Street driving Re: Torque dip

[ed209]

not as much as it should be...

[Nepenthe]

Originally Posted by pr086

at the lowest part of the dip how much torque is it making?

Google "Scion FR-S dyno" and hit Images. From 3700 to 4200 it's on the floor at about 122. It makes that much at 2400 and 7300 as well.

The 2007 Si on the same dyno made about 122 to 118 in the 3700 to 4200 range (the FR-S beats it everywhere else often by double digit percentages save for the very top where the Si holds on a little longer).

[empower-auto]

The torque figure itself is a non issue for me - the physical effect of that dip is the problem.

[CBR600RR]

Originally Posted by atledreier

I see it much more as a low-end torque boost than a midrange dip, to be honest. Maybe the Subaru engineers are so good to us we get spoilt?

this is a good way to look on the bright side.

the dip still feels dissapointing when just city driving. of course if you are wringing its neck you never feel the torque dip because the revs never get that low. if city driving it is almost better to not let it reach the dip area. it is like there is a certain rev range that is 'un-usable' (for lack of a better word)

[Nepenthe]

Experiment: When I left for the day yesterday, I set my rev alert to 3300 and turned on the audible buzzer. Here are the variables:

--I weigh 155ish and had minimal other weight in the car (just my laptop)
--it was 108 degrees yesterday on the way home (82 this morning), AC was on for the afternoon drive home (not for this morning)
--my car has 1300 miles and is completely stock
--I drove down a stoplight to stoplight boulevard (45), some twisty backroads (30), and a residential thoroughfare (35 and 40)
--I paid attention not to hit the buzzer (3300) but used throttle position indiscriminately (I never hit the buzzer)
--I drive an Automatic and used Snow Mode in D the entire time (no manual shifting)

The result: this car has AMPLE torque and power to keep up with and usually beat all normal street traffic around here before touching 3300. It doesn't appear to me that you could want for more power than revving up to 3300 provides, for normal street driving. I believe for normal street driving, which involves necessity and other motorists, where I'm avoiding illegal speeds and antisocial douchebaggery, I would never need to exceed 3300. Great torque down there. Personally I'm fine with stopping in the 2300 range most of the time.

[Imti]

Originally Posted by Nepenthe

this car has AMPLE torque and power to keep up with and usually beat all normal street traffic around here before touching 3300. It doesn't appear to me that you could want for more power than revving up to 3300 provides, for normal street driving. I believe for normal street driving, which involves necessity and other motorists, where I'm avoiding illegal speeds and antisocial douchebaggery, I would never need to exceed 3300. Great torque down there. Personally I'm fine with stopping in the 2300 range most of the time.

[Sasquachulator]

Originally Posted by ruskymx

I drove a 2ZZ Celica GTS and they were like a 1ZZ Corolla until you hit VVTL-i at high RPM, not sure what exactly the RPM that took place though. The FRS is much better for everyday driving than the GTS was. The GTS reminds me of my 98 YZ250 2 smoker the way the power is delivered.

Ruskymx

All small NA torqueless wonder engines perform in this manner, unless boosted.

2ZZGE has got nothing until around 4000RPM when its like "oh theres some power!" and then again when VVTLI kicks in (anywhere between 6200-6800rpm depending on car) and youre all like 'WHOOA VTEC KICKED IN YO!!!" but that ends just as quickly as it starts (Since redline is 8500rpm).

Do you guys come from driving V8's or somethin for this to feel relatively weak or need to shift at like 5000rpm in city driving to feel normal power???
In city driving i shift at like 3000-4000rpm cuz thas usually where i can shift the smoothest (without feeling the gear change) and i dont need more power than that to get off from the stoplights....i aint racing that grandma in the SUV next to me.....

Again i got a 2ZZGE, so i know all about torqueless wonders. Ive probably got the most torqueless economy car performance engine this side of a Honda.

[Tbomb 25]

I say rev it some of you are acting like your gonna hurt it....be glad your not a NA Miata owner it was atleast 5k....or you wernt going anywhere even padestrian quick even bicycles would pass me...lol

[Tbomb 25]

I dont have a problem with casual driving in this car when i drove it....i thought it had a pretty impressive torque curve for NA motor this size.....

[demby123]

Originally Posted by 7thgear

i don't understand the concern with the torque dip

if you're racing, you shouldn't drop below 4000

if you're on the street, you shouldn't go above 4000

95% of street driving is done at something silly like 60 horsepower and 30% throttle

really guys, non issue, unless you're a dyno-graph connoisseur and are on a magical quest to find the most perfect graph

This... My around town shift points in my ae86 are 1700rpm (cruising in 5th at around 35-40) to 3000rpm. spirited driving points are from 3500-5000rpm because the 4ac just makes noise from 5k to redline....

[RavenFR-S]

Originally Posted by Nepenthe

The result: this car has AMPLE torque and power to keep up with and usually beat all normal street traffic around here before touching 3300. It doesn't appear to me that you could want for more power than revving up to 3300 provides, for normal street driving. I believe for normal street driving, which involves necessity and other motorists, where I'm avoiding illegal speeds and antisocial douchebaggery, I would never need to exceed 3300. Great torque down there. Personally I'm fine with stopping in the 2300 range most of the time.

I concur with this. I'm in a M/T and I tend to shift around 2K on a daily driving basis. :happy0180:

[miatascooter]

There is nothing wrong with buying a car for it's looks. Or just to have the latest thing. But to those of you who are shifting at 2000 - 2500 rpm, you are really missing out on a lot of what you paid your money for.

OTOH, you guys will be greatly appreciated by the second owners of your cars.