Somebody is bitter...

[Spaceywilly]

Originally Posted by 86'd

Second to last, the term journalist doesn't really exist as you all know it. It's not you either are or you aren't, its how colored the news is by opinion. It just happens to be colored a lot in this piece.

Journalism is an established science with principles that should be followed in order for the profession to maintain it's validity. Auto journalism on the whole has lost its way, and as a result it is fading into obscurity.

http://www.journalism.org/resources/principles/

[RRnold]

Originally Posted by Jordo!

Bitter schmitter.

He's right.

And I think more disappointed than bitter.



That observation in particular is painfully true. Even for a first model year, the car has had a LOT of problems.

BTW, if you were born after 1981, you are Gen Y.

+1

I don't get why everyone is all upset! Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

He likes the FR-S just not the partnership and I don't blame him either. The crappy paint from Subaru really bugs me. IIRC, wasn't it Toyota/Yamaha that got the D4S to work "correctly".

Most of you young cats don't remember Toyota from the 80's just like you don't remember when you could ride in the truck beds. Toyota had some good quality cars.


First things first: your humble author kind of loves the FR-S. I tried to buy one, even. I like the way it looks, inside and out. I like the proportions, the size, the interior. I like the sound of the boxer four. I even like the Scion brand and philosophy, enough so that I would pick an FR-S over a BRZ even though from my perspective the price difference between the two is nonexistent and the BRZ has more stuffs.

The problem comes when you make two comparisons. The first one, ironically enough, is to that ’84 Celica. That Celica had the famous 22R-E Toyota engine. Keep it maintained and throw a chain in it from time to time, and that Celica will last forever. The FR-S, by contrast, has a Subaru engine. I don’t want a Subaru engine in my FR-S. To some extent, that’s like putting a Northstar in a Lexus: hey, it’s boring, but now it will blow up and die! I don’t want to become an expert at swapping head gaskets. I don’t want to do all my maintenance from underneath the car. I want the engine from the dearly-departed last-gen Celica GT-S. Or the turbo engine from the All-Trac before that. In fact, I’d just rather have a JDM last-gen All-Trac, or the CALTY-designed bar-of-soap All-Trac which preceded it. Hell, give me a first-gen All-Trac. Know how much power the ’89 All-Trac had? As much as the FR-S. Where’s the progress? I want a Toyota engine in my Toyota. I want the car to last forever, with no hassle. It’s part of the promise of buying a Toyota. The FR-S, by those standards, breaks the promise. If I am willing to do my own head gaskets, I can buy an STi for similar money, crank the boost, and humiliate the FR-S both down the freeway and on the racetrack.

[Jordo!]

Originally Posted by RRnold

+1

I don't get why everyone is all upset! Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

Because FRZ fanboyism is like an orthodox religion and heretics will be stoned and/or immolated

[YukiHachiRoku]

Originally Posted by Jordo!

I believe 1981 is the last year anyone can make a legitimate claim to X, although culturally, you would have more in common with Y.

All the real X'ers are well into or approaching their 40's now.

FWIW, some researchers who look at archival data on attitudes and personality don't draw a distinction between X and Y. They lump us in as all equally self-centered and generally hopeless

So I thought this was a good read:


Generation X
Born: 1966-1976
Coming of Age: 1988-1994
Age in 2004: 28 to 38
Current Population: 41 million
Sometimes referred to as the “lost” generation, this was the first generation of “latchkey” kids, exposed to lots of daycare and divorce. Known as the generation with the lowest voting participation rate of any generation, Gen Xers were quoted by Newsweek as “the generation that dropped out without ever turning on the news or tuning in to the social issues around them.”

Gen X is often characterized by high levels of skepticism, “what’s in it for me” attitudes and a reputation for some of the worst music to ever gain popularity. Now, moving into adulthood William Morrow (Generations) cited the childhood divorce of many Gen Xers as “one of the most decisive experiences influencing how Gen Xers will shape their own families”.

Gen Xers are arguably the best educated generation with 29% obtaining a bachelor’s degree or higher (6% higher than the previous cohort). And, with that education and a growing maturity they are starting to form families with a higher level of caution and pragmatism than their parents demonstrated. Concerns run high over avoiding broken homes, kids growing up without a parent around and financial planning.

