Getting Sloppy With Age

[twistednoble]

15 that's crossed the 120k mile mark and still trending steadily upwards.

Over the last 10k I've noticed that the driveline lash is starting to get worse and I'm getting more NVH than I used to have. I put the poly subframe toppers and diff inserts in way back when it only had 40k and now it almost feels like it's back to the stock levels of slop. I've also got gear whine that's getting transmitted to the cabin now too, right around 83 mph it starts to howl pretty good. Previously it was quietish aside from reverse being a bit noise. I also will sometimes get a strange loud resonance when decelerating in 3rd or 2nd.

Anyone else have well traveled cars and have an idea of what suspension parts like to wear out on these cars that can cause those kinds of issues?

What's the lifetime on the engine and trans mounts?

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by twistednoble

What's the lifetime on the engine and trans mounts?

For what it's worth my '13 had over 230K miles on it when I traded it in and all these parts were still going strong, no issues. It was an AT though.

[twistednoble]

Imported TRD mounts from Japan and installed them. Fixed about 80% of it but I've got another 20% somewhere. The trans mount appeared to be the worst, no obvious tearing but I could deflect it pretty significantly with just my hands. I suspect the carrier is getting sloppy but that might have to wait for a while. Maybe a JXB carrier is in the future but I've got other issues.

While laying on my back I could see that the forward bushing on the right LCA is tearing. Control arms are in the future I guess, the ball joint has 140k on it otherwise I'd probably consider an energy suspension kit.

I've also got some 24 BRZ cast off struts to put on as well. It was cheaper than one new strut and topper from the dealer so I'm coming out ahead. If I was a bit smarter I might have considered Bilsteins but I purchased faster than I researched. I've got some good stress cracking going on with the strut toppers; they made it 140k so I figure they don't owe me anything.

It's started feeling terrible when going around curves so I figure I should toss some parts and see where it gets me. Does not feel planted at all in fast curves with the summer tires on. I do wonder if the poly sway bar bushings may have worn out (over 100k on them), the original endlinks probably aren't helping either.

[Teseo]

Shifter bushing?

[Wally86]

You made me want to find that thread that talked about refreshing the suspension at 100k that CGS and a bunch of people chimed in on but I can't find it. So... second best links:

https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=142230

https://www.ft86club.com/forums/show....php?p=3353424

[twistednoble]

Originally Posted by Teseo

Shifter bushing?

Have you replaced those and did they make a big difference? I wouldn't think that it would change much about the lash, more the shift feel since it's just the tripod.

[twistednoble]

Originally Posted by Wally86

You made me want to find that thread that talked about refreshing the suspension at 100k that CGS and a bunch of people chimed in on but I can't find it. So... second best links:

https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=142230

https://www.ft86club.com/forums/show....php?p=3353424

Yea I started there but it more came across as an exhaustive list of things that could potentially wear out rather than a "we generally see XX miles out of these or XX if you track it, and when they fail it usually feels/sounds/smells/acts/tastes like XYZ"

I ended up falling back on looking at things and replacing whatever looks or feels worn out.

[twistednoble]

Made some more forward progress.

Pillaged a couple complete cast off 24 BRZ struts and control arms with less than 10k on them. Pretty reasonable for 100 bucks a corner I was doing struts, and the control arms were half the cost of new and in great shape.

Then I made a big Toyota order for new front end links, belt tensioner, and various bolts in addition to new rad hoses for the coolant change I keep putting off. The battery hold down is also extremely reasonable, mine was getting eaten alive and it was less than ten bucks for a new one. Then it was just a whiteline order for some new sway bar bushings and a rock auto order for idlers and the rear end links.

My first misstep might have been with the control arms.
I was expecting the ball joints to be fairly worn and getting close to needing replacement. In reality I probably could have replaced the bushings and let them ride. The joints were still fairly stiff and in good condition for a 140k car.

