Nameless Performance Equal Length Stepped Header - Page 72 - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community

Sportsguy83 · 02-03-2013, 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sportsguy83

Just curious, why do you care about a Cat in FL? (unless you removed the secondary Cat in which case I would understand you don't want your daughter to run completely Catless)

Quote:

Originally Posted by wootwoot

Could be for autoX. He also may be trying to slow the inevitable destruction of the planet.

Yeah, that's why I said if he removed the secondary I understood it.

FR-S Matt · 02-04-2013, 12:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mangostick

^ this. I had a subaru, I still hang with all my local subie friends .. and to be honest UEL matches those cars. IT DOES NOT match the personality of the FRS/BRZ imho. It sounds like a Harley and a Honda got it on and that's what came out the other side.

People are going to do what they want to do regardless of whether its going to give them actual gains or not. UEL headers are nothing more than oem compromise for cost and ease of mounting in a tight space.

Why pay performance $$ for another compromise?

There's no proof yet that there is a performance compromise on this car with either header. Not enough tests.

OrbitalEllipses · 02-04-2013, 01:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wootwoot

Could be for autoX. He also may be trying to slow the inevitable destruction of the planet.

I can't stop it, why care?

I have retained the secondary cat.

tonystewart · 02-04-2013, 08:37 AM

I was hoping to get her into AutoX after volleyball season this summer, one of her friends father told me the stock class required it. I haven't checked the rule book.

mangostick · 02-04-2013, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FR-S Matt

There's no proof yet that there is a performance compromise on this car with either header. Not enough tests.

what makes this car different from any other gasoline powered engine?

UEL with short tubes doesn't make the same power.. they just dont. I could get into the science of why but the only guys here going to get it are the Nameless crew and maybe a few others.

Long tube equal length headers have been making more power on various applications since the dawn of the combustion engine. Its not going to change any time soon.

Dimman · 02-04-2013, 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mangostick

what makes this car different from any other gasoline powered engine?

UEL with short tubes doesn't make the same power.. they just dont. I could get into the science of why but the only guys here going to get it are the Nameless crew and maybe a few others.

Long tube equal length headers have been making more power on various applications since the dawn of the combustion engine. Its not going to change any time soon.

We can start with what the engine ECU needs to get information about fuel requirements. It needs an airflow reference (the MAF) and a combustion efficiency reference (the O2 sensor). Both of which are reading averages. But on an UEL header it is not scavenging equally on both banks. So if you need 12.5:1 AFR for best power on a UEL one bank may be at 12:1 and the other at 13:1.

To the UEL fans, ask yourselves if you have ever seen an UEL intake manifold...

QFry · 02-04-2013, 09:53 AM

Doesnt the sound people are seeking have more to do with the pairing of the cylinders on the header than it does with the length of the primaries?

uspspro · 02-04-2013, 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dimman

ask yourselves if you have ever seen an UEL intake manifold...

yes, and they suck.

4AGZE intake manifold

industrial · 02-04-2013, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by uspspro

yes, and they suck.

4AGZE intake manifold

I wouldn't trust any intake manifold that didn't suck.

2forme · 02-04-2013, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by industrial

I wouldn't trust any intake manifold that didn't suck.

OrbitalEllipses · 02-04-2013, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dimman

We can start with what the engine ECU needs to get information about fuel requirements. It needs an airflow reference (the MAF) and a combustion efficiency reference (the O2 sensor). Both of which are reading averages. But on an UEL header it is not scavenging equally on both banks. So if you need 12.5:1 AFR for best power on a UEL one bank may be at 12:1 and the other at 13:1.

To the UEL fans, ask yourselves if you have ever seen an UEL intake manifold...

Stock Subaru intake manifolds have unequal length runners...or at least the older cast aluminum manifolds did.

Dimman · 02-04-2013, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

Stock Subaru intake manifolds have unequal length runners...or at least the older cast aluminum manifolds did.

How unequal?

Most I've seen look pretty equal. Any runner length variability probably has to do with port length.

I can't imagine any intake being as asymmetric as the exhaust manifolds.

OrbitalEllipses · 02-04-2013, 01:18 PM

No, it's not nearly that bad. Just being a smartass.

mangostick · 02-04-2013, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by QFry

Doesnt the sound people are seeking have more to do with the pairing of the cylinders on the header than it does with the length of the primaries?

Nope, pairing of the cyl's doesn't mean much because the firing order is still in order. All things equal (no pun) you would hear 1234 1234 .. when you run a uel header it pairs the exhaust pulses.. thus halfing (or close to) the frequency and giving the rumbly exhaust note. 13,24 13,24 13,24

02-04-2013, 08:37 AM	#998
tonystewart Senior Member Join Date: May 2012 Drives: 2013 Scion FR-S Raven Location: Lake Worth Florida Posts: 1,182 Thanks: 76 Thanked 373 Times in 253 Posts Mentioned: 13 Post(s) Tagged: 1 Thread(s)	I was hoping to get her into AutoX after volleyball season this summer, one of her friends father told me the stock class required it. I haven't checked the rule book. __________________ May'12 AT Raven, OFT V2, Perrin IntakeTube, Pulley & Overpipe,HKS Snorkel,FA20 EL Header,Nameless Frontpipe w/ Helmholtz, Crawford AOS, Cusco O2W Cooler, Grimmspeed Strut/MC Brace, Winjets w/D2S 3.0 HID by Illuminating Lighworkx, Fogs w/EU Stalk, LED's, JDM UnderPanels, Diffuser, Rigid Collars, Whiteline, HVT Camber Plates, Koni's, Swift Springs, GTSpec LCA, SPC Toearms, DBA 4K T-Slot Rotors, Ferodo DS2500, Vorshlag BrakeLines, MichelinPSS, 5Axis Wing, Raammat, Ensolite, JPM Coachworks, OEM+Ref400, 20mmspacers, TOMS

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02-04-2013, 01:18 PM	#1007
OrbitalEllipses Banned Join Date: Jan 2012 Drives: Attitude Location: MD Posts: 10,046 Thanks: 884 Thanked 4,890 Times in 2,903 Posts Mentioned: 123 Post(s) Tagged: 4 Thread(s)	No, it's not nearly that bad. Just being a smartass.

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