Generation Y, Echo Boomers or Millenniums
Born: 1977-1994
Coming of Age: 1998-2006
Age in 2004: 10 to 22
Current Population: 71 million
The largest cohort since the Baby Boomers, their high numbers reflect their births as that of their parent generation..the last of the Boomer Is and most of the Boomer II s. Gen Y kids are known as incredibly sophisticated, technology wise, immune to most traditional marketing and sales pitches...as they not only grew up with it all, they’ve seen it all and been exposed to it all since early childhood.

Gen Y members are much more racially and ethnically diverse and they are much more segmented as an audience aided by the rapid expansion in Cable TV channels, satellite radio, the Internet, e-zines, etc.

Gen Y are less brand loyal and the speed of the Internet has led the cohort to be similarly flexible and changing in its fashion, style consciousness and where and how it is communicated with.

Gen Y kids often raised in dual income or single parent families have been more involved in family purchases...everything from groceries to new cars. One in nine Gen Yers has a credit card co-signed by a parent.

Generation Z
Born: 1995-2012
Coming of Age: 2013-2020
Age in 2004: 0-9
Current Population: 23 million and growing rapidly
While we don’t know much about Gen Z yet...we know a lot about the environment they are growing up in. This highly diverse environment will make the grade schools of the next generation the most diverse ever. Higher levels of technology will make significant inroads in academics allowing for customized instruction, data mining of student histories to enable pinpoint diagnostics and remediation or accelerated achievement opportunities.

Gen Z kids will grow up with a highly sophisticated media and computer environment and will be more Internet savvy and expert than their Gen Y forerunners. More to come on Gen Z...stay tuned.

Next time we will start to take a more in-depth look at the most significant and impactful of the generational cohorts and what implications there might be for libraries and librarians.

[86'd]

Originally Posted by Spaceywilly

Journalism is an established science with principles that should be followed in order for the profession to maintain it's validity. Auto journalism on the whole has lost its way, and as a result it is fading into obscurity.

http://www.journalism.org/resources/principles/

Not to go entirely off topic, but there's the whole issue of language thrown in there too. I agree with striving for the truth, and integrity in a profession but anytime you're looking for the "practical" truth, you're going to have some dissenting voices.

We can't take any one man's word, any one corporation's word, any one public broadcasters word, just because of some journalistic code. Finding truth rests on our own shoulders, and this article in question just shows that the author has a chip on his.

[danthedirt]

He sounds like a Miata fan boy, and from running my car blog I've found Miata owners love to bash the FR-S and the like seeing it fail. As proven by the stats from said blog.

[mattles]

Originally Posted by jadewbj

‘The Toyota was the car everyone kept jumping into for “one last quick go”, and the one they got out of with the daftest smiles on their faces.’

Thats pretty much the summary of my ownership thus far, one last quick go followed by goofy smiling. Reminds me of when I bought my first Mazda Miata.

[Allch Chcar]

Originally Posted by danthedirt

He sounds like a Miata fan boy, and from running my car blog I've found Miata owners love to bash the FR-S and the like seeing it fail. As proven by the stats from said blog.

He's a Toyota fan boy. Read it again Dan.

[SnapOv3st3r]

Find it funny how he goes on about the Gen being faster by 1.2sec around the track and sighting that as pretty much the only reason for it being better. And then doesn't post lap times for the Miata but goes on to say how it's better too. And we all know the Twins are faster than the Miata.

[Symbiont]

No idea how old he is, but I honestly feel sorry for him.

What a bitter person.

[daiheadjai]

I enjoy TTAC, and sort of expected the negative review for the FR-S (Derek Kreindler, one of their main contributors, kinda telegraphed for weeks that he was disappointed with the car).

Personally, I think that some of the comments on that review reflect more poorly on the FR-S/BRZ owners/fans (of which I count myself as).
Things like driving feel are subjective, and everybody just has different priorities.
There's no need to get too personal or excited about that.

Obviously, Jack's and Derek's priorities do not match up with those of FR-S/BRZ owners.
Nothing wrong with that.
They don't like the car as much as you'd hoped? Nothing wrong with that either.

If you're like me, you don't have the time (or the money) to track your car regularly, so finding a reasonably enjoyable daily driver (with room for groceries and a couple friends in a pinch) makes something like the FR-S/BRZ a perfect fit.
Will it be a perfect fit for someone used to 300+hp rockets or supercars?
Probably not.

FWIW, they probably wanted to buck the trend of positive FR-S/BRZ reviews, and they did. And judging by the discussion that's generated, it probably wasn't a bad idea that they did.

[Jordo!]