Everything went generally smoothly over the course of a weekend. I pulled the sway bar and it's subframe bracket out and cleaned and painted them. They both had paint peeling off all the welds and rust below. The rear bar had a good about of rock chips that had rusted and needed paint as well. I also popped in the 14mm crash bolts intending to put a little camber on the front. The end links were decently pleasant to remove, the did require working back and forth and pbblaster, but they didn't need to outright be cut off like the Hondas I've worked on.

On the test ride the car was kind of darty and I started wondering about tie rods. That was later cleared up when I accidentally got an alignment and the car dramatically improved. It'd been 100k since the last alignment so not altogether unexpected that things were a little bit out. The improvement was enough that I knocked tie rods off the list for now.

Other things that were noticed. Have some light cracking started on the rear diff bushings. My impression is that those are an extreme pain to change though so I'm not sure what I'll do about them. I might have also gained a slight oil weep to the center diff seal to go with my passenger seal leak. The lower bush on the knuckle is starting to crack as well. Starting to debate if I want to get an energy suspension kit and be done with it.
The axle boots are also starting to get rough on the exterior, anyone ever put on a split bushing or do you all just wait for failure and replace wholesale?

The driveline lash isn't quite fixed, but I'm left wondering if the source is worn diff bushings or worn out whiteline toppers.

So, so far things worn out at 140k:
Struts
Control arm front bushings
Front and rear end links
Front sway bar bushings (whiteline 100k miles on them)

Things not actually worn out:
Front ball joints
Front control arm rear bushing
Tie Rods
Rear sway bar bushings

Did a serp belt replacement while I was in there. Seems like everyone has bad luck with the idlers from what I've seen reported. Mine were noisy and definitely didn't have any grease left in them, but they covered the distance. The metal ones I would say had a concerning amount of play in them. I ended up just putting new NSKs in with a OE new tensioner and a bando belt.

Last surprise was that one corned of the rear brakes is just shy of metal to metal. The other corner was getting low but not as bad. Suppose that's what I get for not checking both sides when I changed to summer tires. Gonna get some new brembo blanks and ceramic pads to slam home. The old stuff owes me nothing, I'm pretty sure they're OE and they went 140k including a few track days.

[smackrel]

Are far as the serpentine system is concerned... Are there 2 idler, and 2 tensioner pulleys that would need to be replaced if you were dong all wear items while replacing a belt?

[twistednoble]

Originally Posted by smackrel

Are far as the serpentine system is concerned... Are there 2 idler, and 2 tensioner pulleys that would need to be replaced if you were dong all wear items while replacing a belt?

No, there are two smooth metal idler pulleys, one ribbed plastic idler pulley and then the tensioner and it's attached pulley.

All of the idlers were NSKs and the tensioner is either a VNE or SKP.

For idlers you need two 80SPF0345, and one 70SRPV0312DD.

I went with an OE tensioner SU003-00498, no sense in not getting the genuine one when a VNE is $75 anyway.

[twistednoble]

Driveline lash started getting worse. I think the new mounts put more load on the other worn driveline bushings and beat down the rest of the tired stuff. I had whiteline KDT925 inserts in but it really didn't seem to be doing me any favors after 100k miles. Probably only so much they can do to make up for sacked rubber.

Put in the whiteline KDT924 full bushings, highly recommend not trying this unless you have a lift. I used a friend's lift and the LHS one was a bastard and a half to motivate. Couldn't imagine ever getting it moving if I was doing it on my back on stands.

Unfortunately I still have some lash somewhere. While I was working things I noticed that even with the parking brake applied I could turn the driveshaft about half a rotation. Is that normal allowable play between the ujoints, diff, and axles? Or have I found my next problem?

Regreased my clutch pivot the next day since I had the creak for a while. Nice and quiet once again.

We're up to 150k miles now, needs a trans oil change in 5k. I think I'll probably sell it off a bit before 200k, not quite sure what it's worth. I figure at 200k the FA20 engine doesn't owe me anything and it's the work transport. Can't afford (more like don't want to pay) a major towing bill if it blows on the road to a site.

I've been eyeing the GR Corollas lately, I think that'd be right up my alley if I can find a nice low mileage one.

[twistednoble]

Oh yea, almost forgot.

