime you to death usually will complain of you short changing them after they get the product. And referrals? Usually not or you get others also expecting cost price or less.

I like the pure pricing at Scion only because it takes the pressure off the negotiations (for me) and if the product is competitive in the market that should be enough. The factory or distributor can always adjust incentives, interest etc to keep things on target, but keep it the same for all dealers of the same brand.

People at Ford, GM etc used to make a lot more money when they close deals when I was in the business over 20 years ago. The only problem is: 1-do you believe in the product?, and 2-does the public believe in it?

Typically the harder the sell, the more the commission in the car business as I recall. Hondas back in the day might have sold themselves except sales reps needed to sell one a day wheras domestics you could make a living on 1/2 per week.

I found my Scion rep. very quiet, friendly, a good listener etc. Very non aggressive. I bet he doesnt make that much per car but he probably does a fair volume.

I wont even get into extreme time waster customers. I just spent all day dealing with one, finally agreeing oin a price, only to wait hours and hours for no fax to come back and then find they are trying to negotiate again.

I hated doing it, but I finally resorted to saying I have a family to support and after all winter in the building business if iI wanted to lose money on deals now my family could end up in the street. I know that is going too far, but in the end I will end up do more and more for this guy, and he will whittle me down literally to nothing.

Thank goodness I NEVER treated sales people that way. Salesmen are the easiest sale. Too bad not everyone has a big heart.

[FR-Shadow]

Its funny because my salesman became a buddy of mine. Fellow car enthusiast.
Anyways though I did make him feel kind of dumb once. I was getting my car serviced and we usually just chat it up about the FRS. But one day he tried selling me on the OEM+ sub in the trunk. He had one on the sales floor to show me, I looked and the first thing I said was what if I get a flat tire...I wouldn’t be able to put on my spare because the box blocks goes over the cover so I am not able to take it out. He looks at it and tries to take out the cover to get to the spare and yup I was right. he couldn’t. The sub box is so tight into the corner that its pressing on the carpet too much to pull it free.

He just said oh man I’m going to have to talk to my manager about that. I said yeah. I’m good with the stock system. I am not a speaker/sub kind of guys anyways.