FR-S vs BRZ

[jadewbj]

Originally Posted by a2cpc

Maybe I am confused. Are you saying that Scion, the company Toyota started as a means to lure younger buyers, and Toyota are not the same company?

Yes, and no. What I am saying is that SCION is a branch of Toyota and that branch had nothing to do with the development of the FR-S other than swapping the badges.

Kind of like the Greddy intake, it is really a Takeda with a Greddy sticker.

Scion as a brand is almost just a marketing ploy to appeal to a younger market.

This car is and was developed as the Toyota 86 and when they got to the end and looked at the slumping sales of Scion they thought that they could boost those sales by offering it as a Scion in the US.

To me this is the same as what Pontiac did in 2004 by taking a rebadged, third-generation Holden Monaro and calling it a GTO. It's a Holden with GTO badges.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by jadewbj

Yes, and no. What I am saying is that SCION is a branch of Toyota and that branch had nothing to do with the development of the FR-S other than swapping the badges.

Kind of like the Greddy intake, it is really a Takeda with a Greddy sticker.

Scion as a brand is almost just a marketing ploy to appeal to a younger market.

This car is and was developed as the Toyota 86 and when they got to the end and looked at the slumping sales of Scion they thought that they could boost those sales by offering it as a Scion in the US.

To me this is the same as what Pontiac did in 2004 by taking a rebadged, third-generation Holden Monaro and calling it a GTO. It's a Holden with GTO badges.

there are a lot of parts of toyota that didnt have anything to do with the frs. making this car a scion was a cognitive decision and to say it isnt a scion when even toyota says it is makes little sense. also, i suggest you look at the history of the gto.

[jadewbj]

Originally Posted by fatoni

there are a lot of parts of toyota that didnt have anything to do with the frs. making this car a scion was a cognitive decision and to say it isnt a scion when even toyota says it is makes little sense. also, i suggest you look at the history of the gto.

It was a cognitive decision to boost scion sales. Agreed!

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by jadewbj

It was a cognitive decision to boost scion sales. Agreed!

i dont see how that means it isnt a scion. saying that the engineers were from toyota and not scion is kinda pointless since the engineers live in a place where there isnt scion. scions are toyotas. this car makes so much more sense as a scion than a toyota in america today. i dont understand why people cant see that.

[jadewbj]

Originally Posted by fatoni

i dont see how that means it isnt a scion. saying that the engineers were from toyota and not scion is kinda pointless since the engineers live in a place where there isnt scion. scions are toyotas. this car makes so much more sense as a scion than a toyota in america today. i dont understand why people cant see that.

Scion has been on the decline since inception. It started off with quirky vehicles like the toaster (original xb) and it really pulled in the youth market.

Since then they have lost the edge they once had. They have also lost the youth and the scion buyer has gotten older and older.

This is a performance car, which is not what scion is or was known for doing. The 86 heritage is deeply Toyota from its inspiration. It is a chance for Toyota to return it's passion for sports cars.

[chulooz]

Originally Posted by fatoni

i dont see how that means it isnt a scion. saying that the engineers were from toyota and not scion is kinda pointless since the engineers live in a place where there isnt scion. scions are toyotas. this car makes so much more sense as a scion than a toyota in america today. i dont understand why people cant see that.

Lots of people connect a car like this with emotion, so sense isnt always the best option. Brand identity has neutered Toyota lineup, and some might go further to argue compromising themselves with 'Scion'.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by jadewbj

Scion has been on the decline since inception. It started off with quirky vehicles like the toaster (original xb) and it really pulled in the youth market.

Since then they have lost the edge they once had. They have also lost the youth and the scion buyer has gotten older and older.

