6MT vs Paddle shiftting Auto

[OldSkoolToys]

Originally Posted by whaap

There's nnothing magical about being able to shift gears. When I was learning only the very few wealthy could afford a car with an automatic transmission. Manual was the norm. A lot of you think you're pretty good with a a manual but I wonder how many of you could drive a manual without synchromesh!!

Very akin to driving without a clutch, speed matching the gears with the engine rev to get it to shift. I can do it, if a bit awkwardly.

[xantonin]

There is nothing magical about driving a manual. However, a lot of modern people can't do it very well. I don't know how good the majority drove manuals in the passed, but I'm sure there were a lot of people that did it horribly, or avoided driving because of it altogether.

There is one thing you can say about driving a manual though, and this may just be my opinion. Driving a manual is an art. Not everyone can appreciate it, and like most art, it doesn't appeal to everyone. On our generation, it's becoming a lost art, but I'm happy to see it being revived among the youth that can appreciate.

[OldSkoolToys]

Hahaha, thats what I don't get. Since I was like...3? All I ever wanted to do was drive a car, and shift its transmission manual style. I'd sit in my dad's 1990 Sentra XE when I was 7 and act like I was turning the wheel (wheel lock, ftl) and move the shifter between gears.

[whaap]

Originally Posted by xantonin

Driving a manual is an art.

I'll agree with that 100%. The majority of people driving today would be lost if they had to drive a car with a manual transmission. However, some of us fossils feel they've mastered the art of shifting gears manually and see nothing wrong with moving on to getting the same results in an easier, more efficient way.

[OldSkoolToys]

Originally Posted by whaap

I'll agree with that 100%. The majority of people driving today would be lost if they had to drive a car with a manual transmission. However, some of us fossils feel they've mastered the art of shifting gears manually and see nothing wrong with moving on to getting the same results in an easier, more efficient way.

aka, arthritis eh?

[whaap]

Originally Posted by OldSkoolToys

aka, arthritis eh?

LOL. No, I'm one of the lucky ones that don't have that problem.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by OldSkoolToys

You feel not shifting your own car has you more connected to it?

99% of the enthusiast world disagrees with you bud. I think you're what we'd consider an 'exception' to the rule, and a minority at that.

I've owned both an Automatic sports car (my mk3) and a manual (the AE86) and I would NEVER go back to the automatic. Infact, I sold the mk3 because it WAS an automatic. The manual keeps you more involved in your car, makes you concentrate harder, and develops you better as a driver.


So, learn to be quicker? If other people can do it, so can you.

500 years ago 99% of people thought the earth was flat. the automatic you refer to was an entirely different technology. i fail to see how shifting makes you focus more. its something you have to do aside from point the car where you want it and i dont see how it makes you a better driver.

sometimes other people cant do it either. there are many times when you have to sacrifice optimal gearing in order to keep on your line. if that wasnt the case nobody would care about torque on a road course

[serialk11r]

Hey comment about bikes:
Sound like you guys don't actually bike. The gears on a bike are mostly useless. Only expensive bikes with good derailleurs can practically shift a gear. For people like me with cheapo bikes, shifting down to start easier only means being frustrated when the chain gets stuck. The variation in speed on normal roads while biking isn't gear enough to use more than maybe 3 gears...I go higher when going down a slope, lower when going up, the same for anything flat or a slight grade, and I walk if its too steep.

I don't even have my drivers license yet (2 weeks lol), but I want to buy a stock shift car when I'm older because it looks amazingly fun!

[Exage]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

Hey comment about bikes:
Sound like you guys don't actually bike. The gears on a bike are mostly useless.

Sounds like you bike where there are no hills or mountains!

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by fatoni

500 years ago 99% of people thought the earth was flat. the automatic you refer to was an entirely different technology. i fail to see how shifting makes you focus more. its something you have to do aside from point the car where you want it and i dont see how it makes you a better driver.

sometimes other people cant do it either. there are many times when you have to sacrifice optimal gearing in order to keep on your line. if that wasnt the case nobody would care about torque on a road course

Has this gone to 'manual vs twin clutches'? Or is it between the two transmissions this car will be offered with?

If it's manual vs twin clutch, I've never driven a twin clutch but I acknowledge the tech is good, and sounds like driving GT5 style. Expensive though.

If we're talking about the manual vs auto this car will have, there is like an 85% (another made up statistic ) chance that it will just be a regular 6 speed torque converter auto (same as used in the IS?) with paddles. Which is a no-go for me.

[serialk11r]

Yea, if there are hills then obviously the gears become necessary, but my point about most bikes having crap derailleurs still holds. Everyone that I see riding a fancy bike uses them though, but even nicer bikes don't shift completely smoothly, it's not at all like a car.
Actually there are hills but I don't go ride in them lol.

In response to the above post, I think it's possible to make a torque converter auto with paddles work and feel right, if it has extremely aggressive lockup clutch programming and a "manual" mode that actually listens to you. I don't have firsthand experience, but I think the problem with a lot of these paddle shifting things is that they're not very responsive and the transmission likes to shift when you don't want it to...that can be corrected with a bit more effort put into the software if i'm not mistaken. That way it would be essentially a sequential gearbox with a torque converter to cover the need to start from a dead stop and situations where more torque is needed.

[Zaku]

Dang... At least I try to make it sound Civil Fatoni just really pushing the envelope here. It's quite entertaining. and Dimman I think it is that kind of auto. We're speculating it's the same one in the current miata, by Aisin.

I'm still trying to find time to go and get in one to test drive.... Whaap isn't your miata auto? is it one of the new ones with paddles?

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by Zaku

Dang... At least I try to make it sound Civil Fatoni just really pushing the envelope here. It's quite entertaining. and Dimman I think it is that kind of auto. We're speculating it's the same one in the current miata, by Aisin.

I'm still trying to find time to go and get in one to test drive.... Whaap isn't your miata auto? is it one of the new ones with paddles?

Try out an IS250/350, they've got paddles/buttons, afaik.

It's the torque converters, and shift delays in 'manual' mode that bug me more than the auto shifting.

[Zaku]

Originally Posted by Dimman

Try out an IS250/350, they've got paddles/buttons, afaik.

It's the torque converters, and shift delays in 'manual' mode that bug me more than the auto shifting.

Alright, I did drive a manual IS before and it was fun, not as fun as th last gen but it was fun. Alright I'll go try out some cars, sometime next week. Hmm...it's not the same kind they have on a 370z right? because I had fun driving those.