Originally Posted by YukiHachiRoku

So I thought this was a good read:


Generation X
Born: 1966-1976
Coming of Age: 1988-1994
Age in 2004: 28 to 38
Current Population: 41 million
Sometimes referred to as the “lost” generation, this was the first generation of “latchkey” kids, exposed to lots of daycare and divorce. Known as the generation with the lowest voting participation rate of any generation, Gen Xers were quoted by Newsweek as “the generation that dropped out without ever turning on the news or tuning in to the social issues around them.”

Gen X is often characterized by high levels of skepticism, “what’s in it for me” attitudes and a reputation for some of the worst music to ever gain popularity. Now, moving into adulthood William Morrow (Generations) cited the childhood divorce of many Gen Xers as “one of the most decisive experiences influencing how Gen Xers will shape their own families”.

Gen Xers are arguably the best educated generation with 29% obtaining a bachelor’s degree or higher (6% higher than the previous cohort). And, with that education and a growing maturity they are starting to form families with a higher level of caution and pragmatism than their parents demonstrated. Concerns run high over avoiding broken homes, kids growing up without a parent around and financial planning.

Generation Y, Echo Boomers or Millenniums
Born: 1977-1994
Coming of Age: 1998-2006
Age in 2004: 10 to 22
Current Population: 71 million
The largest cohort since the Baby Boomers, their high numbers reflect their births as that of their parent generation..the last of the Boomer Is and most of the Boomer II s. Gen Y kids are known as incredibly sophisticated, technology wise, immune to most traditional marketing and sales pitches...as they not only grew up with it all, they’ve seen it all and been exposed to it all since early childhood.

Gen Y members are much more racially and ethnically diverse and they are much more segmented as an audience aided by the rapid expansion in Cable TV channels, satellite radio, the Internet, e-zines, etc.

Gen Y are less brand loyal and the speed of the Internet has led the cohort to be similarly flexible and changing in its fashion, style consciousness and where and how it is communicated with.

Gen Y kids often raised in dual income or single parent families have been more involved in family purchases...everything from groceries to new cars. One in nine Gen Yers has a credit card co-signed by a parent.

Generation Z
Born: 1995-2012
Coming of Age: 2013-2020
Age in 2004: 0-9
Current Population: 23 million and growing rapidly
While we don’t know much about Gen Z yet...we know a lot about the environment they are growing up in. This highly diverse environment will make the grade schools of the next generation the most diverse ever. Higher levels of technology will make significant inroads in academics allowing for customized instruction, data mining of student histories to enable pinpoint diagnostics and remediation or accelerated achievement opportunities.

Gen Z kids will grow up with a highly sophisticated media and computer environment and will be more Internet savvy and expert than their Gen Y forerunners. More to come on Gen Z...stay tuned.

Next time we will start to take a more in-depth look at the most significant and impactful of the generational cohorts and what implications there might be for libraries and librarians.

Hmm. Interesting -- different cut off dates than I was familiar with. The "Z" gen I've heard of before, but didn;t think that was widely accepted as yet.

Source? Thanks for sharing.:happy0180:

[eriktherod]

I agree that everyone is entitled to their own opinions, even if terribly misguided and biased. However, everyone is also entitled to their opinions about someone else's opinion!

When someone's "analysis" of things starts naming untrue "facts", that's where I start to discredit. Some things are subjective, such as the comfort and feel of things. Some people like the interior of the FR-S/BRZ, others feel it is lacking. However, having a terrible gearbox can only be so subjective before it becomes mechanically true and real (in the case of the GC).

I found a lot of his "review" to be very contradictory. He says he likes and understands the Scion brand. He then says it's a car for a bunch of teenagers that their daddy bought them and still live in their basement. It's almost like he's angry that car appeals to certain people, is in the brand that targets them (Scion), and performs that well while also looking so good. Yet.. it doesn't perform THAT good, after all it's still a "sled".

I feel like his review is taking a very affordable car and trying to call it out as "not being as good as something 20-50% more expensive." How is that a fault of the car? If Toyota/Subaru were allotted that same extra, they probably could have cranked out even more.

It's like people saying, "well, it's no vette". No shit sherlock, it also doesn't cost 40-60k brand new.

[dem00n]

This topic shows the one thing i really dislike about a lot of car guys, how they typically stick with one brand of cars or really just one car in general and bash other cars that are equal or somewhat greater/lesser. I love all cars truly and i find it more difficult everyday to find someone to share that with.