This is a performance car, which is not what scion is or was known for doing. The 86 heritage is deeply Toyota from its inspiration. It is a chance for Toyota to return it's passion for sports cars.

the numbers can be misleading if you ignore the american economy. last year the tc sold almost as well as the civic. it may sound like a failure but when you consider that the civic comes in 7 trims and two body styles, it looks pretty good (the tc sold over 4 times better than the civic coupe).

scion also has the youngest average buyer age out of any other vehicle.

scion is only ten years old. when toyota was ten years old, there was no, supra, celica, starlet, mr2, gt2000, ae86, prius, or any other car that toyota is nown for. i dont think its fair to say what scion is or isnt.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by chulooz

Lots of people connect a car like this with emotion, so sense isnt always the best option. Brand identity has neutered Toyota lineup, and some might go further to argue compromising themselves with 'Scion'.

those people miss the point of a sports car and are neutering themselves (metaphorically, not that i have to specify) by being so myopic. besides, how stupid do people look spewing out brand snobbery from a toyota?

[Accurate Race Shop]

Originally Posted by fatoni

those people miss the point of a sports car and are neutering themselves (metaphorically, not that i have to specify) by being so myopic. besides, how stupid do people look spewing out brand snobbery from a toyota?

This thing happens a lot like the gmc sierra and the Chevy Silverado they are the same truck built on the same assembly line by the same company but people still feel the need to argue over which is better. My wife has a Maserati and they always argue over how much of it is Ferrari and how much is still Maserati.

Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk 2

[chulooz]

Originally Posted by fatoni

those people miss the point of a sports car and are neutering themselves (metaphorically, not that i have to specify) by being so myopic. besides, how stupid do people look spewing out brand snobbery from a toyota?

Is this to say that sports cars are not an emotional choice? Public reception would have been higher with Toyota on the front and back is my guess, based on more emotional reasoning. But of course people still buy the car for the car itself.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by chulooz

Is this to say that sports cars are not an emotional choice? Public reception would have been higher with Toyota on the front and back is my guess, based on more emotional reasoning. But of course people still buy the car for the car itself.

no. its to say that the badge carries no value in the performance or sportiness of a car. the only real issue i have with certain badges would be in the quality of engineering and build. that is a non issue with scion. it wouldnt be any better as a sports car if it was branded a toyota. the people hating on the scion badge seem to be folding to peer pressure as far as i can tell. its not an emotional issue, its a social one.

[sho220]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

don't care about any of the "lux" items, but HIDs? That's a safety item to me. I like seeing where the f*ck I'm going. If you don't care for HIDs, it's cuz you've never owned a car with them.

And I'm not talking about a $40 ebay kit. I'm talking a factory HID setup.

They may not be HID's, but they do actually have headlights, so yes, you can see where the fuck you're going. Need them brighter? They have this cool thing called "high beams". And, yes, I've owned a car with HID's (factory) and really don't want to go through that headache again. Nothing but problems and they're expensive as hell to fix. Of course, this is all from my personal perspective...they look nifty, but they're completely unecessary, and in many cases a pain in the ass...I'm a simpleton, so I tend to like to keep things simple...

[sho220]

Originally Posted by jadewbj

Because there is no such thing as a Scion FR-S. It is a Toyota 86, the only reason it has a scion emblem on it is because they needed something to boost sales for the failing brand.

I changed mine because that is the way the car is supposed to be.

Derp...


jadewbj
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[jadewbj]

Originally Posted by sho220

Derp...


jadewbj
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2012
Drives: 2013 Whiteout Scion FRS
Location: Orlando FL
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I know I have a Scion FR-S and thought to call it a toyota 86 would be presumptuous of me since it is different from the 86 trim.

When people ask me what kind of car it is I tell them it is the new scion fr-s but everywhere else it is the Toyota 86 (no need to confuse more with gt86) so I switched the badges.

I hope to be able to mod it to match the JDM spec as much as possible.

My reasoning has little to do with "brand snobbery" as much as liking to being JDM spec. If I cared a out snobbery I would not have switched my Infiniti M45 to Nissan Gloria spec, Nissan being a lower brand than Infiniti.

I have always preferred to go by the JDM name for cars like instead of calling my Infiniti M45 by it's us moniker I would badge it as a Nissan Gloria (if I didn't like it debadged so much).