GruppeM Ram Air System Intake

[OkieSnuffBox]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

No the fact that it is an ineffective part makes it an ineffective part!
Don't give a flying fuck on how people spend their money but let's not pretend it actually gives you anything even measurable in performance.

Posers will pose!

Thanks I hate the "you can't afford it" trope when people point out it's worthless. If people want to buy meaningless bling, more power to them. But just because others don't doesn't mean we can't afford it.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by OkieSnuffBox

Thanks I hate the "you can't afford it" trope when people point out it's worthless. If people want to buy meaningless bling, more power to them. But just because others don't doesn't mean we can't afford it.

Condescending as hell!
The funny part is that the people he is talking to/about are very possibly the same ones that actually CAN afford such things but just know better.

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

I did say "make a difference" not "turns it into a jet fighter". If a direct to intake scoop does so little just how much do people think they are getting out of 4 foot long snorkels?

That is pretty much what I am saying. On a Gen 2 car the difference is going to be negligible during most, if any, driving. And that would be if it was properly designed. There is merit behind the idea, but in practicality the results are not there until you start getting onto the more extreme ends of use. Liter superbikes have been running them for a while too and they seem effective there.

I imagine the maf sensor in that GruppeM intake is like...........

[OkieSnuffBox]

Originally Posted by NoHaveMSG

That is pretty much what I am saying. On a Gen 2 car the difference is going to be negligible during most, if any, driving. And that would be if it was properly designed. There is merit behind the idea, but in practicality the results are not there until you start getting onto the more extreme ends of use. Liter superbikes have been running them for a while too and they seem effective there.

I imagine the maf sensor in that GruppeM intake is like...........

All sport bikes have been using that airbox design for more than 2 decades. Not because it makes some huge difference, but if you look at engine/frame/tank placement, it's literally the shortest/easiest, and realistically only path to get outside air to the airbox.

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by Wrecky_Flowers_

In terms of prevalence, the cost rules out seeing these in every other BRZ/GR86 track car over something less expensive with higher performance. It seems like common sense that, in general, 99.9% of people who buy a $30k car are not in the market for a cold air intake that costs close to 6% of what they paid for their cars. It's even less likely that the people you are referring to (hot boi track rats?) would spend $1700-ish on a moderately-effective intake over, say tires and brake pads. Again, this is just common sense, but I understand that some people need help connecting the dots.

The cost rules out everyone except those with more money than brains. Those are the only dots to connect.

[Lantanafrs2]

What if the damned thing actually works?

[Wrecky_Flowers_]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

No the fact that it is an ineffective part makes it an ineffective part!
Don't give a flying fuck on how people spend their money but let's not pretend it actually gives you anything even measurable in performance.

Posers will pose!

Again, not everything is about horsepower, or performance. You have nothing to indicate that this intake loses power, and Gruppe M actually has a pretty good track record of selling intakes that work and make power on other chassis, although I'm unfamiliar with their previous offerings for this platform. I think judging something based on a price tag and not on an objective understanding of how it works or what it brings to the table is flawed logic, but that's not the point. The point is, this should make a measurable difference in horsepower, and although it is heinously expensive to most people (myself included) it is obviously extremely high quality and thus not geared towards someone like yourself who only cares about max horsepower for minimum coin.

If someone bought this expecting a modest bump in power/response/noise, in addition to just having something really nice in their engine bay to look at, I cannot imagine why that person would be disappointed with their purchase. It's a really nice piece and I'd be thrilled to own one if I had the means, even if it wasn't the highest-performing option on the market.

[Wrecky_Flowers_]

Originally Posted by OkieSnuffBox

Thanks I hate the "you can't afford it" trope when people point out it's worthless. If people want to buy meaningless bling, more power to them. But just because others don't doesn't mean we can't afford it.

I could understand if you told me that you, in particular, have trouble justifying the cost or understanding its worth, but simply labeling something as "worthless" when confronted with a price tag that seems considerably higher than usual is, in my opinion, a sign of ignorance. I am sure everyone replying to this thread could afford one of these intakes, but cannot justify the expenditure. This is totally normal, and to be expected considering how much these cars cost.

However, just because one does not understand something's value does not mean it is worthless. There is an ass for every seat, regardless of whether you understand that or not. Getting philosophical over here, but this type of thinking (DURRRR DIS DUMB JDM PART IS EXPENSIVE F THAT I DONT GET IT THIS SHIT IS WORTHLESS BRUTHERRRR) makes my skin crawl.

