Charcoal intake filter removal testing & RESULTS

[CincyJohn]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

And saying "up to" as a qualifier is just a cop out. Could be .0001HP and that means it is "up to" 10.
Removing a thin carbon filter does NOT give you 10HP as the video states end of story.
I have already said several times that the stock set up is excellent and aftermarket is not required but that is all ignored because everybody is so focused on the fact I simply stated there was no 10HP gain to be had.
But everybody is welcome to pretend that it does magically make 10 if it makes them feel better.

Or other people can ignore that at about 4500 rpms there is about a 10hp difference between the charcoal filter set-up and the charcoal filter-less set up while also ignoring that the manufacturer only chose to install the charcoal filter on cars where they thought emissions requirements required them to do it.

Compared to some of the lame ass, stupid and expensive mods people have detailed on these forums and on YouTube, this is one of the least "click-baity" videos I have seen. Not only that, I think the video does a tremendous job of explaining exactly where the gains come from and goes the poster goes out of his way NOT to overstate them.

[spcmafia]

In retrospect, a tittle that lists 10Hp gain is more likely to reach the audience, than saying 4. Which, fair point to the creator, mentions that it would really be 4hp after the margin of error. Out of a 200HP dyno, it should be like, what, 6 give or take? taking equipment, weather, etc?

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by CincyJohn

Or other people can ignore that at about 4500 rpms there is about a 10hp difference between the charcoal filter set-up and the charcoal filter-less set up while also ignoring that the manufacturer only chose to install the charcoal filter on cars where they thought emissions requirements required them to do it.

Compared to some of the lame ass, stupid and expensive mods people have detailed on these forums and on YouTube, this is one of the least "click-baity" videos I have seen. Not only that, I think the video does a tremendous job of explaining exactly where the gains come from and goes the poster goes out of his way NOT to overstate them.

In his own words from the video "Overall about 5HP and in some spots almost 10"

In "some spots" does not equal a 10HP gain.

To your point of them installing only where they think they need one even the cars where it is not used are only rated 4HP more. How come not 10?

Agree the video does a great job of not overstating the gains so not so sure why everybody is so hung up that there is a free 10HP when he is very clear there isn't. Only the title is clickbait not the content.

[CincyJohn]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

In his own words from the video "Overall about 5HP and in some spots almost 10"

In "some spots" does not equal a 10HP gain.

To your point of them installing only where they think they need one even the cars where it is not used are only rated 4HP more. How come not 10?

Agree the video does a great job of not overstating the gains so not so sure why everybody is so hung up that there is a free 10HP when he is very clear there isn't. Only the title is clickbait not the content.

You are absolutely 100% correct. You win.

[ROFL it's Waffle]

What'd I miss? LOL

"5hp average, 10hp peak gains" on top of 228 stock power. What is that exactly??? 5hp is 2.19% gains, 10hp is 4.39% gains.

Unless you're operating a boosted setup and pushing massive HP (let's say 400+ for discussion), you won't notice anything besides placebo with the charcoal filter there or not. I'll bet a gallon of real maple syrup on it.

Even 2% to 4% gains on 400+ hp (8 to 16 hp with the same naturally aspirated assumption) is probably not noticeable either, but now we're talking totally different variables with forced induction.

Let it go, Elsa, let it gooooo

[CincyJohn]

Originally Posted by ROFL it's Waffle

What'd I miss? LOL

"5hp average, 10hp peak gains" on top of 228 stock power. What is that exactly??? 5hp is 2.19% gains, 10hp is 4.39% gains.

Unless you're operating a boosted setup and pushing massive HP (let's say 400+ for discussion), you won't notice anything besides placebo with the charcoal filter there or not. I'll bet a gallon of real maple syrup on it.

Even 2% to 4% gains on 400+ hp (8 to 16 hp with the same naturally aspirated assumption) is probably not noticeable either, but now we're talking totally different variables with forced induction.

Let it go, Elsa, let it gooooo

Agreed. 5-10 hp here, 10 -20 hp there, none of it makes any real difference so why bother? I mean so what if a tune only gets you 15 hp? Placebo. And what if headers only get you 10? Placebo. And who cares if e85 only gets you another 10? Placebo.

