2022+ Ecu cracked?!

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Lantanafrs2

Of course once tuning software is released, the subject becomes why you won't be able to tune your car.

It is a real consideration and worth the discussion.
Just hiding in a corner and whispering "I don't want to know so go away" won't make the crackdown stop.
Be a long time yet before it really truly becomes a matter of can't tune your car though.

[OkieSnuffBox]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

It is a real consideration and worth the discussion.
Just hiding in a corner and whispering "I don't want to know so go away" won't make the crackdown stop.
Be a long time yet before it really truly becomes a matter of can't tune your car though.

And as we are seeing with the 2nd gen, there really isn't a lot to gain with tuning anymore.

I only want an UEL header, because I like the ridiculous sound it makes. Not for the 13/lb ft of tq on E85 it will make at 4500 rpms.

[pope]

Originally Posted by NoHaveMSG

Just hiring bodies isn't a how though. Without probable cause a crime is being committed it is not legal for law enforcement here to search you. If there are no legal provisions for them to enforce laws then they just hired a bunch of janitors.

The EPA could work in coordination with a federal law enforcement agency (e.g. the FBI) and use sales records (from all the businesses that have been targeted) as probable cause to search (inspect) the vehicles of their customers. Vehicles deemed non-compliant could be seized and ultimately destroyed since modifying, tampering with, or defeating emissions controls is illegal.

Further, if the SEMA sponsored legislation known as the RPM Act gets passed, it only protects manufacturers of products for dedicated motorsports modified vehicles. End users operating modified vehicles on the street would still be in violation and subject to enforcement. Although, without data collected from distribution companies, identifying potentially illegal vehicles becomes more difficult.

[BioRebel]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Trying to follow the laws is like walking through a maze. Where something may look like a loophole another section twists around and closes it. The law is an not a couple of lines of print but about 1,200 pages. I have to deal with the industrial end of it (it is not just cars and trucks) everyday and still struggle with the damn thing.
What it boils down to is that NO alteration of the stock system is permitted whether it changes the emission or not so technically there is no such thing as a legal aftermarket tune.
Trucks are hit harder because they are more obvious to the general public and let's the EPA say "See we are doing something". Cars will get their turn.

It's verbatim the guidelines shared by the EPA.

Trucks are getting hit harder because many of those mods are "roll coal", and the explicit goal is to cause more smog.

[VoltsFRS2013]

Originally Posted by OkieSnuffBox

there really isn't a lot to gain with tuning anymore.

Im assuming you mean this in correlation to NA vehicles / twins to begin with? Because for just about every other platform that is FI, Downpipes, Supporting Modifications, Tune almost double power numbers.

I think it's just a little bit optimistic to begin with to expect a 2.0 or 2.4L 4cyl motor to be woken up and turned into a different machine with a different piece of pipe and a tune. As you stated though, the gains are such a marginal joke that I cant comprehend tossing a warranty away over +15 torque on a first model year new car.

[Midnightsky]

Originally Posted by VoltsFRS2013

Im assuming you mean this in correlation to NA vehicles / twins to begin with? Because for just about every other platform that is FI, Downpipes, Supporting Modifications, Tune almost double power numbers.

I think it's just a little bit optimistic to begin with to expect a 2.0 or 2.4L 4cyl motor to be woken up and turned into a different machine with a different piece of pipe and a tune. As you stated though, the gains are such a marginal joke that I cant comprehend tossing a warranty away over +15 torque on a first model year new car.

It's not just the power tho, a tune can eliminate things like rev hang which is a characteristic of emissions regulations. Smoother power delivery, possibly flatten out that torque dip a little more too. It's not just adding more power or torque, and that's where everyone gets caught up.

[Lantanafrs2]

People are gonna tune the shit out of these things

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by pope

The EPA could work in coordination with a federal law enforcement agency (e.g. the FBI) and use sales records (from all the businesses that have been targeted) as probable cause to search (inspect) the vehicles of their customers. Vehicles deemed non-compliant could be seized and ultimately destroyed since modifying, tampering with, or defeating emissions controls is illegal.

Further, if the SEMA sponsored legislation known as the RPM Act gets passed, it only protects manufacturers of products for dedicated motorsports modified vehicles. End users operating modified vehicles on the street would still be in violation and subject to enforcement. Although, without data collected from distribution companies, identifying potentially illegal vehicles becomes more difficult.

That is fair enough. I still don't buy that that would be the way they would do it but it is a more likely possibility.

[PulsarBeeerz]

Originally Posted by Lantanafrs2

People are gonna tune the shit out of these things

I don’t doubt that for a second. They are responding well without the need of E85.

[VoltsFRS2013]

Originally Posted by Midnightsky

It's not just the power tho, a tune can eliminate things like rev hang which is a characteristic of emissions regulations. Smoother power delivery, possibly flatten out that torque dip a little more too. It's not just adding more power or torque, and that's where everyone gets caught up.