[OkieSnuffBox]

Originally Posted by Wrecky_Flowers_

I could understand if you told me that you, in particular, have trouble justifying the cost or understanding its worth, but simply labeling something as "worthless" when confronted with a price tag that seems considerably higher than usual is, in my opinion, a sign of ignorance. I am sure everyone replying to this thread could afford one of these intakes, but cannot justify the expenditure. This is totally normal, and to be expected considering how much these cars cost.

However, just because one does not understand something's value does not mean it is worthless. There is an ass for every seat, regardless of whether you understand that or not. Getting philosophical over here, but this type of thinking (DURRRR DIS DUMB JDM PART IS EXPENSIVE F THAT I DONT GET IT THIS SHIT IS WORTHLESS BRUTHERRRR) makes my skin crawl.

Nah, we literally pointed out to you. One person even went as far as to provide you with a calculation.

You even agreed if people want to buy it just because. I think you're arguing for the sake of arguing.

Until they provide data of the performance improvement, whether it cost $1 or $10,000, it's bling.

[Lantanafrs2]

I like the 5 horse fuses even more.

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by OkieSnuffBox

All sport bikes have been using that airbox design for more than 2 decades. Not because it makes some huge difference, but if you look at engine/frame/tank placement, it's literally the shortest/easiest, and realistically only path to get outside air to the airbox.

Yeah, I know. It was mid 90's I it seemed like they were more actively trying to get the ram effect out of it. I remember being at Yamaha's SE technical facility and they were telling us about how it was worth something like 8hp on the R1 at speed but couldn't be seen on the dyno. I can't remember exactly but I remember it was a high single digit number, that was in 05' I think. The bigger deal was the R6R came out at that time and was one of the first major production bikes with DBW, it had a whole separate control unit that ran the thing.

[Wrecky_Flowers_]

Originally Posted by OkieSnuffBox

Nah, we literally pointed out to you. One person even went as far as to provide you with a calculation.

You even agreed if people want to buy it just because. I think you're arguing for the sake of arguing.

Until they provide data of the performance improvement, whether it cost $1 or $10,000, it's bling.

I saw a random calculation. Very cool. I'm sure it was very applicable.

I don't think anyone is chocking this up to be some kind of miracle part, just a really expensive, really nice, completely unnecessary aftermarket intake.

Again, Gruppe-M makes intakes for a ton of different cars, including Porsche, Ferrari, BMW, Mercedes AMG, etc. A quick google would help you understand that. I bring up the S2000 because that's the world I'm coming from, however in terms of performance/cost the S2000 is pretty comparable in 2022 to a modern BRZ/GR86 - seems like a decent comparison to me. I digress.

I suppose my point is either being ignored or is somehow lost. People spend their money on all kinds of dumb, pointless BS. If this thing is functional by definition, as well as something of quality to appreciate with the hood popped, I don't think it's "worthless" to the right type of person. Some people want to go fast and spend a responsible amount of money on their cars (you, me, 99% of people on this forum). Some people just want really nice stuff, regardless of cost, and are less concerned about the performance benefits of a part like this. Calling something "bling" because it doesn't deliver on your expectations given the price tag is overly simplistic and flawed logic in my opinion.

[OkieSnuffBox]

Originally Posted by NoHaveMSG

Yeah, I know. It was mid 90's I it seemed like they were more actively trying to get the ram effect out of it. I remember being at Yamaha's SE technical facility and they were telling us about how it was worth something like 8hp on the R1 at speed but couldn't be seen on the dyno. I can't remember exactly but I remember it was a high single digit number, that was in 05' I think. The bigger deal was the R6R came out at that time and was one of the first major production bikes with DBW, it had a whole separate control unit that ran the thing.

The really cool thing, I thought, was when they started doing the adjustable velocity stacks. I forgot exactly what year that was.

[OkieSnuffBox]

Originally Posted by Wrecky_Flowers_

I suppose my point is either being ignored or is somehow lost. People spend their money on all kinds of dumb, pointless BS.

Nope, it's not. We've all literally agreed to that multiple times in this thread.

You seem to be arguing that it IS FUNCTIONAL, while the rest of us are saying, If it's functional then they should provide us with the objective data.