I mean 15 + 10+ 10?? That's just stupid placebo. Why would anyone do that?

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by CincyJohn

Agreed. 5-10 hp here, 10 -20 hp there, none of it makes any real difference so why bother? I mean so what if a tune only gets you 15 hp? Placebo. And what if headers only get you 10? Placebo. And who cares if e85 only gets you another 10? Placebo.

I mean 15 + 10+ 10?? That's just stupid placebo. Why would anyone do that?

But the gains are not always stackable nor liner. This is a bad bad assumption to make.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by CincyJohn

You are absolutely 100% correct. You win.

Not trying to "win" anything just simply make a point that some wish to ignore or argue is not valid.

[CincyJohn]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

But the gains are not always stackable nor liner. This is a bad bad assumption to make.

And sometimes they are exponential - especially when a tune can take advantage of extra flow into and out of the engine and doesn't care about things like average mpg.

As I said, at the end of the day, if you are a person that is going to try to get as much hp and tq out of your NA engine in a way that is inexpensive (free in fact) and that is more or less manufacturer rubber stamped (they don't even put it on cars in Japan and Australia), you should definitely watch the video and do this mod. In fact, it is likely when generic tunes come out that they will be specifically tuned with this mod having been done.

Of course, if you are a Cheerios-pee'r, and you just want to poo-poo everything said and done, then by all means, keep on posting how the video that says that taking this out results in peak HP gains of close to 10 and average hp gains of close to 5!!! It's kind of funny given the number of utterly useless, stupid and pointless threads on this website, you and your buddy Waffle decide to pee all over one that is actually valuable AND useful.

Also, I definitely think you and Waffle SHOULD NOT remove the charcoal filters from your second gens. Oh wait ...

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by CincyJohn

And sometimes they are exponential - especially when a tune can take advantage of extra flow into and out of the engine and doesn't care about things like average mpg.

As I said, at the end of the day, if you are a person that is going to try to get as much hp and tq out of your NA engine in a way that is inexpensive (free in fact) and that is more or less manufacturer rubber stamped (they don't even put it on cars in Japan and Australia), you should definitely watch the video and do this mod. In fact, it is likely when generic tunes come out that they will be specifically tuned with this mod having been done.

Of course, if you are Cheerio-pee'r, and you just want to poo-poo everything said and done, then by all means, keep on posting how the video that says that taking this out results in peak HP gains of close to 10 and average hp gains of close to 5, by all means, keep on posting!!! It's kind of funny given the number of utterly useless, stupid and pointless threads on this website, you and your buddy Waffle decide to pee all over one that is actually valuable AND useful.

Also, I definitely think you and Waffle SHOULD NOT remove the charcoal filters from your second gens. Oh wait ...

Keep on believin'
A high point in the middle of the RPM range is not a "peak" it is just a blip.
Just ignore what they really say in the video and throw your own interpretation on it that is fine.

Oh now we are not allowed to discuss subjects because we don't own a 22? Really?
Figures.

[spcmafia]

These filthy 1st gens owners daring to comment on the 2nd gen absolute master race high kingdom. They have no idea what is like to tune and make 5hp on average and 10hp (really 4HP according to Youtuber) peak on the glorious 228HP engine.

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by CincyJohn

And sometimes they are exponential - especially when a tune can take advantage of extra flow into and out of the engine and doesn't care about things like average mpg.

Name two mods that exponentially stack. One of them can't be tune since the tune just extracts the full potential of the mod.

[CincyJohn]

Originally Posted by NoHaveMSG

Name two mods that exponentially stack. One of them can't be tune since the tune just extracts the full potential of the mod.

Sorry, that's exactly what I am talking about. Namely that this mod may be worth more than what that video shows when tuned. In the same vein, existing tests showing that replacing the existing headers with catless headers is useless doesn't mean that the same will be true once tuned.

So what's your threshold value for a hp/tq mod not being worth it?

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by CincyJohn

So what's your threshold value for a hp/tq mod not being worth it?

Pretty high considering I would spend the 10K+ to K swap my car if I didn't have so much other stuff going on.