Couple months back I gave it it's slightly overdue coolant change. Decided to throw hoses at it to prevent any funny business down the road in addition to a new couple bottles of Subaru juice.

And the brakes that I mentioned in that last post. 140k is a good service life for the OE pads. Wish I could have found the slotted Brembos or Delcos in stock somewhere to match the front, but no such luck.

[Packofcrows]

You're my hero. I decided to start small on refreshing car (just hit 90k on '14) and wasn't too sure what to check for or where to start. You offered good guidance.

I just replaced 12 year old bulbs all around after few close calls where I wasn't spotted on road and nearly hit. Bulb swap made such a difference! Especially at night.

Next, did coolant flush, brakes, inside filter was ok but meh, refreshed fluid reservoirs, fixed tailight condensation, paint chips filled due to concern on rust developing, redid tint on doors and replaced driver side sun-visor that was worn and falling apart. Then, gave whole exterior some love by detailing. Discovered Hyper-seal and forgot about applying it day before. Leaned on rear of car and slipped. Love it. Very dust repellent.

Present agenda is to begin by doing MAF cleaning, throttle body cleaning and o ring gasket, TRD reusable filter clean and re-oil, PCV (never done) and tube, will replace old worn battery terminals, replacing front turn signal housings as they are very sun beaten and my attempt at cleaning and polishing just made it worse multiple times. Then, jumping to bushings and suspension plus need to do transmission and differential. Urgh, forgot rodents got in and chewed my wiper reservoir tube and I need to remove bumper in near future and fix that... may as well save for new headlights and just do everything together.

Love working on this car. It's so friendly. Reminds me of old Toyota pickups and the AE86. It doesn't feel like a chore. More like a privilege.

Cheers.

[twistednoble]

Originally Posted by Packofcrows

You're my hero. I decided to start small on refreshing car (just hit 90k on '14) and wasn't too sure what to check for or where to start. You offered good guidance.

I just replaced 12 year old bulbs all around after few close calls where I wasn't spotted on road and nearly hit. Bulb swap made such a difference! Especially at night.

Next, did coolant flush, brakes, inside filter was ok but meh, refreshed fluid reservoirs, fixed tailight condensation, paint chips filled due to concern on rust developing, redid tint on doors and replaced driver side sun-visor that was worn and falling apart. Then, gave whole exterior some love by detailing. Discovered Hyper-seal and forgot about applying it day before. Leaned on rear of car and slipped. Love it. Very dust repellent.

Present agenda is to begin by doing MAF cleaning, throttle body cleaning and o ring gasket, TRD reusable filter clean and re-oil, PCV (never done) and tube, will replace old worn battery terminals, replacing front turn signal housings as they are very sun beaten and my attempt at cleaning and polishing just made it worse multiple times. Then, jumping to bushings and suspension plus need to do transmission and differential. Urgh, forgot rodents got in and chewed my wiper reservoir tube and I need to remove bumper in near future and fix that... may as well save for new headlights and just do everything together.

Love working on this car. It's so friendly. Reminds me of old Toyota pickups and the AE86. It doesn't feel like a chore. More like a privilege.

Cheers.

Thanks, glad to be of assistance.

When you go suspension I would advise Bilsteins and new strut bushings. Now that the 2nd gen struts have worn in I'm not too impressed with them, I don't think I'm a fan of the increased spring rate. Less compliance over road bumps and it doesn't seem to settle around corners as well as it used to.

I've been leaving the engine well enough alone beyond regular maintenance (and I replaced the PCV at 110k). I figure if it has a problem I'll fix it when it becomes apparent. I've got a timing cover leak that I've been ignoring for about 50k now since I only lose like a quart between changes when it's properly leaking in the cold season. During the warm seasons it slows way down and might not even need top off between changes. I do wonder about a valve adjustment and if it would benefit from it. Its starting to be a bit of a harder start and it acts like my bikes when the valves start getting tight. Could also be the old battery though, that's up for replacement before the winter.

I don't mind it for maintenance, it's better than some but the flat engine has it's drawbacks. Definitely a lot better than anything transverse mounted though.