I completely agree with you. My 13' FRS and 18' 86 were both tuned.

The FRS the whole FBO headers bla bla, the 86 just stage one to eliminate the cold start.

Rev hang is obnoxious, cold start I dont mind because it serves a purpose and I dont have neighbors who would kill me nor is my GR that loud as it only has an axleback.

Coming from the last car to this car, I don't really have any complains with the way torque comes on in this platform. I know it can be improved upon. But again, for me it just falls down to is it worth that warranty away.

At least for me, I wouldn't consider it

[OkieSnuffBox]

Originally Posted by VoltsFRS2013

Im assuming you mean this in correlation to NA vehicles / twins to begin with? Because for just about every other platform that is FI, Downpipes, Supporting Modifications, Tune almost double power numbers.

I think it's just a little bit optimistic to begin with to expect a 2.0 or 2.4L 4cyl motor to be woken up and turned into a different machine with a different piece of pipe and a tune. As you stated though, the gains are such a marginal joke that I cant comprehend tossing a warranty away over +15 torque on a first model year new car.

No, I'm talking about C8 Corvettes even though I specifically said the 2nd gen cars in my post.

And yes, the reason a "tune" on an FI car makes more power is because you can just turn up the boost and fuel to match it.


As for the new car, people were hoping to see the same kind of gains, with the same mods as we did on the first gen. But the car was much better optimized from the factory vs the first gen, so the gains aren't there.

[DocWalt]

"Bro we're going to get 250whp on E85!"

lol yeah no.

[VoltsFRS2013]

Originally Posted by OkieSnuffBox

No, I'm talking about C8 Corvettes even though I specifically said the 2nd gen cars in my post.

And yes, the reason a "tune" on an FI car makes more power is because you can just turn up the boost and fuel to match it.


As for the new car, people were hoping to see the same kind of gains, with the same mods as we did on the first gen. But the car was much better optimized from the factory vs the first gen, so the gains aren't there.

The header design on the prior generation car was terrible, it was heavily revised on this generation. There is not a bunch of slack leftover with the OEM headers this time around. Even I knew that months before upgrading haha.

One thing I tell any noobie to our platform or considering the platform is that if you dont think you'd enjoy the car stock, don't buy it. There are no miracle bolt ons parts or a tune that will make this car SIGNIFICANTLY different. Slightly better, sure. Marginally better for a whole lot of money in return.

Controversial opinion but If you want more power, just get a 2.0T Supra imo. They're hitting a price point now that makes a lot of sense. Premium GR's are around $35k OTD, I have seen 2.0 Supras low 40s. Double the torque of our car, front mid engine, 8 speed lighting fast auto, tunability to make it even quicker. 2,850lbs (GR) vs 3,175 (2.0 Supra)

I understand liking the aesthetics of the 22+ twins and also liking manual. However, there are already cars out there that do what people are trying to be optimistic and force these cars into doing. And when they hit that wall, they'll complain about how unreliable they are just like we've seen for the past 10 years with the prior generation.

[OkieSnuffBox]

Originally Posted by VoltsFRS2013

The header design on the prior generation car was terrible, it was heavily revised on this generation. There is not a bunch of slack leftover with the OEM headers this time around. Even I knew that months before upgrading haha.

One thing I tell any noobie to our platform or considering the platform is that if you dont think you'd enjoy the car stock, don't buy it. There are no miracle bolt ons parts or a tune that will make this car SIGNIFICANTLY different. Slightly better, sure. Marginally better for a whole lot of money in return.

Controversial opinion but If you want more power, just get a 2.0T Supra imo. They're hitting a price point now that makes a lot of sense. Premium GR's are around $35k OTD, I have seen 2.0 Supras low 40s. Double the torque of our car, front mid engine, 8 speed lighting fast auto, tunability to make it even quicker. 2,850lbs (GR) vs 3,175 (2.0 Supra)

I understand liking the aesthetics of the 22+ twins and also liking manual. However, there are already cars out there that do what people are trying to be optimistic and force these cars into doing. And when they hit that wall, they'll complain about how unreliable they are just like we've seen for the past 10 years with the prior generation.

$4k more at $48k buys you a Camaro SS 1LE. 455hp V8, engine/trans/diff coolers for track work, E-Diff, Brembos at all 4 corners, Recaros, Magne ride shocks, etc. I test drove one a few years ago, monster car. But I couldn't justify it since it likely wouldn't see the track or street often. I've had my '23 for almost 3 months and still haven't even cracked 600 miles.

The 4 cylinder Supra at $44k isn't very compelling, to me anyway.

And if someone really wants cheap thrills, just buy a liter bike.